Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.....

Who was in the wrong?

  • Cop

    Votes: 23 20.7%

  • Dude who got shot

    Votes: 33 29.7%

  • I like turtles

    Votes: 55 49.5%
  • Total voters
    111
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

At least he changed his mind after thinking about it, and hopefully this speeding cop gets what's coming to him.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

The fact that she works at an RCMP detachment is completely irrelevant to the story. If you risk your life to save someone in your free time does that reflect well on your employer?
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

This is an excellent video article on the nature of modern Canadian police and accountability.

[video=youtube;-7aHzgTcG6g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7aHzgTcG6g[/video]
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Still crying about the G20?

Next one is in Mexico, those protesters will be crying for a Canadian type G20 over whats going to happen to them
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

So we're to settle for no transparency, no governance and no rule of law, because... why, exactly? Because the "we gotta support the police?" meme that gets replayed constantly? Because "we don't know how good we've got it" means that we should just let it degrade?

This kind of thinking is idiotic. I can't put it any less extreme.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Graves said:
Still crying about the G20?

Next one is in Mexico, those protesters will be crying for a Canadian type G20 over whats going to happen to them
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The G20 is something that should be ******* and moaned about, and never happen again. It was the result of inadequate planning by the Federal government and inadequate time provided, for planning, to the Provincial and Civic governments. It resulted in extremes; inadequate police action, excessive police action, and rampant illegal activities by civilian agitators and some number of police officers.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" - George Santayana
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/tasered-for-not-showing-his-ticket-20120630-219m3.html

Seems like the cops are acting like criminals everywhere.

It was the result of inadequate planning by the Federal government and inadequate time provided, for planning, to the Provincial and Civic governments.
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I disagree. It all went down just like the planners had envisioned, in my opinion. And so is the response... if we don't collectively make them pay for their crimes, the police will move the goalposts a little further and increasingly bring totalitarian brutality into our lives. Having met some of the stuffed shirts making the rules (like Fantino) in person, I realise completely that their way is to rule with the stick, not the carrot.
 
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Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Shaman said:
I disagree. It all went down just like the planners had envisioned, in my opinion. And so is the response... if we don't collectively make them pay for their crimes, the police will move the goalposts a little further and increasingly bring totalitarian brutality into our lives. Having met some of the stuffed shirts making the rules (like Fantino) in person, I realise completely that their way is to rule with the stick, not the carrot.
Click to expand...

It was an event that needed a couple of years worth of security planning that got a few months security planning, as the result of Federal government idiocy. Responsibilities were not clearly defined. Jurisdictions weren't properly laid out. Things were bound to go wrong.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Rob MacLennan said:
It was an event that needed a couple of years worth of security planning that got a few months security planning, as the result of Federal government idiocy. Responsibilities were not clearly defined. Jurisdictions weren't properly laid out. Things were bound to go wrong.
Click to expand...

What you're saying (though I don't agree with it) still doesn't invalidate my points.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Rob MacLennan said:
It was an event that needed a couple of years worth of security planning that got a few months security planning, as the result of Federal government idiocy. Responsibilities were not clearly defined. Jurisdictions weren't properly laid out. Things were bound to go wrong.
Click to expand...

Rob MacLennan said:
Actually, I believe that it does.
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actually, no. i agree with shaman on this one.

the final words in your own post supports what shaman has been writing. things WERE bound to go wrong, when you purposely choose a site like downtown toronto, and then not leave yourself enough time to do it properly. you have to think that somewhere along the line someone said, "downtown toronto? with how much lead time? what, are you nuts?" and that those people were talked down.

there is no way that a strategic plan to host the g20 in the downtown core would have failed to note the past histories in other urban centres, made a comparison between our infrastructure and theirs (in regards to use of non-police elements, potential for damage, etc.) and concluded that more time than was available was necessary. thus, when the decision to push ahead was made, it was almost certainly made with the calculated understanding that the 'system' would have to be 'flexed' to make it work.

the feds for sure, said to the tps, could you do it? i'm sure the response was something like, 'nothing is impossible', but we're going to need. . .and a huge laundry list totalling over $1b in new toys and equipment with a ridiculous # of additional officers culled from around the country was drawn up. harper licked his lips as soon as he heard 'possible', and the cost to the taxpayers and our charter rights be damned.

taxpayers are apparently used to the wasteful ways of harper's government, but they should never accept the wholesale violations of our charter rights that took place.

accepting those violations means we recognize the incompetence of the harper government in pushing for the g20 to be located in toronto when they knew what that would entail. if we don't believe they are incompetent, then we suddenly have to accept the idea that shaman has been suggesting, which is that these decisions were done knowingly and with a strong understanding of what consequences would devolve in regards to our rights, and the 'flexing' of our system.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence." - Hanlon's Razor

The implication was that things went as planned, including the abridging of rights. This is not the case. No, it should never be accepted, but to claim that it was the plan all along is foolish in the extreme.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

It's not foolish at all, when you think of the big picture: if you are the police and you want to "educate" the people to give up their rights and make them feel inadequate to the tasks of bucking authority, what do you do? You shake them down in every airport, you make it mandatory to produce your identity papers, you beat them down when they protest.

It *is* the plan, and if you don't believe it, read the reports from police heads prior to the event when they met in B.C. and discussed the matter of expanding enforcement powers. There were two scathing articles I read prior to the G20 that talked about how the chiefs of police across Canada had met and the matter of discussion was how "uppity" the populace is, and methods by which they could curtail demands for freedom, privacy and justice.

How do you like the idea that Canadian police chiefs meet up with U.S. police chiefs regularly?

https://www.majorcitieschiefs.com/about.php

So yeah, they got what they wanted. Regarding the G20, "law enforcement's" reaction has been to lie to the public, to defuse any dissent by claiming that the protesters were all criminals, and they've obfiscated the chain of command to make it more difficult to get justice. All the while warning that they will "do what they need to do" the next time.
 
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Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Rob MacLennan said:
"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence." - Hanlon's Razor

The implication was that things went as planned, including the abridging of rights. This is not the case. No, it should never be accepted, but to claim that it was the plan all along is foolish in the extreme.
Click to expand...

so you think this was all complete incompetence on the part of the feds and the police services that enabled harper to have his g20 in toronto?

wow, you really don't think much of either group then.

as for me, i'm not buying that. they most certainly did strategic planning that factored in past g20 violence, requirements for an urban location like downtown toronto, availability of non-police resources (read: army) and existing infrastructure, threat assessments, and contingency planning for a variety of scenarios. what tps probably came back to them with was: give us X dollars, X number of boots on the ground, and X emergency laws and i'll give you a high probability of control over this hare-brained idea.

90+ officers removing their police identification badges is a consequence of the wrong mentality from the top down. it is not happenstance or incompetency. those officers may have been cowboys from the get-go, but they clearly were given at least a tacit green light from above, especially given the widespread charter violations happening as a result of 'emergency' laws.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

No, I don't think very highly of either group

Ninety. Out of nineteen THOUSAND. Yes, they were cowboys, but look at the percentages.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Rob MacLennan said:
No, I don't think very highly of either group

Ninety. Out of nineteen THOUSAND. Yes, they were cowboys, but look at the percentages.
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90+ who openly broke the law

plus

1000s that violated the charter rights of 1000+ citizens specifically, and all of us generally, on that weekend.

the math is not good.

case in point--on the issue of kettling alone, hundreds if not thousands of cops were complicit in the violation of hundreds of citizens' charter rights at novotel and at spadina and queen. . .

who exactly were they serving and protecting in those two situations?

will be very interested to see where the class action suits go, if they are certified.
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

[video=youtube;MST4RhWdlMQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MST4RhWdlMQ[/video]
 
Re: Flash of a Badge...?

Shaman said:
[video=youtube;MST4RhWdlMQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MST4RhWdlMQ[/video]
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Shocking as that is....we're not in the US, plus recent events have shown just how looney tunes some of their news events are. You might as well post up Columbian police stories or go back a few years and post the stories of Chilean police "disappearing" people off the streets.

I honestly think that there's quite a few citizens, police and military in the US that would wish they were back in a frontier environment, wrangling horses and shooting "furreners". The number of friendly fire casualties in any of the conflicts the US has played with has been astounding. The "shoot first" ask questions later mentality seems to be rife.
 
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