Speed camera update (Sept.11)

Parkside drive camera cut down for the third time in the last few months. This time they threw it in the pond. Residents say it's necessary and point to a ticket for 154 in the posted 40 zone as a reason. Umm. wtf. Someone going 154 in a 40 doesn't give a rats ass about the camera. This is picking off tons of people going downhill at 50 km/h which was the speed limit before it was lowered with no change in road design. If parkside was as dangerous as the fines indicate ($7M so far from this camera), a cop should be there full time to catch the dangerous criminals. Pure fundraising. Nothing to do with safety.

toronto.citynews.ca

Parkside Drive speed camera vandalized for 3rd time this year

The Parkside Drive speed camera was installed after two seniors were killed in a multi-vehicle crash on Oct. 12, 2021.
toronto.citynews.ca toronto.citynews.ca
 
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GreyGhost said:
............ Someone going 154 in a 40 doesn't give a rats ass about the camera.......................
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Who care's if they give a rat's ass or not. Usually this type of speed results in pulling the owner in for a discussion. Fine them heavily and inform their insurance company. Idiots like this only understand consequences.

GreyGhost said:
This is picking off tons of people going downhill at 50 km/h which was the speed limit before it was lowered with no change in road design. If parkside was as dangerous as the fines indicate ($7M so far from this camera), a cop should be there full time to catch the dangerous criminals. Pure fundraising. Nothing to do with safety.

toronto.citynews.ca

Parkside Drive speed camera vandalized for 3rd time this year

The Parkside Drive speed camera was installed after two seniors were killed in a multi-vehicle crash on Oct. 12, 2021.
toronto.citynews.ca toronto.citynews.ca
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I've mixed feelings about this. 65,000+ tickets issues. How many of these tickets are repeat fines. Once you get a ticket in the mail you take note and slow down in the coverage zone of the camera. If you don't do this then you're a fool. Maybe you need an extra ticket to remind you to slow down. I got a ticket in a school zone, sped up too soon, about 45 in a 30. So now I know and I'm very conscious of where the zone starts and ends. Lesson learned.

It would be good to know the distribution of tickets in terms of speed, the number of times the same vehicle received a ticket and if these repeat customers were ticketed at the same speed time after time.

If most of the tickets were a few kph over the new limit then maybe it's a cash grab. That said, I'd wager that many of the tickets are for speeds in the 70+ range, nowhere near the new limit or the old one. I'd prefer not to guess. All of this info is in a data base. Publish a summary and clear the air. Number of tickets 40 - 50, 50 - 60, 70 -80 etc......... Number of repeat offenders with 2, 3, 4 etc..... tickets.
 
GreyGhost said:
This time they threw it in the pond. Residents say it's necessary and point to a ticket for 154 in the posted 40 zone as a reason. Umm. wtf. Someone going 154 in a 40 doesn't give a rats ass about the camera. This is picking off tons of people going downhill at 50 km/h which was the speed limit before it was lowered with no change in road design.
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Gonna have to disagree with you on the need or justification for this camera.

The speed limit is the speed limit. If they raised the speed limit back to 50 vs 40 I'm confident this camera would still catch tens of thousands of people, so I don't buy the argument that "it's a fishing trap" vs the issue being just plain inattentiveness to signage, or some feeling that people are above the law and shouldn't be obligated to follow the limits if they don't like them. I somehow manage to drive my truck at work day after day without any issues, and I have a black box on my dash that will tattle if I do, and then yell at me if I do more than 6-8 over for more than 30 seconds. It's perfectly possible to follow the limits.

Clearly, regardless of whatever the limit is anywhere in this province, we have a huge entitlement problem with people paying ****-all attention to them anymore.

And clearly there's a problem in this area based on the size of many of the tickets. The only thing that will help solve it is whacking people in their pocketbooks.

In a perfect world we'd have all sorts of actual real police or traffic officers out there doing actual real enforcement vs camers, but since it doesn't seem that'll ever be a reality, cameras are the next best thing. We can't just continue to ignore the problem until every road in this province becomes even more of a free for all then it already is.

This camera will go back up, and this time around will likely have some other cameras watching it, as well as additional anti-vandalism protection.
 
Parkside drive has had may serious accidents with several lives lost including pedestrians, so you can understand why they are trying to slow things down there.

Noticed they have just installed a permanent camera on O'Connor Drive just west of Coxwell, think this will be a lucrative camera too but hopefully people will slowdown.
 
PrivatePilot said:
Gonna have to disagree with you on the need or justification for this camera.

The speed limit is the speed limit. If they raised the speed limit back to 50 vs 40 I'm confident this camera would still catch tens of thousands of people, so I don't buy the argument that "it's a fishing trap" vs the issue being just plain inattentiveness to signage, or some feeling that people are above the law and shouldn't be obligated to follow the limits if they don't like them. I somehow manage to drive my truck at work day after day without any issues, and I have a black box on my dash that will tattle if I do, and then yell at me if I do more than 6-8 over for more than 30 seconds. It's perfectly possible to follow the limits.

Clearly, regardless of whatever the limit is anywhere in this province, we have a huge entitlement problem with people paying ****-all attention to them anymore.

And clearly there's a problem in this area based on the size of many of the tickets. The only thing that will help solve it is whacking people in their pocketbooks.

In a perfect world we'd have all sorts of actual real police or traffic officers out there doing actual real enforcement vs camers, but since it doesn't seem that'll ever be a reality, cameras are the next best thing. We can't just continue to ignore the problem until every road in this province becomes even more of a free for all then it already is.

This camera will go back up, and this time around will likely have some other cameras watching it, as well as additional anti-vandalism protection.
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It’s a 4 way arterial road designed for 60kmh, was originally 60kmh. No unusual safety issues.

Dropped to 50, no change in accidents or fatalities. Dropped to 40 when speed cam installed.

So, if there is no history of safety problems, no reduction in accidents as speed limit drops, but $7m in revenue - what’s the purpose other than being a good earner?

Folks in my hood cover the local cams with spit hoods.
 
STARSHIP said:
Parkside drive has had may serious accidents with several lives lost including pedestrians, so you can understand why they are trying to slow things down there.
….
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I don’t think that’s true. One serious accident caused by a driver who was a medically suspended alcoholic. He blacked out and killed 2 seniors when he rear ended their Matrix at high speed. That type of accident could have happened anywhere.
 
STARSHIP said:
Noticed they have just installed a permanent camera on O'Connor Drive just west of Coxwell, think this will be a lucrative camera too but hopefully people will slowdown.
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4 lane open road (no parking either side) where the limit was dropped to 40kmh from 50 for no apparent reason. When I contacted Bad Brad Bradford all I got back was crickets. Strictly a money grab.
 
Mad Mike said:
So, if there is no history of safety problems
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I think you’d be wise to check your facts on that one. There is a long, long history of safety problems on that stretch of road.
 
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I cant wait to see how everyone feels about all these cameras they are putting everywhere once they perfect facial recognition and link them, then start issuing suspensions and points for these offences.
 
Fuzzbuster said:
I cant wait to see how everyone feels about all these cameras they are putting everywhere once they perfect facial recognition and link them, then start issuing suspensions and points for these offences.
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That may actually improve some drivers behaviour. As it is, for many people the value of the photo fines is trivial and there is no reason to alter their behaviour.

I don't expect that to happen anytime in the near future though. Facial recognition through glass in a moving vehicle with random subjects that may be wearing glasses or have facial hair is a hell of a hard nut to crack. Even if it works, it needs to stand up to beyond reasonable doubt in court. Bring a family member into court that looks close enough and let them try to prove which one was driving.
 
Fuzzbuster said:
I cant wait to see how everyone feels about all these cameras they are putting everywhere once they perfect facial recognition and link them, then start issuing suspensions and points for these offences.
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finally have an excuse to wear the helmet in the car, works for me.
 
It will get there soon.
I put in a complaint last week because I thought they forgot to pick up my garbage, my mistake I missed the truck and they picked up earlier. Anyways the reply I received several days later was that according to the GIS cameras I took my garbage out at 7:46am. WTF....WTF!
 
Fuzzbuster said:
It will get there soon.
I put in a complaint last week because I thought they forgot to pick up my garbage, my mistake I missed the truck and they picked up earlier. Anyways the reply I received several days later was that according to the GIS cameras I took my garbage out at 7:46am. WTF....WTF!
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I wanna hear more about this
 
PrivatePilot said:
I think you’d be wise to check your facts on that one. There is a long, long history of safety problems on that stretch of road.
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I have, as I always do. In the last 10 years…

2014-2024
  • 72million trips
  • 3 serious injuries - and-
  • 2 collisions with fatalities, neither related to the road or conditions. (2 elderly killed by a blacked out alcohol suspended driver) and a single vehicle high speed MC rider).
There were no additional accidents recorded with serious injuries. While any fatality is tragic, none off the three recorded were related to the road or conditions - they would have happened on whatever road those drivers were travelling.

At the heart of this issue is a zealous group of nimbys who want the arterial road they live on converted to a sleepy side street. You also have the Toronto Bicycle Mafia in there deep — David Shellnut (The Bicycle Lawyer) lives there and directls ‘bumps’ and single bicycle accidents to TPS to juice collision stats. Despite the parallel cycle paths thru high park, Shellnut is lobbying for car lanes converted to bike lanes.

Doug Ford will have fun with this one!
 
GreyGhost said:
My guess is they looked at the truck footage. It went by on his side with no visible cans and it went by on the other side of the street and his cans were visible. Time of second pass was probably 7:46.
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Are the GIS cameras on the truck or satellite? I thought GIS was used by municipalities for property boundaries and things like that. Years ago I was dealing with tree protection for a property and the city arborist said that a specified tree was on municipal property according to GIS?
 
Fuzzbuster said:
Are the GIS cameras on the truck or satellite? I thought GIS was used by municipalities for property boundaries and things like that. Years ago I was dealing with tree protection for a property and the city arborist said that a specified tree was on municipal property according to GIS?
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There is zero chance they have regionwide real-time and historical satellite coverage available in the municipality. The gis tie-in would be GPS tracking of the garbage truck past your address.

Fixed objects like trees can be accurately inventoried in the gis database. We have at least one gtam member that makes his living putting data into gis.
 
Mad Mike said:
I have, as I always do. In the last 10 years…

2014-2024
  • 72million trips
  • 3 serious injuries - and-
  • 2 collisions with fatalities, neither related to the road or conditions. (2 elderly killed by a blacked out alcohol suspended driver) and a single vehicle high speed MC rider).
There were no additional accidents recorded with serious injuries. While any fatality is tragic, none off the three recorded were related to the road or conditions - they would have happened on whatever road those drivers were travelling.

At the heart of this issue is a zealous group of nimbys who want the arterial road they live on converted to a sleepy side street. You also have the Toronto Bicycle Mafia in there deep — David Shellnut (The Bicycle Lawyer) lives there and directls ‘bumps’ and single bicycle accidents to TPS to juice collision stats. Despite the parallel cycle paths thru high park, Shellnut is lobbying for car lanes converted to bike lanes.

Doug Ford will have fun with this one!
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Not according to this
 
Fuzzbuster said:
I cant wait to see how everyone feels about all these cameras they are putting everywhere once they perfect facial recognition and link them, then start issuing suspensions and points for these offences.
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Red light cameras, photo radar and even the ETR take rear photos, not front. Many jurisdictions outside of Ontario do not require front plates on cars and of course vehicles like motorcycles in Ontario do not have front plates.

I also vaguely remember there was some case law about front photos and privacy but that may not have been Ontario or even Canada... So that may or may not be in play here.
 
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