Terrorist attack in the factory in Saint-Quentin-Fallavier

Christians did a lot of killing during the crusades but that was a long time ago. They went trhough the dark ages and realized to seperate the lunacy of religion from state.

Islam however hasnt caught on yet. Its the crusaders of our times! So while not all Muslism are eveil, Islam is evil as stated before (and so is Christianity but Christianity is irrelevant is our times)

Ever lived in a Islamic country where Muslims have power while you try to believe in something other than what they believe in? Its an open air prison until it turn into a fully enclosed prison.

They have zero tolerence for any other thought or belief when they have the power to enforce their dogma.

The only reason you dont see them forcing their ways here in Canada is because they don have political power. Even then, in places like the UK, they want to force their believe with VIOLENCE in a country they were welcomes to!!! WTF, religion of peace indeed!

Take a look for yourself

[video=youtube;zqNYjxImCko]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqNYjxImCko[/video]
 
The truth is that this is a very complicated issue and no one in this thread from either side can really pin point it to the cause, No Islam is not evil and neither is Christianity, People are evil and use misinterpreted written verbiage to excuse their evil ways and push more susceptible people into doing their work.

Why are those more susceptible people easier to manipulate? the reasons range from economical to geographical reasons. Stop arguing about this damn topic, none of you are right and neither am I.
 
ZX600 said:
The truth is that this is a very complicated issue and no one in this thread from either side can really pin point it to the cause, No Islam is not evil and neither is Christianity, People are evil and use misinterpreted written verbiage to excuse their evil ways and push more susceptible people into doing their work.

Why are those more susceptible people easier to manipulate? the reasons range from economical to geographical reasons. Stop arguing about this damn topic, none of you are right and neither am I.
Click to expand...

Have you read the Quran? I have. It literally (no interpretation) says you can beat your wife IN QURAN. It also orders Muslism to wge war on enemies of Allah and to eliminate them. Again, direct text not a vague interretation by some random imam.

I dont know what is your definition of evil but thats pretty evil to me.

So no, its not just people misusing religion. Its religion ad its very core teachings that people follow.

Also,
[h=1]“With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.”[/h]
― Steven Weinberg
 
ashkan said:
They have zero tolerence for any other thought or belief when they have the power to enforce their dogma.

The only reason you dont see them forcing their ways here in Canada is because they don have political power. Even then, in places like the UK, they want to force their believe with VIOLENCE in a country they were welcomes to!!! WTF, religion of peace indeed!

Take a look for yourself
Click to expand...

haha, they always do that **** in numbers. Especially in that video, it's him and his butt buddy intimidating people. And even if they were by themselves doing that, I'd be willing to wager they have weapons on them.

Bunch o' cowards.
 
Boots said:
haha, they always do that **** in numbers. Especially in that video, it's him and his butt buddy intimidating people. And even if they were by themselves doing that, I'd be willing to wager they have weapons on them.

Bunch o' cowards.
Click to expand...

i dont get it! If you love your Islamic laws so much, go live in a place where thats the law of the land! They force their ways into a secular country and then try to change it!

There are many countries than women are all covered up, there is no alcohol, mosques at eevry corner, halal meat only and no clubs, gambling or anything fun. So just go enjoy your life there and leave the rest of the world who got over the dark ages to enjoy a secular life!


Live and let live.... oh wait, but they have a world domination agenda and in Islam it is prophesied that Islam will rule earth before the judgement day is here.

Makes a lot more sense now.
 
Have not read it in it's entirety as you presume to have BUT I have had long conversations with families of my Friends and none of them beat their wives, or go out killing people and what the tell me they have learned from the Quran is a lot more spiritual and healthy for a life stile than what I have learned from so called Christians that go to church to criticize others
ashkan said:
There are many countries than women are all covered up, there is no alcohol, mosques at eevry corner, halal meat only and no clubs, gambling or anything fun.!.
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So because you like mini dresses, alcohol, all kinds of meat, clubs and Gambling you are a better person? lol give yourself a head shake

My last post in here as I do not want to get into this ridiculous arguments but anyone that thinks a whole group of people can be judged by the actions of VERY FEW is ignorant.

and yes radicals are very few compared to the largest religious population in the world - One person with a bomb makes a lot more news than the millions of others going about their own way doing good things for humanity or just living their life.

You my friend have some anger issues!
 
So you have NOT read it and i HAVE and can point you directly to the chapter and numbers of verses.

So your logic falls apart where your juge Islam by a few family members where as i go to the SOURCE of Islam. Quran is the holy book of Islam and ALL MUSLISM from ALL SECTS agree on Quran being the direct word of god.

So if you dont see the problem with what they believe to be the word of god, ordering them to beat their wives and kill non Muslims, then i cant say much else to you.

I dont jusge islam by thie neighbor or that neighbor. I go to the source and i have no wishy washy politically over correct bone in my body to imagine things for what i wished they were like. Im interested in facts and the FACT is, the text of Quran teaches much hatred and violence aganist ANYONE who stands in the way of that vengeful god and if you like specifis verses, i can send you many. Then you can go home, open your own Quran or borrow one if you dont own one, open it and see if those verses are infact there or not.

I deal with facts in arguments not what my mother's neighbours son's thid wife told me Islam is lol
 
Here is a sample from quran.com (and not some right winged racist blog) Directly from quran and i have verified it with many other qurans to make sure its not fake.

Check it out in Arabic and English

http://quran.com/4/34

" [wives] from whom you fear arrogance - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them"

Good religion you got buddy!
 
ashkan said:
i dont get it! If you love your Islamic laws so much, go live in a place where thats the law of the land! They force their ways into a secular country and then try to change it!

There are many countries than women are all covered up, there is no alcohol, mosques at eevry corner, halal meat only and no clubs, gambling or anything fun. So just go enjoy your life there and leave the rest of the world who got over the dark ages to enjoy a secular life!


Live and let live.... oh wait, but they have a world domination agenda and in Islam it is prophesied that Islam will rule earth before the judgement day is here.

Makes a lot more sense now.
Click to expand...

There are more than a few nutjobs in our country which CSIS should be keeping an eye on:

http://jonathanhalevi.blogspot.ca/20...-minister.html

http://sakinahcenter.com/

Here the whackjob says that Muslims did not do the Charlie Hebdo attacks. Guy is pretty out there.

http://jonathanhalevi.blogspot.ca/20...carry-out.html

“I don't believe a bit that Muslims have anything to do with that, because, Glory be to Allah (سبحان الله‎), September 11 [2001], the building melted, but they found a Saudi passport, Allah willed it (ما شاء الله). What a miracle!

“You know here [in the case of Charlie Hebdo attack] they kill, you know, people, but miraculously the guys are so intelligent to assassinate 12 people, but he was so dumb to leave his document in the car? Allah willed it (ما شاء الله), May Allah bless you (تبارك الله).

http://tarekfatah.com/meet-imam-sai...y-prays-to-allah-to-destroy-them-from-within/

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bbf_1256179683

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/re...ead-of-harmony

Here is what Canada could become if things continue on the path they are:

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/dateline/...haria-showdown
 
ZX600 said:
The truth is that this is a very complicated issue and no one in this thread from either side can really pin point it to the cause, No Islam is not evil and neither is Christianity, People are evil and use misinterpreted written verbiage to excuse their evil ways and push more susceptible people into doing their work.

Why are those more susceptible people easier to manipulate? the reasons range from economical to geographical reasons. Stop arguing about this damn topic, none of you are right and neither am I.
Click to expand...
Actually you are pretty darn bang on as far as recruitment and implementation of extremism.
 
ashkan said:
Here is a sample from quran.com (and not some right winged racist blog) Directly from quran and i have verified it with many other qurans to make sure its not fake.

Check it out in Arabic and English

http://quran.com/4/34

" [wives] from whom you fear arrogance - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them"

Good religion you got buddy!
Click to expand...


you said you read the quran and not just the translations.. so how can you loose the context in which that ayaah was revealed?

heres a detailed explanation of that ayaah..

In the verse we quoted, Allah deals with the case of a wife who behaves immorally towards her husband's rights. The treatment of this extremely sensitive issue comes in gradual stages, as we have noticed from the verse. Medicine, or treatment of any ailment, can be very bitter at times. But an ill person will take the remedy gladly and bear the bitterness of the medicine in order to be cured from his illness. The remedy to treat a wife blameworthy of immoral behavior, as we have noticed, comes in three gradual stages:
  1. First stage: The stage of advice, counseling and warning against Allah's punishment. A husband must remind his wife of the importance of protecting his rights in Islam. This stage is a very kind and easy one. But, if this treatment does not work and proves to be ineffective, then the husband may resort to the next stage.
  2. Second stage: To leave the wife's bed. Or, if one sleeps in the same bed with her, he will turn his back to her, not touch her, talk to her or have intercourse with her. This stage, as noticed, combines both strictness and kindness, although it is a very harsh practice on both. But, if this treatment does not work, then the husband may resort to the final stage of discipline explained below.
  3. Third and final stage: Beating without hurting, breaking a bone, leaving black or blue marks on the body, and avoiding hitting the face or especially sensitive places at any cost. The purpose of beating her is only to discipline and never retaliation or with desire to hurt by any means. Islam forbids severe beating as punishment.

the only situations where the third option is to be practiced is to avoid option 4 which is implied and enforced in other ayaah's and hadith's of the prophet.... option 4 is divorce.. the ONLY act that is allowed(halal) but is disliked/hated by god. shows the levels of desperation involved if you are at level 3 and 4.

that one you lost it in translation.

the site did a literal translation.
 
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No it doesnt, stop jusitfying beating of a wife! Here is the full verse oh and someone else years ago tried to pull the whole things get lost in translation from Arabic, so i asked a few Arabic friends to see if it in fact meant striking your wife and thats exactly what it means.

"Men are in charge of women by [right of] what Allah has given one over the other and what they spend [for maintenance] from their wealth. So righteous women are devoutly obedient, guarding in [the husband's] absence what Allah would have them guard. But those [wives] from whom you fear arrogance - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them. But if they obey you [once more], seek no means against them. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted and Grand."

But we who live in the factual world are used to religious apologists who go up and down to try to make the horrible violence in their religion seem less horrible!

Its like when i asked a Christiand in a debate how come based on your bible the world is only 5,000 years old (things they would get away with before science much like a Muslims would get awy with beating his wife 200 years ago). The Christian's asnwer was... its not 5000 earth years, its 5000 god years lool

Stop justifying it with steps and phased of training your wife eiher. You NEVER BEAT YOUR WIFE IN THIS COUNTRY!

Not after talking to her and not before talking to her! NEVER

So its not translation and no its not OK because you went through different phases of training her like a circus animal!

Cant believe im having this discussion with someone in 2015!!! WTF
 
Of course it happens, drunks beat their wives, people with anger management problems do and yes of all backgrounds. There are bad individuals everywhere. That said, it happens a hell of lot more when it becomes a systemic teaching in an entire faith system that women are less than men. Where men can marry 4 wives and they can beat them when they dont obey.
Compare to growing up in a setting that teaches you from very early days that we are both equal human beings and you dont beat your wife.
When its in your HOLY BOOK, i bet its easier to use your fists since your GOD allowed and told you to do it! And we know how far some people go for their god. We see them in the news everyday! These people kill because someonw drew a cartoon so pretty clear on how dedicated they are to the word of their god
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