Years of messages and threads gone. GTAM history wiped out. Who cares?

I haven't been a member long and haven't made any large contributions to GTAM, but I can relate and certainly understand where Vlad is coming from.

I used to co-administer a relatively large technology enthusiast forum (a bit bigger than GTAM). Anyway, the owner failed to pay the [admittedly large] bills and the site was taken down by the provider. Eventually the entire database - which only the owner had backups of - was nuked. Suffice to say, years of invaluable user-submitted content was lost and many people, including myself, were, erm... disappointed, to say the least.

When you pour so much of your personal time and effort in to something, only for it to be lost at someone else's hands is understandably frustrating.

Personally, I don't agree with Paul's decision. I do think it was the wrong call. IMO, deleting data should always be an absolute last resort (and should never be executed without first making appropriate backups). I agree that once you reach a certain point with a website, it no longer belongs to just one person (except on paper). Imagine if Wikipedia were to be taken down right now... However, it is Paul that pays the bills, so it is his decision.

But what's done is done. Again, I agree with Vlad that there's a certain broken trust now. I'd be hesitant to submit any lengthy guides or posts knowing that it could be wiped at any given moment.
 
DaveTheCanuck said:
I'd be hesitant to submit any lengthy guides or posts knowing that it could be wiped at any given moment.
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Am I the only guru on this board who makes a copy of any important articles I may write, and cut-n-paste them over the years to message boards, as is necessary?...
 
dr_sarcasm said:
Am I the only guru on this board who makes a copy of any important articles I may write, and cut-n-paste them over the years to message boards, as is necessary?...
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I wish it was that simple to preserve the entire online community like this. These are rarely articles - they are dynamic conversations. Keeping a copy of what I contribute, although necessary, is not nearly enough. I don't write just to pass on my knowledge and experience but also to get feedback and learn something new myself. Saving just my own contributions would be like recording only one side of a telephone conversation. The conversation that often doesn't have an end, even when no one has said anything for months.

Case in point, my DIY wiring thread on Maximum-Suzuki. It gets bumped every time someone has a question or something to add. It was dormant for six months at a time. How do you make a copy of that and more importantly how do you transfer it anywhere else? It belongs on that board and it's value is greatly diminished without it.
 
The reason this site is here, is because of us, the user. Its us the users who create the "value" of a forum....We create value through our Intelectual Property, be it Viffers excellent insurance posts or bravehearts mindless driver in search of attention. Paul is very quick to dismiss us and our old posts, but its those old posts that attracted people here. Would you join a forum that had no traffic? More importantly, would SITE SUPPORTERS BE PAYING FOR BANNERS IF THEY SAW NOBODY COMING?!

You have no problem collecting money from sponsors because we are here contributing, but you do have an issue with deleting that very same intellectual property and basically telling us to eff off?

I'm 100% on the side of Vlad.

And just so everyone else knows, Forums are worth money, in fact there is a booming business of buying up successful forums and using them to generate revenue. The only reason they are worth money is because of their users and the traffic that is generated. Traffic that is generated BECAUSE of people posting.....
 
Red_Liner740 said:
The reason this site is here, is because of us, the user. Its us the users who create the "value" of a forum....We create value through our Intelectual Property, be it Viffers excellent insurance posts or bravehearts mindless driver in search of attention. Paul is very quick to dismiss us and our old posts, but its those old posts that attracted people here. Would you join a forum that had no traffic? More importantly, would SITE SUPPORTERS BE PAYING FOR BANNERS IF THEY SAW NOBODY COMING?!

You have no problem collecting money from sponsors because we are here contributing, but you do have an issue with deleting that very same intellectual property and basically telling us to eff off?

I'm 100% on the side of Vlad.

And just so everyone else knows, Forums are worth money, in fact there is a booming business of buying up successful forums and using them to generate revenue. The only reason they are worth money is because of their users and the traffic that is generated. Traffic that is generated BECAUSE of people posting.....
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+1. Well said.

Too bad certain people have a "dont give a **** what you think" attitude.
 
infernobuster said:
+1. Well said.

Too bad certain people have a "dont give a **** what you think" attitude.
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Yea, if you don't like it, get the **** out attitude, bite the hand that feed you and you will have no more food

He doesn't get that
 
I gotta say, that was a really good analogy from Vlad. I get the frustration; even a lot of good Romper Room threads were lost, but imo those are trivial compared to the real motorcycle motorcycle-related threads that got deleted. This place is an archive, and I get that it's Paul's house at the end of the day...but he, of all people should be able to understand how important the information is for the community. After all, I believe he started GTAM to find like-minded individuals who he could discuss with.

I don't blame him for getting tired of moderating a rowdy and often thankless crowd, but Vlad has a good point about responsibility. If you're not up to do it right, then delegate or find someone who does.

Truth be told, I was considering making a huge donation because of the information that I've gotten from this site over the years and the great people that I've met. I'm still inclined to donate because the information hasn't become less useful since the time has passed, but it won't be nearly as much as I originally planned if contributions can be treated that lightly.

I appreciate what you do, Paul, and while I'm not too upset about it, I can understand why other people are miffed. The funniest thing about all of this is that now you can't really tell someone to use the search function anymore :p
 
Don't worry folks...I'm still working on restoring the old posts. I've even quit my full time job so I now have more time.

Cheers

Paul
 
we need to contact all the folks that love to repost...oh wait, maybe it's because of them we had to delete, but because of them we will be saved...i'm so confused...and now i can't go thread nazi on folks that repost the snot out of stuff...paul, you have ruined me...jk
 
Paul said:
Don't worry folks...I'm still working on restoring the old posts. I've even quit my full time job so I now have more time.

Cheers

Paul
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Paul said:
Don't worry folks...I'm still working on restoring the old posts. I've even quit my full time job so I now have more time.
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Thanks for the update, laconic as it may be. I don't understand if quitting your job is just a coincidence or somehow a consequence of the recent GTAM incident, but I'm glad you'll have more time to devote to the resolution. It will surely be appreciated and will restore some of the lost confidence.
 
Paul said:
Don't worry folks...I'm still working on restoring the old posts. I've even quit my full time job so I now have more time.

Cheers

Paul
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You make that much coin off this site? Wow, maybe I should be the Burger King to your McDonald's.
 
Jayv said:
I'll take sarcasm for $100.
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I call sarcasm from those who can ill afford it just pathetic.

This board just keeps loosing the little worth it had left.
 
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Vlad said:
I call sarcasm from those who can ill afford it just pathetic.

This board just keeps loosing the little worth it had left.
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Very hard to please Vlad.

Are you going to do another two year hiatus from this board and then come back in 2014 and start complaining all over again??
 
Jayv said:
Very hard to please Vlad.

Are you going to do another two year hiatus from this board and then come back in 2014 and start complaining all over again??
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He is going to go and live in a tangential universe where no one gives laconic answers to his questions :p

.....whew! I had been wanting to use those words for ages, now I can finally get some sleep!
 
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