Toronto anti-Uber protest - These TO taxi drivers are #@$%!!!!

I believe uber corporate has some creative accounting going. For anyone in the know - do drivers get t4's or are rides treated like a waiter's tips - i.e. assumed or faked entirely.

Genuinely curious, if corporate and drivers are skirting all taxes then that's messed up.
 
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Don't know too much, the protest seems like a poor option, like many here are saying, if the cabbies life is so hard making only $50 a shift and the industry is so unfairly weighted to the plate owners, don't you thing the drivers should:
1. Get their own car and become uber drivers
2. I know this is even crazier... get another job. The complaint is that they make under minimum wage, well go find another minimum wage job or maybe two. Even making $100 a day driving cab (twice what they claim they often make) is less than a 40 hour minimum wage job.. Education should not be a limiter here.

Maybe I am a skeptic... but why protest to protect an industry that they claim treats them so poorly and unfairly. I have no doubt it is a pretty shi++y job at times and they put up with some garbage, but exercise your ability of choice to go to other jobs...We import a lot of labour into this country. There are options.
 
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suzuki2000 said:
Education should be a limiter here.
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Yeah it shows...

Why not just go get an air brake endorsement and drive a truck (or however it works). Taxis would look good on their resume if they want to continue a life of driving. Are these guys that stupid?

People lose jobs on the daily, what makes these goofs so special? They have no idea how to adapt because they got too comfortable with their line of work. They also have no idea how to protest and half of them don't even know what they want from the protest.
 
suzuki2000 said:
Maybe I am a skeptic... but why protest to protect an industry that they claim treats them so poorly and unfairly.
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Because some people are too stupid or complacent to quit and refuse to continue being abused.

The same thing happens in the trucking industry, on a regular basis I hear drivers at other two-bit companies ***** moan and whine and complain about how terrible their working conditions and pay is, yet they just continue to go back there day after day.

Another part of the problem is that companies that ooerste like that always have a lineup of new suckers at the door who are also willing to be treated the same... So effectively as long as companies can get away with it and really don't care about their turnover, it becomes a vicious circle, and the employees are the ones who get screwed in the end.

It's absolutely terrible in the trucking industry, a lot of bottom feeder companies out there who treat their drivers like numbers, but despite the ****** pay and ****** work they don't seem to have any problems getting bodies in the seats, so as long as drivers are willing to lower them selves to those standards and they are able to continue to abuse them accordingly it's a lost cause. Only when everybody as a whole says "screw you" and they don't have drivers to put behind the wheel (cab, or trucks, or whatever) will things change, but given the demographic and level of education of many in both industries, added to the fact that you can't get two drivers to agree that the earth is round much less standing up for themselves, that'll never happen – so the companies will just perpetually win and continue with the abuse.
 
Read this article it explains how Uber pays no corporate taxes and basically evades paying anything into the local or federal economy. Why is Uber cheaper than a Taxi? Because it doesn't pay anything to the tax base it just collects free money. https://soundcloud.com/larryfedorukshow/how-uber-skips-taxes

My company pays taxes, HST, WSIB premiums, Health Tax premiums, along with numerous other operating expenses and taxes. Uber can come in and operate the same business but evades all of this and that is how they can offer a cheaper price. Most of the time, until they SURGE price and charge up to 2,3,4,5,6,7,8 times normal rate.

As a taxi we are prohibited by law to charge anything but the prescribed rate prices the city decides is fair.



klr_guy said:
I believe uber corporate has some creative accounting going. For anyone in the know - do drivers get t4's or are rides treated like a waiter's tips - i.e. assumed or faked entirely.

Genuinely curious, if corporate and drivers are skirting all taxes then that's messed up.
Click to expand...
 
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taximan62 said:
Read this article it explains how Uber pays no corporate taxes and basically evades paying anything into the local or federal economy. Why is Uber cheaper than a Taxi? Because it doesn't pay anything to the tax base it just collects free money. https://soundcloud.com/larryfedorukshow/how-uber-skips-taxes
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Yes, I get all that. All I heard on the clip was it's assumed uber drivers are reporting their income, but since there's no paper trail with Revenue Canada, how many actually are reporting their income? Sure it's the law, but human nature being what it is ...
 
taximan62 said:
As a taxi we are prohibited by law to charge anything but the prescribed rate prices the city decides is fair.
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So than the beef is ill placed with Uber, it is with the local cities, municipalities and regions who prescribe your rates. Regardless of Uber, the claim is cabbies are not makiong any money anyways, becasue the dictated rates are not sufficient.

Uber just exasperates the issue that the taxi industry claims to have that lies within the relationship with the city.

From what i have been reading, the Uber model provides better service with better overall value to to patrons regardless of the specific price point or legality concerns. Provide a better customer experience/value and by design, the taxi industry should be able to remain competitive, possibly even being able to higher rates with the city.
 
Look at the issue this way. I own a restaurant and pay my taxes and follow the municipal by-laws and health department rules.

Uber opens a restaurant across the street and does not pay taxes, does not get health inspections and gives the finger to all the municipal by-laws and as such can offer the same meal for less $

Should that restaurant be allowed to continue to operate? Or should it be left alone and some day when someone gets sick from the food do we then go in and shut them down until they follow the rules?
 
klr_guy said:
I believe uber corporate has some creative accounting going. For anyone in the know - do drivers get t4's or are rides treated like a waiter's tips - i.e. assumed or faked entirely.

Genuinely curious, if corporate and drivers are skirting all taxes then that's messed up.
Click to expand...
All income must be presented at the time you are doing your personal taxes so unless the driver is committing tax Freud it should be ok.
 
Yes but if you own a restaurant that is dirty, messy, smelly, overpriced and under served can you not understand why people want an option?

The dirtiest and scariest rides I've ever gotten have come from the taxi industry, no where else have I had that experience, even teaching a couple of younger cousins to drive. I choose to take my chances with "non professional " drivers because quite frankly you guys scare the **** out of me.

I'm not going to protest for you, you guys do that all on your own. But quit biting the hand that feeds you and then stop wondering why cabbies are not respected. Blocking traffic, ambulances and harassing other drivers is not the way to fight this.

Plus you are going to lose, we've found an alternative in ride sharing technology.
 
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taximan62 said:
'''should it be left alone and some day when someone gets sick from the food do we then go in and shut them down until they follow the rules?
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Offer a better value proposition to the customer, regardless of the legality, regulations, etc the service that is valued by the consumer wins.

Let me ask you this:
Taxis are insured for liability for the persons they carry (though I am sure there is liability limitations, sorry not an expert on those matters), but what regulations are followed or exist for the additional "delivery services" provided by cab companies acting as couriers. Are you liable for lost or damaged goods? Do you ensure proper placards are on the vehicles if you are potentially carrying hazardous/dangerous materials? What is the extent of liability coverage in this case? Has due diligence been done to ensure cabs are following proper legislation or is this just the extra side business that offsets operating costs sort of like how some of the Uber model works?

I remember years ago, not sure if it still happens, in Hamilton you used to be able to get a case of beer(even after hours) through Blueline, mind you you paid a substantial fee for service.
I assume that then and now if these services still happen, all the cabbies are licensed to provide the service? Have Smart Serve, Are declaring taxes for these additional services...
 
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As usual a few bad apples spoil the bunch. I am not in the Toronto industry and not all cabbies are bad drivers nor are all taxis smelly and dirty. Toronto is not the only market in Canada and to paint everyone by the same brush is unfair.

In my example of the restaurant I did not say it was dirty or smelly or unsafe but they did not follow the regulatory rules so should they be shut down until they do. I think yes.

Regulations were put in place in several industries to protect the consumer. If the consumer wishes to waive that protection then you should be telling the regulators to stop inspecting restaurants, taxis and any other establishment that has regulatory requirements and let the consumer make their choice. That way when you get sick, get hurt or anything else that may happen you have no recourse but to blame yourself.

Uber says it does it's due diligence such as vehicle inspections but I know first hand all it is is a form the driver has signed by a supposed mechanic. I know of one Uber driver that just had a buddy sign a name on this form and send it back (no actual Ontario Safety Certificate required) and was approved to use his car. At no point was the car ever proved to be safe. Now I know the driver will be the one in hot water in the end if something happens but don't tell me Uber really cares what shape the car is in when they onboard a new driver.

So in that same light why are taxis required to provide twice a year an Ontario Safety Standards certificate? Why is the rate set by the municipality (to avoid price gouging which is exactly opposite of Uber's model where if it is a busy time we will charge you a higher rate).

Restaurants should follow this model, Saturday night when busy they should charge double or triple the price for your hamburger because the place is full and has a line up of customers.
 
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suzuki2000 said:
Don't know too much, the protest seems like a poor option, like many here are saying, if the cabbies life is so hard making only $50 a shift and the industry is so unfairly weighted to the plate owners, don't you thing the drivers should:
1. Get their own car and become uber drivers
2. I know this is even crazier... get another job. The complaint is that they make under minimum wage, well go find another minimum wage job or maybe two. Even making $100 a day driving cab (twice what they claim they often make) is less than a 40 hour minimum wage job.. Education should not be a limiter here.

Maybe I am a skeptic... but why protest to protect an industry that they claim treats them so poorly and unfairly. I have no doubt it is a pretty shi++y job at times and they put up with some garbage, but exercise your ability of choice to go to other jobs...We import a lot of labour into this country. There are options.
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It's not less. $11.25/h x 8h = $90
 
taximan62 said:
As usual a few bad apples spoil the bunch. I am not in the Toronto industry and not all cabbies are bad drivers nor are all taxis smelly and dirty. Toronto is not the only market in Canada and to paint everyone by the same brush is unfair.

In my example of the restaurant I did not say it was dirty or smelly or unsafe but they did not follow the regulatory rules so should they be shut down until they do. I think yes.
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The point he was making is that you never know if you're going to get a dirty/smelly/unsafe cab with a lunatic driver. With Uber's rating system you know exactly what you're getting and it's substantially better than many experiences people have had with cabs while also being cheaper.
 
redridernl said:
The point he was making is that you never know if you're going to get a dirty/smelly/unsafe cab with a lunatic driver. With Uber's rating system you know exactly what you're getting and it's substantially better than many experiences people have had with cabs while also being cheaper.
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So if the cab companies had a reliable rating system, would things change?
 
My friends used to take cabs from my shop all the time when they are drinking, they now use UBER. For one Uber is way cheaper then a cabby, my friend goes home for $15 in an Uber, the same ride in a Taxi is $25. 2nd the Uber app is better then calling a cab, it tells you where the person that is picking you up is currently parked, then it counts down until they arrive. You get to see a picture of the person and their name before they pick you up. Their cars from what I have seen are generally newer and in better condition then an average Mississauga Taxi. And there is a rating system you can leave a good or bad review about your driver.

If it was the same or worse then the current Taxi monopoly then Id understand, but Taxi's have done nothing to get with the times IMO. And for my friends the actual users of these services, money talks and BS walks, they are gonna use a $15 Uber over a $25 every time. So if the Taxi companies what to compete, I really think they need to step it up

I say Uber should go after the Taxi monopoly at the airport next if they havent already, dont make sense to me that a airport taxi is called a airport limo and costs double what a normal fare just cause your leaving the airport
 
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It would be possible to order an uber ride from the airport though, right?

I suppose the risk would be with the uber driver as there is a chance that their call is security trying to bust them.

I wonder, if only to protect uber drivers from ******** fines and harassment, if uber shouldn't initial a sort of verified user system?



Sent from my LG-H812 using Tapatalk
 
taximan62 said:
Look at the issue this way. I own a restaurant and pay my taxes and follow the municipal by-laws and health department rules.

Uber opens a restaurant across the street and does not pay taxes, does not get health inspections and gives the finger to all the municipal by-laws and as such can offer the same meal for less $
…
Click to expand...


Lets agree on this first: if there are two restaurants selling exactly the same meal, with the same hygiene, same ingredients, etc. but one can do it for less money, then the consumer will vote with their wallets - everybody want to pay less for a decent meal.


Now, this new competition is going to bankrupt the old, traditional restaurant.

And it may seem unfair. It is similar to Walmart opening a mega store in Little Town, and in the process, it will kill all small businesses in the area. Walmart, the world's largest retailer, can sell the same items for less. Do we need to ban Walmart?


When an industry is disrupted, the answer is never to ban or destroy the disruptor. The only answer is to adapt!
 
MarcosSantiago said:
Lets agree on this first: if there are two restaurants selling exactly the same meal, with the same hygiene, same ingredients, etc. but one can do it for less money, then the consumer will vote with their wallets - everybody want to pay less for a decent meal.


Now, this new competition is going to bankrupt the old, traditional restaurant.

And it may seem unfair. It is similar to Walmart opening a mega store in Little Town, and in the process, it will kill all small businesses in the area. Walmart, the world's largest retailer, can sell the same items for less. Do we need to ban Walmart?


When an industry is disrupted, the answer is never to ban or destroy the disruptor. The only answer is to adapt!
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Exactly why I said what I said on my first post about retailers having to adapt. If the company I currently work for just stand there and cried about internet sales I wouldn't have a job in a couple of years, but instead they have a plan and are adapting to the situation as does every other retailer, as does the mom and pops shops.

Cab companies need to work with Cab drivers and the government to make these changes, there is no reason why a cab license should cost 150k (at one point), maybe the greedy license owner needs to make less and invest their money in other things.

But no, it is easier to sit there and cry about it.

Licensed Projectionist in movie theaters used to make 40 dollars an hour at one point, then the digital projection came along and they made less and then their job vanish, they had to adapt and find other jobs. It is life.
 
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