Whitby Accident Victim Identified

[arent_we_sarcastic]

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Corrected...

My personal thoughts...

I think the cop seen a bike speeding a bit and decided to pull him over. The rider made a stupid decision and took off.
The officer chased.
The officer wants this biker really bad because he hasn't made his quota for this month and engages in aggressively chasing.
Chased him at speeds the officer isn't trained to chase, risking everyone on the road...but he is going to get this biker at any cost.
Thought he could make the motorcycle crash to stop...but instead only made the innocent passenger fall off and ran over her.

I am mad and upset at the rider who bailed on his passenger, but I am equally upset at the cop for being such a hunter that he was driving so close to run over her when she did fall off.

I suspect the cop played an even larger role in 'why' she fell off. I don't believe it was a 'sudden' lane change. If the rider was experienced enough to throw his bike into a corner and scrap his pegs, he would have got away...and I know from riding with passengers that I can get pretty close to scraping my pegs without them feeling like they are going to fall off.

If it was from 'accelerating', then how could the cop be so close behind that he hit her? The bike would have been gone already.

So now someone is dead because two people made stupid decisions.

 

[V-Tom]

I just don't understand one thing.. It's a fact that the rider ran from the cop while transporting a passenger. Why are people here speculating on possible police wrongdoing? Everybody here knows that I do not hesitate to jump on a cop when it's pretty obvious that he did something wrong, but what's happening here really approaches the tinfoil hat realm.

Actually, the facts have not been established. All we have to go on so far is what was reported by the police and what was reported by a witness, and there are parts in the reporting of both stories that appear to conflict.

What if the rider was being pursued by someone that was trying to kill him? Perhaps he was being shot at or someone was trying to run him off the road?What if that vehicle was a police vehicle? What if he was rammed by the police vehicle and that is what knocked off the passenger?

Would you stop in that case?

I doubt that any of this is the case, but if the rider thought it to be true then I could see him not stopping and also being reluctant to turn himself over to police.

My only point is that until we know what has actually happened we should hold off on speculation until the facts are out and established.

..Tom

 

[backmarkerducati]

I just don't understand one thing.. It's a fact that the rider ran from the cop while transporting a passenger. Why are people here speculating on possible police wrongdoing? Everybody here knows that I do not hesitate to jump on a cop when it's pretty obvious that he did something wrong, but what's happening here really approaches the tinfoil hat realm.

I agree, we have little to no information one way or another what actually went down.

Given where the "chase" started and where she fell off I would actually be surprised if the cop was even near the bike when it happened, but of course we don't know so maybe he was... In the end we just don't know.

The entire point of the SIU is to be independent. They have done little in the past for me to believe otherwise, so we will get to the bottom of this.

There is one fact that we cannot ignore, the rider is responsible for their actions and responsible for the safety of their passenger.

 

[DRZSMDUDE]

I am talking about an initial appearance. You cannot be held in custody for longer than 24 hours without being put in front of a justice, at which time means you are formally charged.

If I recall correctly ( and I may not be ) the AG was arrested and charged quite quickly.

Umm no he wasn't. and he didn't get to see a judge within 24hrs, he was released and charged on a later date if I remember correctly. I know it's the law but for some reason it didn't apply to him. Like I said it's all about who you know and what your lawyer does...there could be a publication ban...

it's just so weird they haven't released any description of the bike or rider or any details for that matter. I really hope the driver is caught if he's not already...I couldn't live with myself if I was in his shoes!

D

 

[joy]

if the cop actually did hit the rider, wouldnt you think that there would be evidence on the cruiser? I just think we'd know it by now if that's what happened cause it'd have to be obvious. If you hit a person hard enough to kill them, your car isnt going to be spotless?

just a thought

 

[rutakin]

REHASH REHASH

another 60 pages before this one gets closed...

 

[RetroGrouch]

Seems to me like investigators don't have any solid leads. Maybe now it's up to someone to rat out fugitive biker. I'm hoping he has altered his routine and behaviour and is noticed by people acquainted with him. If he's known to ride his bike on a regular basis and all of a sudden stops riding, that could be a sign. If he attends bike meets or group rides regularly but no longer shows up, that could be a sign. Obviously not hard evidence but at least it's something to go on. But then he could still be out riding like nothing ever happened. Hiding in plain sight can be very effective but that would take a lot of guts.

So my question is, if you suspected your friend may be the fugitive biker, would you turn him in? If yes, would you remain anonymous or let him know it was you? If he confessed to you in confidence, would you rat him out?

 

[FiReSTaRT]

What if the rider was being pursued by someone that was trying to kill him? Perhaps he was being shot at or someone was trying to run him off the road?What if that vehicle was a police vehicle? What if he was rammed by the police vehicle and that is what knocked off the passenger?

That's already moving into the tinfoil hat realm. Since it's been established that there were other cars on the road (like the ones who ran over the passenger), it's pretty safe to make the initial assumption that a bystander would have noticed a cop with his cherries on firing into highway traffic or trying to ram another vehicle and run to the media to get their 5min.

My only point is that until we know what has actually happened we should hold off on speculation until the facts are out and established.

That is a good point

 

[gwelfmike]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

Yes and anything that happens to him is the responsibility of the rider who choose to run.

The responsible thing would have been for the rider to stop, regardless of having a passanger on or not, how could you come to the conclusion that not having a passanger on and running is a responsible thing to do?

If the driver hit a pedistrian and killed the pedistrian, what good is the "responsible" driver to the dead pedistrian?

 

[FiReSTaRT]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

The responsible thing would have been for the rider to stop, regardless of having a passanger on or not, how could you come to the conclusion that not having a passanger on and running is a responsible thing to do?

If the driver hit a pedistrian and killed the pedistrian, what good is the "responsible" driver to the dead pedistrian?

In 14 years of driving, I've never seen a pedestrian crossing a 400-series highway and I even painted nice lines and put up a sign for a crossover

 

[KJM]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

In 14 years of driving, I've never seen a pedestrian crossing a 400-series highway and I even painted nice lines and put up a sign for a crossover

I've crossed one in my misguided youth.

 

[Moreno636]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

The responsible thing would have been for the rider to stop, regardless of having a passanger on or not, how could you come to the conclusion that not having a passanger on and running is a responsible thing to do?

If the driver hit a pedistrian and killed the pedistrian, what good is the "responsible" driver to the dead pedistrian?

Unfortunately the new HTA laws of this province have made that choice a difficult one. I never said running without a passenger is a responsible one, I said there is a difference. One being that the passenger doesnt have a choice in what the riders does. The other the rider is solely RESPONSIBLE for his actions.

 

[FiReSTaRT]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

I've crossed one in my misguided youth.

And how many times have you crossed a city street? In Ontario it's illegal and highly uncommon for people to cross expressways or even to walk alongside of them.

 

[Moreno636]

Seems to me like investigators don't have any solid leads. Maybe now it's up to someone to rat out fugitive biker. I'm hoping he has altered his routine and behaviour and is noticed by people acquainted with him. If he's known to ride his bike on a regular basis and all of a sudden stops riding, that could be a sign. If he attends bike meets or group rides regularly but no longer shows up, that could be a sign. Obviously not hard evidence but at least it's something to go on. But then he could still be out riding like nothing ever happened. Hiding in plain sight can be very effective but that would take a lot of guts.

So my question is, if you suspected your friend may be the fugitive biker, would you turn him in? If yes, would you remain anonymous or let him know it was you? If he confessed to you in confidence, would you rat him out?

Absolutely. I couldn't have that on my conscience.

 

[SiNNeR]

Absolutely. I couldn't have that on my conscience.

+1

where not talking about mail fraud..

there is a dead human involved here....

 

[KJM]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

And how many times have you crossed a city street? In Ontario it's illegal and highly uncommon for people to cross expressways or even to walk alongside of them.

That's why I said misguided. I knew then and know now that it's illegal and uncommon, but it does happen.

 

[meme]

In a heartbeat Retro

 

[FiReSTaRT]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

That's why I said misguided. I knew then and know now that it's illegal and uncommon, but it does happen.

Car doors open and children fall out of cars. Maybe we should have universal speed limits set to 10km/h everywhere

 

[KJM]

Re: Whitby Victim name released, SIU investigates.

Car doors open and children fall out of cars. Maybe we should have universal speed limits set to 10km/h everywhere

That will do nothing to prevent people from crossing 400 series highways which is both illegal and uncommon.

 

[samakaflash]

In 14 years of driving, I've never seen a pedestrian crossing a 400-series highway and I even painted nice lines and put up a sign for a crossover

I saw a plane load of people one time on the 401

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