Shooting in Connecticut

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One theory making the rounds, based on research by Israeli economists, posits that the huge earnings gap between rich and poor Americans provides a pool of potential child-minders at the low end of the income spectrum, she said.

“Middle-class American women can... employ them to look after their children and therefore have the luxury of having more children.”

I guess if you want to live in a world where there is a huge income gap between the rich and the poor, and then of course what happens when the middle class dissappears then what? Maybe "Low end of the income spectrum" is just another name of slavery.....
 
While the NRA were calling for guns in schools another mass shooting happened with a couple state troopers as casualties.

Everyone agrees that something needs to be done. To have potential solutions one needs to entertain all ideas. Why is it no one wants to actually listen to what they have to say? I'm not saying it will work, or is the best solution, but I do know that banning, or severly restricting firearms is also not the answer. The law makers need to listen to all ideas and take a good hard look at all facts. Not just the ones in the current news that will get them votes.

Here are a few facts that no one likes to talk about
A 1997 high school shooting in Pearl, Miss., was halted by the school's vice principal after he retrieved the Colt .45 he kept in his truck.

A 1998 middle school shooting ended when a man living next door heard gunfire and apprehended the shooter with his shotgun.

A 2002 terrorist attack at a...n Israeli school was quickly stopped by an armed teacher and a school guard.

A 2002 law school shooting in Grundy, Va., came to an abrupt conclusion when students carrying firearms confronted the shooter.

A 2007 mall shooting in Ogden, Utah, ended when an armed off-duty police officer intervened.

A 2009 workplace shooting in Houston, Texas, was halted by two coworkers who carried concealed handguns.

A 2012 church shooting in Aurora, Colo., was stopped by a member of the congregation carrying a gun.

At the recent mall shooting in Portland, Ore., the gunman took his own life minutes after being confronted by a shopper carrying a concealed weapon. 2500 times last year alone legal gun owners stopped violent crime when confronted with it long before any police assistance ...

There are many many more unreported cases that take place throughout the US because no one was hurt.
 
Arm everyone?Here's another side to the story.
[video=youtube;8QjZY3WiO9s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QjZY3WiO9s&feature=em-subs_digest-vrecs[/video]
 
Everyone agrees that something needs to be done. To have potential solutions one needs to entertain all ideas. Why is it no one wants to actually listen to what they have to say? I'm not saying it will work, or is the best solution, but I do know that banning, or severly restricting firearms is also not the answer. The law makers need to listen to all ideas and take a good hard look at all facts. Not just the ones in the current news that will get them votes.

Here are a few facts that no one likes to talk about
A 1997 high school shooting in Pearl, Miss., was halted by the school's vice principal after he retrieved the Colt .45 he kept in his truck.

A 1998 middle school shooting ended when a man living next door heard gunfire and apprehended the shooter with his shotgun.

A 2002 terrorist attack at a...n Israeli school was quickly stopped by an armed teacher and a school guard.

A 2002 law school shooting in Grundy, Va., came to an abrupt conclusion when students carrying firearms confronted the shooter.

A 2007 mall shooting in Ogden, Utah, ended when an armed off-duty police officer intervened.

A 2009 workplace shooting in Houston, Texas, was halted by two coworkers who carried concealed handguns.

A 2012 church shooting in Aurora, Colo., was stopped by a member of the congregation carrying a gun.

At the recent mall shooting in Portland, Ore., the gunman took his own life minutes after being confronted by a shopper carrying a concealed weapon. 2500 times last year alone legal gun owners stopped violent crime when confronted with it long before any police assistance ...

There are many many more unreported cases that take place throughout the US because no one was hurt.

So with the number of weapons in circulation why do they still have the highest gun related fatalities then? Your anecdotal evidence should seem to suggest there would be less crime...not more.
 
The US people will not regard you piers morgan types, smith wesson sales are up 46 percent this year. As I pointed out Canada's population will be 80 percent immigrants by 2060. The US Founders Created a constitution to protect itself against the immolation that is and has happened to Canada. Canada had an opportunity with the 1982 Constitution to be a Country instead the road Canada pursued is obvious the politicians and bureacrats of Canada are trying to create a voiceless Country in China's image. A country where those affilitated with the political parties will reap the countries wealth. It's apparent with the repressive attitudes in this thread you want to shackle canada with taxes and regulations after more taxes and regulations because you people are the ones who are afraid. You are afraid if someone had a gun they would shoot you for the scumbags you are. Right is Right, any human being has that sense. When a country fails to empower and protect the individual, proceeds to strip the individual of his democracy as Canada has you have a recipe for lashback. Canada has to have the gun regulations it has because it's a country afraid of itself. Quit trying to project your fear onto the US. The Real issue is School Security and why this individual killed his mother and then went to the school she worked at and proceed to shoot the kids there. What did newtown and this guys mother do to this kid to invoke this action from him? This action was a statement and this was his expression. Society has to accept responsibility for acts of violence, trying to repress society with regulations is to convenient and self serving to the society elitists. God knows, Canada has enough of these self serving ********.
 
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I know it's Xmas but stay away from the sherry!

By the way "Society has to accept responsibility for acts of violence, trying to repress society with regulations is to convenient and self serving to the society elitists" that statement is contradictory to the gun crowd stance who are saying don't punish the collective for an individual's error.

Can I also point out you are an immigrant unless of course you're a first nations person.

Personally I am more concerned with someone with a gun being an unhinged Clint Eastwood wannabe.

The rest of your stuff...well I don't even know where to begin or if I should.
 
I'm not sure where this whole talk about immigrants came into play but the shooter was a white kid from USA suburban paradise. This kid was midly autistic and a social outcast who had access to a SAW; a weapon designed for annihilation. He also had practice at the shooting range. Stick a lowly paid police officer in the school if you want but a person with a SAW who knows how to use it and is intent on killing is not the same foe as someone with a handgun. If you don't like Canada's laws and living with the "scum bags", go move to the good ole' US of A. We don't need their customs and problems here. Canada decided its loyalty long ago.
 
So with the number of weapons in circulation why do they still have the highest gun related fatalities then? Your anecdotal evidence should seem to suggest there would be less crime...not more.

There are many different reasons.

Not all states have the same firearms laws. The ones with less regulations have seen a decrease in fatalities due to firearms, a decrease in firearms related crimes. Take a look at Florida, Taxas and Arizona. The states with more firearms restrictions also have higher rates of firearms fatalities. NY, and California come to mind.
Also a lot of fatalities are gang bangers. Guess what, they are not licensed nor do they follow laws. That will never change. Banning or restricting fireearms only empowers these types of individuals.

There is also the economical issue. There is much more gun violence in areas of poverty. We see this in Canada also. Most of these crimes are done with illegally obtained firearms.
 
I'm not sure where this whole talk about immigrants came into play but the shooter was a white kid from USA suburban paradise. This kid was midly autistic and a social outcast who had access to a SAW; a weapon designed for annihilation. He also had practice at the shooting range. Stick a lowly paid police officer in the school if you want but a person with a SAW who knows how to use it and is intent on killing is not the same foe as someone with a handgun. If you don't like Canada's laws and living with the "scum bags", go move to the good ole' US of A. We don't need their customs and problems here. Canada decided its loyalty long ago.

He didn't have a saw or a hammer.. He had a semi-automatic rifle of intermediate caliber. Using incorrect terminology does the opposite of making you "sound" knowledgeable. I'll clear up a very important misconception about mean-looking black rifles.

Some of you may think "Why does he need an assault weapon of mass destruction? It doesn't have any sporting uses, it's designed to kill humans :shock" and it's understandable why a person unfamiliar with firearms might think so. However, many military developments get transplanted to civilian life, these rifles do differ from their military counterparts. Also, they possess features that would make them more desirable to hunters and sport shooters than some older designs.

The main difference between military use rifles and their civilian use counterparts is selective fire capability. That means that they are incapable of automatic fire which is realistically only used to keep enemies' heads down. Those movie scenes where a burst of fire kills 50 people are Hollywood inventions. Civilian rifles do not have that capability because we're not expected to get into gunfights spraying hundreds of rounds while our squad mates maneuver into better position. That's unnecessary for peacetime hunting or sporting purposes, so we, as a society, decided to eliminate the feature, thus having MAJOR mechanical differences between a military rifle and a civilian use. What you're referring to isn't even an "assault rifle" (marketing and propaganda term), you're referring to what is commonly referred to as "machine gun".

Military technology often has peaceful uses and gets peacetime uses all the time. The RADAR was initially a military-only tool, used to detect enemy ships and planes. Now it's used for air traffic control, highway robbery by the police and even to predict weather. Many alloys developed by the military found it on the plane that took you to visit Aunt Jane in Florida. Have you used a GPS receiver recently? Guess what.. Those satellites are military. Even the Internet is a military-funded development.

Automatic fire rifles sold to various armed forces are built to hit what they're pointed at, be light, reliable and easy to handle. I hope you see why a hunter or a sports shooter would want those very same features in his civilian hunting or sporting rifle.
-Hitting what you're pointing at makes sure you put food on the table, eliminate the pest or achieve higher scores, all while minimizing any safety hazards. Who wouldn't want that?
-Who wants to lug a big heavy hunk of wood or metal, especially in the bush? Have you even worked or hunted in the real bush? It's not a hard, flat sidewalk, that's easy to move around in. You have mud, sand, swamps, steep slopes, deep snow, crumbling surface, rocks. It's a lot harder to move around in all that and that is why a hunter would appreciate the weight savings.
-A hunter or a sports shooter would also appreciate a firearm that's less likely to get snagged in the bush or bump up against a tree as he's attempting to get in position for a shot.
-That ugly black plastic furniture isn't just for show. It's less likely to pick up moisture and swell, which will affect the accuracy (which brings us back to effectiveness and safety factors) or literally get eaten by bugs in jungles and rainforests.

By the way your "if you don't like something about our country, leave" argument is more American than Canadian. In Canada, we accept immigrants, we accept multiple points of view and we accept changing laws through democratic means. Remember that our firearm laws used to be a lot more lax than they are now. What if someone said "if you don't like our laws, leave" at that point? Would you have accepted that?
 
I'm not sure where this whole talk about immigrants came into play but the shooter was a white kid from USA suburban paradise. This kid was midly autistic and a social outcast who had access to a SAW; a weapon designed for annihilation. He also had practice at the shooting range. Stick a lowly paid police officer in the school if you want but a person with a SAW who knows how to use it and is intent on killing is not the same foe as someone with a handgun. If you don't like Canada's laws and living with the "scum bags", go move to the good ole' US of A. We don't need their customs and problems here. Canada decided its loyalty long ago.

Canada will be growing its population by 80 % through immigrants by 2060, who are these others, oh for the midly challenged, anyone born in Canada and continued to be in Canada after being born to Canada. If you were born to the US, that would make you an American. If you were born to Canada, that would make you a Canadian. If a Canadian were to move to the US, that would make them an immigrant. GET IT? Oh, the loyalty Canada decided to? At the time of American independence, that would have been allegiance to the British Monarch. That would explain everything, Democracy is not what a monarchy is about, it's about serving the aristocrats and the Queen/king. Because the politicians and bureacrats have used the 1982 Constitution to drive Canada on its current population trajectory, and thus created a voiceless population to stop the political parties and their patronage bureacrats from extracting the wealth of Canada for themselves. This trajectory has created modern day "aristocrats" and they are the politicians and their patranage bureacrats. The Canadian Aristocrats have to keep the gravy coming. If I were a Canadian Aristocrat/Scumbag I wouldn't want guns getting into hands of "Canadians" or First Nation "Indians" either.
 
He didn't have a saw or a hammer.. He had a semi-automatic rifle of intermediate caliber. Using incorrect terminology does the opposite of making you "sound" knowledgeable. I'll clear up a very important misconception about mean-looking black rifles.

Some of you may think "Why does he need an assault weapon of mass destruction? It doesn't have any sporting uses, it's designed to kill humans :shock" and it's understandable why a person unfamiliar with firearms might think so. However, many military developments get transplanted to civilian life, these rifles do differ from their military counterparts. Also, they possess features that would make them more desirable to hunters and sport shooters than some older designs.

The main difference between military use rifles and their civilian use counterparts is selective fire capability. That means that they are incapable of automatic fire which is realistically only used to keep enemies' heads down. Those movie scenes where a burst of fire kills 50 people are Hollywood inventions. Civilian rifles do not have that capability because we're not expected to get into gunfights spraying hundreds of rounds while our squad mates maneuver into better position. That's unnecessary for peacetime hunting or sporting purposes, so we, as a society, decided to eliminate the feature, thus having MAJOR mechanical differences between a military rifle and a civilian use. What you're referring to isn't even an "assault rifle" (marketing and propaganda term), you're referring to what is commonly referred to as "machine gun".

Military technology often has peaceful uses and gets peacetime uses all the time. The RADAR was initially a military-only tool, used to detect enemy ships and planes. Now it's used for air traffic control, highway robbery by the police and even to predict weather. Many alloys developed by the military found it on the plane that took you to visit Aunt Jane in Florida. Have you used a GPS receiver recently? Guess what.. Those satellites are military. Even the Internet is a military-funded development.

Automatic fire rifles sold to various armed forces are built to hit what they're pointed at, be light, reliable and easy to handle. I hope you see why a hunter or a sports shooter would want those very same features in his civilian hunting or sporting rifle.
-Hitting what you're pointing at makes sure you put food on the table, eliminate the pest or achieve higher scores, all while minimizing any safety hazards. Who wouldn't want that?
-Who wants to lug a big heavy hunk of wood or metal, especially in the bush? Have you even worked or hunted in the real bush? It's not a hard, flat sidewalk, that's easy to move around in. You have mud, sand, swamps, steep slopes, deep snow, crumbling surface, rocks. It's a lot harder to move around in all that and that is why a hunter would appreciate the weight savings.
-A hunter or a sports shooter would also appreciate a firearm that's less likely to get snagged in the bush or bump up against a tree as he's attempting to get in position for a shot.
-That ugly black plastic furniture isn't just for show. It's less likely to pick up moisture and swell, which will affect the accuracy (which brings us back to effectiveness and safety factors) or literally get eaten by bugs in jungles and rainforests.

By the way your "if you don't like something about our country, leave" argument is more American than Canadian. In Canada, we accept immigrants, we accept multiple points of view and we accept changing laws through democratic means. Remember that our firearm laws used to be a lot more lax than they are now. What if someone said "if you don't like our laws, leave" at that point? Would you have accepted that?

I would like a tank please...it affords me warmth while I sit and shoot ducks...if I use a shrapnel style shell I can kill multiple ducks with one shot from many miles away if they are on the ground, if they are in the air I can use the turret mounted maching gun. When I kill my ducks I can drive to them and pick them up then drive home in a straight line disregarding any roads.

I love trickle down military technology. Next installment: Using a stinger missile to hunt eagles followed by the use of marine mines in fishing for carp.
 
Born in Canada or to Canada, Canadian. Moved to Canada, after being born to or of another country, immigrant. Get the difference? Honesty is not a Canadian virtue.

Chill dude, my first car was a firebird, I had a mullet and I blasted Bon Jovi with my t-tops off. At the moment I have balls on my hitch. Can't get more Canadian right? The only difference between us is my understanding of how sprocket ratios work.
 
I would like a tank please...it affords me warmth while I sit and shoot ducks...if I use a shrapnel style shell I can kill multiple ducks with one shot from many miles away if they are on the ground, if they are in the air I can use the turret mounted maching gun. When I kill my ducks I can drive to them and pick them up then drive home in a straight line disregarding any roads.

I love trickle down military technology. Next installment: Using a stinger missile to hunt eagles followed by the use of marine mines in fishing for carp.

There are limits to what's a practical peacetime use of military technology and overkill. Practical uses: GPS and Internet. Impractical uses: Airplane carriers and nuclear weaponry. Selective fire (automatic) would be overkill because modern day hunters and sportsmen do not engage in squad on squad gun battles. A reliable, accurate, light rifle that's resistant to elements would fall under the "practical" category.
 
There are limits to what's a practical peacetime use of military technology and overkill. Practical uses: GPS and Internet. Impractical uses: Airplane carriers and nuclear weaponry. Selective fire (automatic) would be overkill because modern day hunters and sportsmen do not engage in squad on squad gun battles. A reliable, accurate, light rifle that's resistant to elements would fall under the "practical" category.


What does this thread have to do with hunting? There are bad people out there who need to be stopped. For all we know these bad people have been posting in this thread. These people want to keep the public disarmed while they themselves are packing.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/22/us/nra-calls-for-armed-guards-at-schools.html?_r=0

“The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun,”

There is only one solution, everyone gets a gun. There is disproportionate amount of bad people to good, fully automatic is certainly required.
 
He didn't have a saw or a hammer.. He had a semi-automatic rifle of intermediate caliber. Using incorrect terminology does the opposite of making you "sound" knowledgeable. I'll clear up a very important misconception about mean-looking black rifles.

To use the correct terminology, I believe your quoted poster was referring to a Squad Automatic Weapon. The shooter did not have one.

I otherwise mostly agree with FiReStaRT. Knowing subject matter is often a good place to start.

In the interests of general education, the requirements of an Assault rifle are as follows (All must be true):

  • It must be an individual weapon with provision to fire from the shoulder;
  • It must be capable of selective fire;
  • It must have an intermediate-power cartridge: more power than a pistol but less than a standard or battle rifle;
  • Its must feed ammunition from a detachable magazine.
  • And it should an effective firing range of greater than 300 meters (1000 feet)

So the shooter didn't have one of those either. He may have had an "Assault Weapon" based on the Criteria from the US 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban:

  • A Rifle of Semi-Automatic type, accepting Detachable Magazines,
AND two or more of the following:

  • a folding or telescoping shoulder stock
  • a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon
  • a bayonet mount
  • a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor
  • a grenade launcher
Not knowing the precise feature set that the rifle in question had, I'll decline to comment further on it's semantic qualifications.

In Canada, our limitations on that class of firearm are different, I encourage you to look at http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/pol-leg/act-loi-eng.htm to educate yourselves to our circumstances, even as you debate those in the US.
 
What you're referring to isn't even an "assault rifle" (marketing and propaganda term)

The AR-15 rifle the shooter used is a demilitarized version of the M16 and falls under the US federal definition of "semiautomatic assault weapon". Hence, why I referred to it as a SAW. This terminology has been used by the ATF and in the Semiautomatic Assault Weapon (SAW) ban 1994. So accuse me of using incorrect terminology and being the opposite of knowledgeable if you want but I guess you better go impart some of your wisdom to boys at the ATF as well. Sure, it is not full auto but fitted with a large capacity magazine, it's purposes go beyond just mere hunting and sport. Some US States actually ban the .223 for big game hunting.
 
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