Yet another shooting in the USA - 2 | Page 2 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Yet another shooting in the USA - 2

The States have had a secret mantra since the day of Columbus when they first arrived to rape and pillage the land and the people....sadly rappers have stolen this secret mantra.

'live by the gun, die by the gun'

End of discussion.
 
OpenGambit said:
.....lol
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His syntax needs a little tweak but he seems to be right. It sounds like the gunman killed one person, and the cops did the rest.

I'll reserve judgement till later, but Im fairly sure that questions about officer training will rightfully arise.
 
mmmnaked said:
His syntax needs a little tweak but he seems to be right. It sounds like the gunman killed one person, and the cops did the rest.

I'll reserve judgement till later, but Im fairly sure that questions about officer training will rightfully arise.
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Time to ban cops. You know what they say, "if it just saves one life..."
 
again....news are sansationalizing everything gun related. LEO are in a frenzy, some justified, some not. Am i saying that the cops shouldnt have done something? absolutely not....but with all the media frenzy lately, cops are on edge. A cooler head that wasnt in panic mode maybe, just maybe wouldnt have tried to stop the perp while the background was full of bystanders...

The two officers and Mr. Johnson were about eight feet apart.

One law enforcement official said that based on the preliminary investigation, it appears that most or all of the bystanders were struck by one of the 16 police bullets – or fragments or ricochets from those rounds – that were fired by the two officers who confronted Mr. Johnson.

Detectives believe that Mr. Johnson had fired five shots at Mr. Ercolino and may have fired one shot at the police officers, the official said. There were two bullets left in the eight-round magazine of his gun so only one shot – the one apparently fired at the officers -- could have possibly hit one of the nine bystanders, the official said.

One of the officers fired nine times and the other seven times.
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Red_Liner740 said:
again....news are sansationalizing everything gun related. LEO are in a frenzy, some justified, some not. Am i saying that the cops shouldnt have done something? absolutely not....but with all the media frenzy lately, cops are on edge. A cooler head that wasnt in panic mode maybe, just maybe wouldnt have tried to stop the perp while the background was full of bystanders...
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Has anybody here ever been shot at? Cuz there's a lot of big talk going on..
 
So......trained police carrying weapons fired back and caused other civilian casualties and a few people here think that civilians carrying could have done better? Interesting.
 
Here's a fact: most cops don't train NEARLY enough with their firearms. The qualification parameters and frequency are a joke.

If this kind of story isn't a kick in the *** for law enforcement I don't know what is. I bet you those cops don't shoot more than 1 or 2 hundred rounds per year.. and we're supposed to trust them with our lives?

8 feet away, 16 bullets and tons of bystanders getting shot? That's a bloody disgrace.. its pathetic. I've shot with cops many times, even participated in a private training session a few times... some of the stuff I saw was plain scary.
 
jc100 said:
So......trained police carrying weapons fired back and caused other civilian casualties and a few people here think that civilians carrying could have done better? Interesting.
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Clearly the solution is to ban cops from carrying guns. I mean look at all the hurt their guns caused in this scenario?
"If it saves just one life"
 
mmmnaked said:
Here's a fact: most cops don't train NEARLY enough with their firearms. The qualification parameters and frequency are a joke.

If this kind of story isn't a kick in the *** for law enforcement I don't know what is. I bet you those cops don't shoot more than 1 or 2 hundred rounds per year.. and we're supposed to trust them with our lives?

8 feet away, 16 bullets and tons of bystanders getting shot? That's a bloody disgrace.. its pathetic. I've shot with cops many times, even participated in a private training session a few times... some of the stuff I saw was plain scary.
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Thats pretty sad however ive heard this many times from many different people. Every trip to the range i shoot on average 500 rounds+, you'd think someone who's job involves carrying and using a gun would train a little more.
 
Paul1000RR said:
Clearly the solution is to ban cops from carrying guns. I mean look at all the hurt their guns caused in this scenario?
"If it saves just one life"
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I never said that....what I did say though is that you assume civilians carrying that only shoot on a range and do not spend day to day situations under the threat of violence would do a better job.
 
mmmnaked said:
Here's a fact: most cops don't train NEARLY enough with their firearms. The qualification parameters and frequency are a joke.

If this kind of story isn't a kick in the *** for law enforcement I don't know what is. I bet you those cops don't shoot more than 1 or 2 hundred rounds per year.. and we're supposed to trust them with our lives?

8 feet away, 16 bullets and tons of bystanders getting shot? That's a bloody disgrace.. its pathetic. I've shot with cops many times, even participated in a private training session a few times... some of the stuff I saw was plain scary.
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I guess your not aware that most police officers go there entire career without ever having to shoot someone. This is what the SWAT is for to be honest. Wouldn't be much different then a Lamborghini showing up at your local mechanic and asking to get the engine replaced. Yea, mechanic might know the basics, but he's nervous, scared, and is prone to make mistakes.

Just because your a police officer, doesn't make you an automatic gun enthusiast. They can go to the range whenever they want, doesn't mean they have to do it every single weekend. I'm an amateur shooter myself, but I found it funny when I went with a few friends that just finished basic in the Military, and I was out shooting them. I guess they should just quit and find new jobs.
 
Red_Liner740 said:
what mass shootings? Did you READ the article??
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Relax. When I was posting the rest of the story hadn't made the papers yet.

For the record, I do agree with your point in terms of the media sensationalizing current gun violence.
 
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Dr.Manhattan said:
I guess your not aware that most police officers go there entire career without ever having to shoot someone. This is what the SWAT is for to be honest. Wouldn't be much different then a Lamborghini showing up at your local mechanic and asking to get the engine replaced. Yea, mechanic might know the basics, but he's nervous, scared, and is prone to make mistakes.

Just because your a police officer, doesn't make you an automatic gun enthusiast. They can go to the range whenever they want, doesn't mean they have to do it every single weekend. I'm an amateur shooter myself, but I found it funny when I went with a few friends that just finished basic in the Military, and I was out shooting them. I guess they should just quit and find new jobs.
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What kinda defeatist crap is that?

SWAT/ETF is for planned confrontations. Regular LEOs are almost always the first responders.

Teach cops how to use guns better!!!! Almost EVERY cop shooting in the news follows the same formula... 37 shots, 2 hits. Get their ***** to a range, increase requalification requirements.

Im well trained but I dont get to carry... So they better damn well take up that slack.
 
Dr.Manhattan said:
I found it funny when I went with a few friends that just finished basic in the Military, and I was out shooting them. I guess they should just quit and find new jobs.
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I just put 40 candidates through C7 range for their second time. Out of them, four had shot prior to joining. None of them have any idea how to shoot urban combat rifle and have yet to fire pistols. They just know how to go prone and shoot @ 100M and 200M targets. Marksmanship isn't something you come out the other side of basic with.

Unless you never shot before that day it's not surprising really....

The individual has to take it upon themselves to practice or they can't be good at it.

I think they need to take another look at their "empty your firearm until the threat is down" approach. Cops are told to keep firing even after a fatal hit is sometimes scored. They should fire no more than 3 rounds in any situation where they decide they can hit. If it's a matter of stopping power they could move to 10mm.
 
mmmnaked said:
What kinda defeatist crap is that?

SWAT/ETF is for planned confrontations. Regular LEOs are almost always the first responders.

Teach cops how to use guns better!!!! Almost EVERY cop shooting in the news follows the same formula... 37 shots, 2 hits. Get their ***** to a range, increase requalification requirements.

Im well trained but I dont get to carry... So they better damn well take up that slack.
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Pffff who's gonna be out there writing tickets??

Sent from my phone using my paws
 
silvrsurfr said:
'live by the gun, die by the gun'
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Indeed, but when decent people are rendered unarmed and defenseless with gun control laws, it changes to "live by the gun, prosper in safety by the gun".

Self defensive use of a gun is not "living by the gun". How do you think those living by the gun, die by the gun?
 
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CruisnGrrl said:
Cops in the uk manage to do it with out guns. :)

More training is required, not just on marksmanship but on effective use of the pistol. After a certain range it becomes about luck and a different firearm is required
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Seems some beg to differ.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/nov/21/ukguns.immigrationpolicy

Sounds like the UK is A very violent place.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ry-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html

Disarming only makes things easier, safer and more profitable for violent criminals.
 
D23 said:
I think they need to take another look at their "empty your firearm until the threat is down" approach. Cops are told to keep firing even after a fatal hit is sometimes scored. They should fire no more than 3 rounds in any situation where they decide they can hit.
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They're told to fire (once the determination of the threat of serious bodily harm or death is made) until the threat stops. A kill shot that could stop the shooter could be rendered early on but that kill is by way of bleeding out, which is not instant. A determined or drugged up (or both) shooter could still cause a lot of damage in the time it takes to bleed out and stop. That said, the "American unload" is not the way to do it, rather accurate, continued shots until the threat is stopped (keeping in mind the adrenaline, fear, movement, speed, etc... of the developing situation).

CruisnGrrl said:
Cops in the uk manage to do it with out guns. :)
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The UK has guns on the street, just not on the hips of the Bobbies. They employ lower profile units (Firearms Units) that are deployed to patrol and respond when and where needed but they won't do the calls for service or general policing that you'll see on the streets.
 
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