The Bad Riders of Ontario Thread

[Brian P]

As a useful method of controlling speed, I was somewhere recently where the municipality had nailed pilons onto the road to shrink lane width by ~1m. That is infinitely more effective than changing the number on the signs.

Caledon and Halton Hills are doing that. They're installing a sign (doesn't matter what it says - sometimes the speed limit, sometimes "SLOW", sometimes a pedestrian symbol) in the middle of the road, on the center line, and aligned with it but on the edge lines, another smaller sign. Of course this has zero effect on the actual physical width of the lane, and if you are aimed correctly down the middle of the lane it presents zero obstruction and you can carry on right through it without slowing down ... but it seems that about 80% of drivers freak out and slow to a crawl.

I know the signs have a flexible rubber mount at the bottom (they'll give way pretty easily when pushed near the top - I checked) but I also know that it's mounted between a couple of hard steel pieces bolted to the pavement, and I wonder what would happen if a bicyclist were forced off their intended course and hit one of them. I also wonder how resistant they are to the fabricated heavy-duty steel bumper of a truck ... or the blade of a snow plow.

let me extend an olive branch for you grannies out there - of course if you're competent and comfortable on your motorcycle you'll be much safer if you still mostly flow with traffic and avoid big groups of cars and speeding

but you should understand a big part of riding sports motorcycles for many is the ability to cut through the herd of retards that jam up highways never passing and tailgating each other

instead of making tiresome posts that essentially amount to "omg won't someone think of the children!?" try to keep that in mind

No.

I am on board with allowing lane-splitting in slow traffic. I'm not on board with extending that to someone blasting up the middle between two vehicles next to each other who are already doing highway speed.

 

[GreyGhost]

I know the signs have a flexible rubber mount at the bottom (they'll give way pretty easily when pushed near the top - I checked) but I also know that it's mounted between a couple of hard steel pieces bolted to the pavement, and I wonder what would happen if a bicyclist were forced off their intended course and hit one of them. I also wonder how resistant they are to the fabricated heavy-duty steel bumper of a truck ... or the blade of a snow plow.

I will be shocked if they are there in the winter. I suspect they are summer only and will pull them before the winter to ease snow clearing.

 

[nm1]

Caledon and Halton Hills are doing that. They're installing a sign (doesn't matter what it says - sometimes the speed limit, sometimes "SLOW", sometimes a pedestrian symbol) in the middle of the road, on the center line, and aligned with it but on the edge lines, another smaller sign. Of course this has zero effect on the actual physical width of the lane, and if you are aimed correctly down the middle of the lane it presents zero obstruction and you can carry on right through it without slowing down ... but it seems that about 80% of drivers freak out and slow to a crawl.

I know the signs have a flexible rubber mount at the bottom (they'll give way pretty easily when pushed near the top - I checked) but I also know that it's mounted between a couple of hard steel pieces bolted to the pavement, and I wonder what would happen if a bicyclist were forced off their intended course and hit one of them. I also wonder how resistant they are to the fabricated heavy-duty steel bumper of a truck ... or the blade of a snow plow.



No.

I am on board with allowing lane-splitting in slow traffic. I'm not on board with extending that to someone blasting up the middle between two vehicles next to each other who are already doing highway speed.

it doesn't matter what you're on-board with - splitting and filtering is already safe as long as the speed difference isn't too high - and neither will be legal in ontario in our lifetimes (grannies out-number thinking people in our small community of riders - in the general populace they VASTLY out-number them)

moving between two cars going 15-20kph faster than they are is neither safe at stopped speeds nor highway speeds - but get that down to about 5-10kph and its safe at both

 

[shanekingsley]

it doesn't matter what you're on-board with - splitting and filtering is already safe as long as the speed difference isn't too high - and neither will be legal in ontario in our lifetimes (grannies out-number thinking people in our small community of riders - in the general populace they VASTLY out-number them)

moving between two cars going 15-20kph faster than they are is neither safe at stopped speeds nor highway speeds - but get that down to about 5-10kph and its safe at both

People said recreational weed would never be legal in my lifetime and here we are. It’s just that we don’t have the same size of interested participants to sway politicians and public opinion. But they did make helmets not mandatory for turban wearing Sikh’s so who knows...

I also agree that the lane splitting can be safe as you describe above, about 5-10km/hr over the speed of other vehicles and with max speed in place, and it were legal and all motorists were taught to expect it. Unfortunately when others aren’t taught to expect it then that opens a bunch of different issues.

I personally wish that filtering and lane splitting were legal with realistic guidelines, although I don’t see it happening for splitting, but maybe filtering.

 

[油井緋色]

You do know that makes zero sense right? The highway/roads aren't racetracks…race school and more importantly, video games, do not teach you how to avoid exploding truck tires, debris in the road, random potholes, cars on the wrong side of the line, and texting drivers in real life. You have also not evolved with 360 degree vision. Pretty sure we have had this conversation multiple times on here with multiple people.

When I had PTSD from a bad high side, I asked my instructor how to get over it because I can't stop hallucinating crashing. He said "if you are thinking about crashing, you will crash." This was after I shut down a track day at mosport rdt because I was a moron, so that was hanging on my head too.

You have ears on a motorcycle to provide another sense; you can literally sense vehicles behind you without mirrors using your ears (we are not allowed mirrors on track.)

Cars make this far easier because you have a mirror. The reason I mentioned those stimulations (except F1 which could be classified as an arcade game) is because if you cannot dodge the moron texting driver that is going to plow through half the track on turn one, then proceed to blame them for tboning or rear ending you, then you won't have a clue of what I am talking about because our skill gap is too far apart. Those potholes, debris, etc. you're talking about? You have no business trying to go through turn 1 at 200km/h if you cannot confidently avoid those. As for exploding truck tires and ****, I've had a chain fly at me at Shannonville; if the reaper wants to kill me, I'm gonna die. I didn't that day and there was NOTHING I could have done if that chain flew through my chest. So don't ******* think about those scenarios.

Also it's worth noting that iRacing is used by multiple F1 drivers to practice. The fact that you and @FullMotoJacket were laughing at the suggestions confused me. Why were you laughing at your own ignorance?

Anyway, it would take a literal essay to explain so let's just end it with this: you're both slower than me and have had more accidents involving other vehicles. I've had zero involve another vehicle. We could count my virtual accidents though if you want; I'd have a lot more than both of you combined.

...I'm still finding it hard to believe it's 2021 and there are still people who don't realize how far simulations have gone. Guess you guys think we're still using controllers or flimsy arcade cabinets.

EDIT: The **** below isn't to convince anyone except those who are interested for why race techniques help on the street. If you do not know where the limits are, and limits as in what you can do on your vehicle, then when you accidently get put in a scenario where those limits are tested you are more than likely ******.

Threshold braking without ABS, for example, will result in a loop and a hospital trip if a car cuts you off and you panic jam the breaks. Another common mistake is dropping the throttle, because your instincts will tell you to, when you rear slips. Do this with an unholy lean angle and torque and you will find yourself thrown off the bike. There are many other examples and why I'm obsessed with gitting gud even though I don't ride anymore: I do not want my skills to complete degrade when I get back...even if it's on a fat ass cruiser.

 

[油井緋色]

it doesn't matter what you're on-board with - splitting and filtering is already safe as long as the speed difference isn't too high - and neither will be legal in ontario in our lifetimes (grannies out-number thinking people in our small community of riders - in the general populace they VASTLY out-number them)

moving between two cars going 15-20kph faster than they are is neither safe at stopped speeds nor highway speeds - but get that down to about 5-10kph and its safe at both

I don't think filtering is safe simply because you have no escape route and drivers are ******* morons or malicious.

I filtered down a very long stretch of cars years ago during a red. Somebody opened their door. I did my first micro endo accidently. Doesn't matter if he was stupid or malicious, I'd have been at fault.

Now if we talking splitting through a car or two, including at highway speeds, that's more safe imo. You can get in and out within a few seconds versus the filtering scenario above where you literally have no way out for too long.

 

[Deleted member 50930]

It is way too easy to get a Ontario driving license and motorcycle license here... Add legal lane filtering into the mix and things will get fugly

 

[油井緋色]

Always gotta stick that little veiled racist nugget in there.

When you've spent your entire life thinking differently, along with having a different cultural background, you start to compare the differences and generalize things in order to make sense of why. We do have massive cultural differences. Pointing them out and talking about it isn't racism, you uncultured swine.

...I've always wanted to call someone an uncultured swine but there was never a correct context, thank you lol

 

[Jampy00]

While I'll admit I am not an expert on lane filtering or lane splitting as I have never done either.
My thought would be this. If allowed to be done, in the short term we would have a number of altercations from drivers blocking the lane(s) either unintentionally or with the sole purpose to ensure the rider can't get ahead of them. From my limited knowledge lane filtering / splitting seems to work best in area's where motorcycles are present all year long, this way it becomes a "learned" part of the driving / riding experience.
As it stands I already get too many close calls from aggressive drivers.

 

[Maniac]

When you've spent your entire life thinking differently, along with having a different cultural background, you start to compare the differences and generalize things in order to make sense of why. We do have massive cultural differences. Pointing them out and talking about it isn't racism, you uncultured swine.

...I've always wanted to call someone an uncultured swine but there was never a correct context, thank you lol

In my culture people who call other people "uncultured swine" get a kick in the face without further discussions.

 

[Evoex]

While I'll admit I am not an expert on lane filtering or lane splitting as I have never done either.
My thought would be this. If allowed to be done, in the short term we would have a number of altercations from drivers blocking the lane(s) either unintentionally or with the sole purpose to ensure the rider can't get ahead of them. From my limited knowledge lane filtering / splitting seems to work best in area's where motorcycles are present all year long, this way it becomes a "learned" part of the driving / riding experience.
As it stands I already get too many close calls from aggressive drivers.

Any decent legislation would make those attempts illegal.

Im all for either or both but the general populace can’t tolerate not waiting for a light cycle and blowing a red, they wouldn’t handle a bike moving to the front.

 

[油井緋色]

In my culture people who call other people "uncultured swine" get a kick in the face without further discussions.

Fight fire with fire.

I grew up subjected to the bully tactics attempted on page 2-3. I learned they shut up by punching them in the face as a kid.

Can't punch somebody out online or at our age. No disrespect meant to anyone else.

 

[Jampy00]

Any decent legislation would make those attempts illegal.

I totally agree, but that would do little to stop foolish behavior that could result in some serious injuries. Either from a collision or an altercation.
This could result in traffic becoming 100% blocked and disallowing everything that lane filtering/splitting is supposed to help eliminate.
For some reason, I just don't see it working well in the GTA or in any place where riding is for the most part seasonal.

 

[油井緋色]

I totally agree, but that would do little to stop foolish behavior that could result in some serious injuries. Either from a collision or an altercation.
This could result in traffic becoming 100% blocked and disallowing everything that lane filtering/splitting is supposed to help eliminate.
For some reason, I just don't see it working well in the GTA or in any place where riding is for the most part seasonal.

Skill floor needs to be raised for this to be considered imo.

It's a race between us getting better vs robots. My money is on robots because it's cheaper and most people do not give two ***** about learning how to ride/drive well. It's a tool for them, not a sport sadly.

 

[Jampy00]

Skill floor needs to be raised for this to be considered imo.

It's a race between us getting better vs robots. My money is on robots because it's cheaper and most people do not give two ***** about learning how to ride/drive well. It's a tool for them, not a sport sadly.

If any government was really serious about road safety, traffic, accidents, tickets, etc. Self driving vehicles would have started development decades ago (with government funding) as well as better city and urban planning for more public and pedestrian traffic. I find it odd that millions can be spent on combat drones to save a soldiers life, yet millions die on the roads every year due to neglect, weak infrastructures, corruption and poorly trained drivers.

Just my 2 cents..

 

[GreyGhost]

it doesn't matter what you're on-board with - splitting and filtering is already safe as long as the speed difference isn't too high - and neither will be legal in ontario in our lifetimes (grannies out-number thinking people in our small community of riders - in the general populace they VASTLY out-number them)

moving between two cars going 15-20kph faster than they are is neither safe at stopped speeds nor highway speeds - but get that down to about 5-10kph and its safe at both

Giant hole in your logic. If (in Ontario, when) you get bumped while moving between vehicles, if you are going 10 kph, you fall over and are probably uninjured. If you are going 110 when you get knocked off, you tumble down the road and hope everyone approaching you at 100 misses you. Odds are not in your favour at all.

 

[Jampy00]

Giant hole in your logic. If (in Ontario, when) you get bumped while moving between vehicles, if you are going 10 kph, you fall over and are probably uninjured. If you are going 110 when you get knocked off, you tumble down the road and hope everyone approaching you at 100 misses you. Odds are not in your favour at all.

Why you got to be a granny?

 

[GreyGhost]

Why you got to be a granny?

I didn't say dont split, I said his argument sucked.

 

[iblastoff]

Man all of you are granny sissies who can’t drive.
Even if you do get in an accident, you just respawn anyway. I also get away from cops like 90% of the time if I do get caught breaking some road law. Haven’t any of you played grand theft auto??


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[油井緋色]

If any government was really serious about road safety, traffic, accidents, tickets, etc. Self driving vehicles would have started development decades ago (with government funding) as well as better city and urban planning for more public and pedestrian traffic. I find it odd that millions can be spent on combat drones to save a soldiers life, yet millions die on the roads every year due to neglect, weak infrastructures, corruption and poorly trained drivers.

Just my 2 cents..

It's not that simple.

I've written a paper on VANETs before and have done AI development. Governments around the world have been fighting over the implementation of vehicular adhoc networks (VANETs.) The biggest issue we have with AI driving is that each car is operating independently or at best within a closed information loop (say all Tesla's with Tesla's info, or similarly to Google Maps sharing other Google user information for routing) so blindspots can happen. Creating a network on the literal road will remove any blindspots in terms of information.

Another huge reason why we're moving so slow on AI replacing human drivers is the economical implications when a bunch of ppl lose their jobs. It is undoubtly safer, however, that AI on a fully integrated network would drive far better than the **** show we have now. If a crash happens, we can go through variables for exactly why the AI failed, and adjust it.

Giant hole in your logic. If (in Ontario, when) you get bumped while moving between vehicles, if you are going 10 kph, you fall over and are probably uninjured. If you are going 110 when you get knocked off, you tumble down the road and hope everyone approaching you at 100 misses you. Odds are not in your favour at all.

Just plan where you're gonna do stupid **** imo. The only serious tumble I had at public roads was over err...some speed...where I slid into the barrier and completely my fault for riding emotionally loaded. Still, planned safe spot to do stupid **** so you don't get hit by cars or murder somebody else lol