Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.....

[GreyGhost]

Respect ma authoritay or be prepared for an assault and armed robbery.

Guelph, Ont. reporter speaks out after he was detained and camera seized by OPP

A Guelph, Ont. journalist is seeking answers from OPP and the Coroner’s Office after he was detained at the scene of a fatal crash Wednesday morning and his camera was confiscated.

kitchener.ctvnews.ca

A Guelph reporter says an OPP officer confiscated his camera at the scene of a fatal crash Wednesday morning.

Richard Vivian, who works for GuelphToday, was reporting on a collision involving a pedestrian on the Hanlon Expressway.

He described the incident in an article posted on the community news organization’s website.

Vivian said he was taking photos when an OPP officer yelled at him to stop.

“He came over and grabbed me by the jacket, my left wrist, so he had control of my left arm. He told me that he (was) seizing my camera,” he told GuelphToday.

Vivian alleges the officer refused to let go of his arm even after he handed over the camera.

“He informed me that had I not handed him my camera, I would have been arrested, and that officially it was seized by the coroner under the coroner’s authority to seize during an investigation,” he recounted.

Vivian then said he was detained for about 15 minutes.

According to the article, the officer gave Vivian back his camera but said they would be keeping the SD card as it was “evidence in their investigation.”

 

[Rob MacLennan]

Respect ma authoritay or be prepared for an assault and armed robbery.

Guelph, Ont. reporter speaks out after he was detained and camera seized by OPP

A Guelph, Ont. journalist is seeking answers from OPP and the Coroner’s Office after he was detained at the scene of a fatal crash Wednesday morning and his camera was confiscated.

kitchener.ctvnews.ca

A Guelph reporter says an OPP officer confiscated his camera at the scene of a fatal crash Wednesday morning.

Richard Vivian, who works for GuelphToday, was reporting on a collision involving a pedestrian on the Hanlon Expressway.

He described the incident in an article posted on the community news organization’s website.

Vivian said he was taking photos when an OPP officer yelled at him to stop.

“He came over and grabbed me by the jacket, my left wrist, so he had control of my left arm. He told me that he (was) seizing my camera,” he told GuelphToday.

Vivian alleges the officer refused to let go of his arm even after he handed over the camera.

“He informed me that had I not handed him my camera, I would have been arrested, and that officially it was seized by the coroner under the coroner’s authority to seize during an investigation,” he recounted.

Vivian then said he was detained for about 15 minutes.

According to the article, the officer gave Vivian back his camera but said they would be keeping the SD card as it was “evidence in their investigation.”

I'll be interested to hear how far into the investigation's area the reporter intruded, in order to get his shots. A press pass isn't carte blanche to enter the scene of an investigation.

(There's a reason why long telephoto lenses exist.)

 

[GreyGhost]

I'll be interested to hear haw far into the investigation's area the reporter intruded, in order to get his shots. A press pass isn't carte blanche to enter the scene of an investigation.

(There's a reason why long telephoto lenses exist.)

This has more details. According to the reporter, he arrived seconds before and was on a sidewalk not obviously closed and being used by other pedestrians.

GuelphToday reporter detained, camera seized while covering news event

An OPP officer detained a senior reporter with GuelphToday Wednesday morning at the scene of a fatal collision, and his memory card was seized by the coroner's office

www.guelphtoday.com

 

[bitzz]

This could back fire on the officer... BIG TIME
They can use the photog's pics for investigation, but if it goes to trial there needs to be a chain of custody of that evidence and everyone that was part of that chain may have to give testimony at trial.
A couple of "I don't remember" or " "I dunno" from the reporter later and it's in-admissible.

 

[GreyGhost]

Big black eye for the police here. If you are in a domestic dispute in Tbay, have no fear, cops will come after you're dead.

Toronto, Canada and Global Breaking News – CP24

Most recent News News business news stories and video from CP24

www.cp24.com

The Special Investigations Unit says Thunder Bay police got the call at 2 a.m. on Dec. 30 from a home on Ray Boulevard.

The SIU says officers did not respond to the scene.

The watchdog says when police got a second 911 call, also from the house, to "cancel" the call for service, officers again did not respond.

An SIU news release says a third 911 call was made from the house to indicate the woman was dead, and only then did officers respond.

 

[nobbie48]

Big black eye for the police here. If you are in a domestic dispute in Tbay, have no fear, cops will come after you're dead.

Toronto, Canada and Global Breaking News – CP24

Most recent News News business news stories and video from CP24

www.cp24.com

The Special Investigations Unit says Thunder Bay police got the call at 2 a.m. on Dec. 30 from a home on Ray Boulevard.

The SIU says officers did not respond to the scene.

The watchdog says when police got a second 911 call, also from the house, to "cancel" the call for service, officers again did not respond.

An SIU news release says a third 911 call was made from the house to indicate the woman was dead, and only then did officers respond.

A few years ago I was working at a townhouse complex and a lady moving in asked if I had done anything that would have caused smoke in her unit. I hadn't and since we both smelled smoke I called 911 Fire Dept and reported the situation. Before the FD arrived we discovered the problem to be a pot on a stove in an adjacent unit so I called the FD to cancel the call. I was told that that the truck still had to attend the building to confirm.

In this murder situation was it a dispatch or actual feet on the ground failure? It sounds like the latter. There is no excuse. If it was a kid playing a prank it still has to be checked out.

 

[GreyGhost]

A few years ago I was working at a townhouse complex and a lady moving in asked if I had done anything that would have caused smoke in her unit. I hadn't and since we both smelled smoke I called 911 Fire Dept and reported the situation. Before the FD arrived we discovered the problem to be a pot on a stove in an adjacent unit so I called the FD to cancel the call. I was told that that the truck still had to attend the building to confirm.

In this murder situation was it a dispatch or actual feet on the ground failure? It sounds like the latter. There is no excuse. If it was a kid playing a prank it still has to be checked out.

AFAIK, every legitimate 911 call ends up with boots on the ground. If you call to complain about your burnt pizza and they have time, they will show up to yell at you but otherwise may not attend. Any call or hang-up gets a first responder dispatched. Any missing person call remains active until a cop has actually seen and talked to the missing person. Nobody can call it off until that happens (even the missing person can't call in, a cop needs to see them).

Tbay may not be as bad as it looks at first glance. Article didn't give time period between calls. All on-duty cops may have been dealing with a high priority call (eg armed robbery) and the initial domestic call may have been yelling. Sadly, the SIU cloak of silence will again do very little to increase public trust.

 

[Rob MacLennan]

AFAIK, every legitimate 911 call ends up with boots on the ground. If you call to complain about your burnt pizza and they have time, they will show up to yell at you but otherwise may not attend. Any call or hang-up gets a first responder dispatched. Any missing person call remains active until a cop has actually seen and talked to the missing person. Nobody can call it off until that happens (even the missing person can't call in, a cop needs to see them).

Tbay may not be as bad as it looks at first glance. Article didn't give time period between calls. All on-duty cops may have been dealing with a high priority call (eg armed robbery) and the initial domestic call may have been yelling. Sadly, the SIU cloak of silence will again do very little to increase public trust.

And any 911 dispatcher will at least want to speak with the person who placed the original call, if there's a call to cancel. Having a different person call to cancel a request would typically be a reason to escalated the priority, rather than do nothing.

*EDIT* - Funny thing is I just heard the host and Chris Lewis (former OPP Commissioner) on 1010 talking about this very thing, after typing this, while driving out to pick up dinner.

 

[DownUnder]

AFAIK, every legitimate 911 call ends up with boots on the ground. If you call to complain about your burnt pizza and they have time, they will show up to yell at you but otherwise may not attend. Any call or hang-up gets a first responder dispatched. Any missing person call remains active until a cop has actually seen and talked to the missing person. Nobody can call it off until that happens (even the missing person can't call in, a cop needs to see them).

Tbay may not be as bad as it looks at first glance. Article didn't give time period between calls. All on-duty cops may have been dealing with a high priority call (eg armed robbery) and the initial domestic call may have been yelling. Sadly, the SIU cloak of silence will again do very little to increase public trust.

My father in law tried to call overseas a few years back and accidently dialed 911 instead of 011 so hung up and dialed correctly. Cops were at his door 15 mins later...

 

[Dirty Frank]

That would be a challenge. Suing him for unpaid repairs in a joint fraud scam.

A friend was in a sleazy bar and muttered something indicating wanting another person seriously injured.

The guy next him overheard and says in a thug like voice "For 500 bucks me and Louie here can fix it so he never walks right again." My friend declined the offer but if he had taken it on, can you imagine going to the police or any court to get a refund if they didn't do the deed.

Good odds that your friend dodged getting themselves trapped into some sort of a sting orchestrated by that friendly stranger JS.

 

[bitzz]

Scuttlebutt says the lady was indigenous and her death was suicide.

... isn't the Thunder Bay Police services currently being investigated for their treatment of indigenous cases?

 

[GreyGhost]

Some cop vs motorcycle content from burlington. On my list of hazards for filling up while on the bike, I hadn't considered being tackled with the cap off. Rider apparently contacted media so presumably they believe this action was unjustified. The police have a different story.

Video shows motorcycle driver tackled by undercover Ontario cop in violent takedown

An Ontario motorcycle driver is speaking out after being boxed in and tackled by undercover cops during a violent takedown caught on video. The drive…

www.blogto.com

 

[Wingboy]

Some cop vs motorcycle content from burlington. On my list of hazards for filling up while on the bike, I hadn't considered being tackled with the cap off. Rider apparently contacted media so presumably they believe this action was unjustified. The police have a different story.

Video shows motorcycle driver tackled by undercover Ontario cop in violent takedown

An Ontario motorcycle driver is speaking out after being boxed in and tackled by undercover cops during a violent takedown caught on video. The drive…

www.blogto.com

Has to be more to the story. Why was he leaving with the gas cap off? Who did the video?

 

[Rob MacLennan]

Has to be more to the story. Why was he leaving with the gas cap off? Who did the video?

It's hard to make out in that crappy Instagram video, but I think the key was still in the cap. Likely tried to get it out to insert it into the ignition and then got tackled, turning the key and pulling on the cap.

 

[GreyGhost]

Has to be more to the story. Why was he leaving with the gas cap off? Who did the video?

Rider didn't put the gascap on because he wasn't interested in sticking around to talk to the guy that jumped out of the SUV. Based on the motion of the camera, it is a camera on a stick off the back of the bike. Gyroscope stabilized so it stayed upright as bike tipped. Software hides the stick. Camera records a sphere and you can select what appears in the finished video in software.

Conceptually this:

EDIT:
Interesting string of events. This could go either way for the cops. Tackled because they thought it was stolen (it wasn't), stunt driving and flight from police. All of those disappeared and he got license tickets. Probably a case of cops or ALPR screwing up and they got lucky that rider had issues. Now, if rider was innocent, they could easily post the previous ten minutes of video. I suspect that video won't help the riders case. Given the arrest, I assume the cops have a copy of the whole video?

Are any cameras recording encrypted video yet? Make the card useless without the password. Once you have processed on a computer (using the password to decrypt), exported video would be normal. Solves the issue of self-incrimination.

 

[Evoex]

Rider didn't put the gascap on because he wasn't interested in sticking around to talk to the guy that jumped out of the SUV. Based on the motion of the camera, it is a camera on a stick off the back of the bike. Gyroscope stabilized so it stayed upright as bike tipped. Software hides the stick. Camera records a sphere and you can select what appears in the finished video in software.

Conceptually this:

EDIT:
Interesting string of events. This could go either way for the cops. Tackled because they thought it was stolen (it wasn't), stunt driving and flight from police. All of those disappeared and he got license tickets. Probably a case of cops or ALPR screwing up and they got lucky that rider had issues. Now, if rider was innocent, they could easily post the previous ten minutes of video. I suspect that video won't help the riders case. Given the arrest, I assume the cops have a copy of the whole video?

Are any cameras recording encrypted video yet? Make the card useless without the password. Once you have processed on a computer (using the password to decrypt), exported video would be normal. Solves the issue of self-incrimination.

With a warrant you would be obligated to unlock it or face obstruction charges.

Cops can’t view video on devices without a warrant anyways.

 

[GreyGhost]

With a warrant you would be obligated to unlock it or face obstruction charges.

Cops can’t view video on devices without a warrant anyways.

Ok, alternative solution, you have a certain period (maybe selectable beforehand 24 hours?) to unlock content or software is no longer able to unencrypt. Tricky to get the details right on the manufacturer side (probably have to connect to a manufacturer server to avoid games with changing computer clock time). By the time there was a warrant, you could give up the password. The obstruction is baked in, you complied.

 

[Rob MacLennan]

With a warrant you would be obligated to unlock it or face obstruction charges.

Cops can’t view video on devices without a warrant anyways.

They can, however, take administrative possession of such a device in order to insure that evidence isn't destroyed, while they're waiting for a warrant.

 

[raginduck]

With a warrant you would be obligated to unlock it or face obstruction charges.

Cops can’t view video on devices without a warrant anyways.

That's not accurate. Courts have ruled that the rights to remain silent and to not self incriminate.. protect the person from having to give their password of swipe code.

 

[GreyGhost]

That's not accurate. Courts have ruled that the rights to remain silent and to not self incriminate.. protect the person from having to give their password of swipe code.

That was my understanding too but I havent remained up to date on case law.