Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.....

Who was in the wrong?

  • Cop

    Votes: 23 20.7%

  • Dude who got shot

    Votes: 33 29.7%

  • I like turtles

    Votes: 55 49.5%
  • Total voters
    111
Shaman said:
NYPD lying about crime statistics, confirmed

http://www.cryptogon.com/?p=34218
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If I change a few words in that blog, would you report that as fact too?
"A New York Police Department whistleblower’s report that his precinct was systematically handing out health food – an act that resulted in a suspension and time in a psychiatric ward – has been validated by an internal department investigation.
The report, completed in 2010 but not made public, comes amid growing scrutiny of the NYPD and its declining obesity. Those stats have helped build a narrative that New York City has become, as Mayor Michael Bloomberg likes to say, “the leanest big city in America.”
In September of 2009, Officer Adrian Schoolcraft of the 81st Precinct in Brooklyn met confidentially with NYPD investigators and provided evidence – including secret audio recordings he had made – that more than a dozen food donation reports had been manipulated.
He charged that chocolate bars had been downgraded, potato chip eating reports taken were never filed, and in still other cases, overeaters were discouraged from filing complaints at all.
Weeks later, on Halloween night, he was taken from his apartment in handcuffs to the psychiatric ward of Jamaica Hospital, where he claimed he was held against his will for six days.
 
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Rob MacLennan said:
Yes, you're right when the Chief of Police refers to a specific small group of officers :rolleyes:
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You really think it's small..... or specific?

"A video of Blair’s message, shown to the Star by a police source, was sent to 8,000 members of the Toronto Police force late Monday through the organization’s intranet."

That doesn't sound small, or specific.
 
Shaman said:
You really think it's small..... or specific?

"A video of Blair’s message, shown to the Star by a police source, was sent to 8,000 members of the Toronto Police force late Monday through the organization’s intranet."

That doesn't sound small, or specific.
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I think that he was talking about a specific situation and warning his other officers.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
I think that he was talking about a specific situation and warning his other officers.
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Rob, there is *NOTHING* in this article which reads like Blair is only speaking to a small or specific group of officers. He is talking about how the officers *ON THE WHOLE* are destroying the public's trust in the police system. I have no idea how you'd read it any other way. The *EXAMPLES* being specific doesn't mean the *MESSAGE* is specific.

Oh, and do pause to read the comments.
 
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Shaman said:
Rob, there is *NOTHING* in this article which reads like Blair is only speaking to a small or specific group of officers. He is talking about how the officers *ON THE WHOLE* are destroying the public's trust in the police system. I have no idea how you'd read it any other way. The *EXAMPLES* being specific doesn't mean the *MESSAGE* is specific.
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To? No. About? Yes.
 
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Shaman said:
Hah! Egg on face for anyone that argued with me about the character of police officers, when the chief of the Toronto police is complaining about what a bunch of lying, racist, larcenous, opportunistic scumbags his police officers are. Amirite?

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...asts_officers_for_unacceptable_behaviour.html
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You're wrong, of course. He's saying he doesn't want any of them to behave in a manner that harms the reputation of police services. There is nothing suggesting he holds that opinion of his officers anywhere. That part you made up, like the previous post about uncovering lies by the NYPD. There are bad cops out there, always has been, always will be. Everything else is in your head.
 
Shaman said:
Rob, there is *NOTHING* in this article which reads like Blair is only speaking to a small or specific group of officers. He is talking about how the officers *ON THE WHOLE* are destroying the public's trust in the police system. I have no idea how you'd read it any other way. The *EXAMPLES* being specific doesn't mean the *MESSAGE* is specific.

Oh, and do pause to read the comments.
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On the contrary, in the same message to his officers he said: “I know, like me, when you see examples of police officers conducting themselves in a way which is totally unacceptable, inconsistent with our values, our honour, our reputation and our relationship with the public, I know it makes you angry because it makes me angry,”
 
You're wrong, of course. He's saying he doesn't want any of them to behave in a manner that harms the reputation of police services. There is nothing suggesting he holds that opinion of his officers anywhere. That part you made up, like the previous post about uncovering lies by the NYPD. There are bad cops out there, always has been, always will be. Everything else is in your head.
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Oh, please. Are you really this dense?

On the contrary, in the same message to his officers he said: “I know, like me, when you see examples of police officers conducting themselves in a way which is totally unacceptable, inconsistent with our values, our honour, our reputation and our relationship with the public, I know it makes you angry because it makes me angry,”
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Yep. Pure political-speak. Behind closed doors, his message was clearer and stronger - according to the article. This is the argument every police forces member will give about every bad thing that happens, that it's "just a few bad eggs" but it's not true. And he confirms this by sending it out to over 8,000 officers. Nobody wants to be painted with that brush - even if it's true - so an officer (even a chief) will always paint it as being just a few bad eggs, even when addressing the entire force... with an ultimatum.

As for my bias, I have pointed out several times - I know a (former, now) H.R. person within the forces. I not only forged my opinion of the police by knowing a fairly large number of them but also knowing a person who dealt with a *VERY* large number of them. I am not convinced of an opinion, I am informed on many facts from someone who has had to deal with the fallout from within the forces. Like or lump it, you will not convince me of any other opinion - because my opinion is based on facts and yours appears to be based on faith.
 
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Shaman said:
Oh, please. Are you really this dense?
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You made it up, like you do with all your posts. You seem to be so DESPERATE for knowledge that you take every tiny inkling of information and blow it up into some unquestionable fact, laden with meaning, and all of it in support of your own personal greatness. Proof? Right here;

Yep. Pure political-speak. Behind closed doors, his message was clearer and stronger - according to the article.
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So he's lying. Except for the part where he's telling the truth, which you will decide and let us know which is which, and that just so handily supports your own extremist view. Gee, thanks for being the almighty arbiter of truth for us once again the Shaman (see, it's even in your nickname)!
 
Shaman said:
As for my bias, I have pointed out several times - I know a (former, now) H.R. person within the forces. I not only forged my opinion of the police by knowing a fairly large number of them but also knowing a person who dealt with a *VERY* large number of them. I am not convinced of an opinion, I am informed on many facts from someone who has had to deal with the fallout from within the forces. Like or lump it, you will not convince me of any other opinion - because my opinion is based on facts and yours appears to be based on faith.
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Seriously? That's your basis for condemning every cop? Lucky people don't have the same take on motorcyclists, that'd just be unreasonable.

Anyway, back to your muck raking.
 
fastar1 said:
You made it up, like you do with all your posts.
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You're either dense, or trolling.

Have fun proving I made anything up. Last time someone did this, I posted video of lap times... and still didn't get an apology. So, I must conclude that you really ARE that dense and intend to launch ad hominem attacks, rather than in any way substantiate your statements. Whereas, I have just posted an article and a video from a chief of police admonishing 8,000 officers and warning them that a certain kind of conduct is unacceptable. If it wasn't widespread, it would be private, quiet, and you would never have heard anything about it.

You might also want to take note of the comments on the article. Not very supportive, are they?

So he's lying. Except for the part where he's telling the truth, which you will decide and let us know which is which, and that just so handily supports your own extremist view. Gee, thanks for being the almighty arbiter of truth for us once again the Shaman (see, it's even in your nickname)!
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I am stating what I know to be true. It seems to be at odds with what you THINK. But your OPINION is wrong, and you will hold on to that and launch personal attacks from that position. Have fun with that. You will not ever convince me to disbelieve what I know to be true from direct contact, but I'm sure that won't stop you from trying.
 
mugwug said:
Seriously? That's your basis for condemning every cop?
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What's your basis for supporting them? Because you want them to be warm and cuddly, and keep you safe? Or direct contact?

There's damned near 100 pages of cops behaving like criminals previous to this page.
 
Shaman said:
You're either dense, or trolling.

Have fun proving I made anything up.
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I just did! You can't demonstrate that what he said was a lie, yet you made that claim. Therefore, it is MADE UP.

... more self-aggrandising BS ...
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I am stating what I know to be true. It seems to be at odds with what you THINK. But your OPINION is wrong, and you will hold on to that and launch personal attacks from that position. Have fun with that. You will not ever convince me to disbelieve what I know to be true from direct contact, but I'm sure that won't stop you from trying.
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Spoken like a true fundamentalist. I don't think you've ever experienced what it is to actually know something. At least I can recognise when I don't know something, but then I'm not out here spewing nonsense claims on a subject, you are. And your defense for these claims is simply "I know it" "I know it" "I know it". I've been here long enough to be able to say that, no, you don't.
 
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