Paris Attack

shahfaisal said:
two50noob

Yea so you are an extremist in this thread you have already.
- you've supported imperialism
- you've supported war crimes
- you've supported hate speech
- supported genocide as long as tittle read humanitarian.

do you support terror training camps as well?

Good to know we arn't talking to a moderate.
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I haven't support imperialism, or war crimes or Hate speech in fact what i have said is that i do support hate speech laws as defined in Canada. What i also support is free speach as long as its not a direct call to violence or a Hate crime. You cant pick out anything i have said that directly supports any of these.

Why would i supported terror training camps this line of argument is very confusing
 
shahfaisal said:
if you ask sensible questions then it can be answered... babies cry all the time.. no one answers their constant crying with a sensible discussion.. when you start making sense the answers shall come.

until them stop being so shameless.. stop defending senseless questions..
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Do you support the death penalty for those that leave Islam
 
Two50noob said:
Do you support the death penalty for those that leave Islam.
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faith is between a believer and his/her maker... what right does another have to force it onto one?

in the Quran the faith of a person can only be questioned by Allah.. no human has the right or the authority to decide should/not or how much allah loves that individual.. the faith is between the believer and his/her maker... Mohammad (pbuh) never ordered the death of another simply because he/she believed differently..

its the people/ media who pick a SINGLE line and say **see he said this or did that.. while editing out the entire situation or scenario.

thats why.. educate yourself.. and go download a QURAN APP.. most are free and offer full translations.. the QURAN is meant to be read as a whole not as a single line.. read all of it and then make up your mind..
 
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shahfaisal said:
faith is between a believer and his/her maker... what right does another have to force it onto one?

in the Quran the faith of a person can only be questioned by Allah.. no human has the right or the authority to decide shoer or not or how much allah loves that individual.. the faith is between the believer and his/her maker... Mohammad (pbuh) never ordered the death of another simply because he/she believed differently..

its the people/ media who pick a SINGLE line and say see he said that or did that.. while editing out the entire situation or scenario.

thats why.. educate yourself.. and go download a QURAN APP.. most are free and offer full translations.. the QURAN is meant to read as a whole not as a single line.. read all of it and then make up your mind..
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You still anrt answering

do you support death for ex-muslim apostates.

Also the Quran isn't the only source of cannon for you guys you have the Hadiths too.
 
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what do you mean i aint answering.. i gave a direct and exact answer to what is allowed in the QURAN.. you point was muslims kill apostates.. so i answered.. unless of course you are trying to take ONE INDIVIDUALS views and paint them as the views of well over a billion people.. are you?

fine AFTER(not before) you read the entire Quran go read the AUTHENTIC HADITH (confirmed to be true).

then you will actually have an understanding of the subject...

***my views since you are so interested are in line with the Quran.***
 
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shahfaisal said:
what do you mean i aint answering.. i gave a direct and exact answer to what is allowed in the QURAN.. you point was muslims kill apostates.. so i answered..
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My point wasn't that Muslims kill apostates but that some Muslim nations do perform the executions for it.

My question was do you support this. Do you support the death penalty for the crime of apostasy. 1 word answers help to make you positions clear.
 
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Two50noob said:
My point wasn't that Muslims kill apostates but that some Muslim nations do perform the executions for it.

My question was do you support this. Do you support the death penalty for the crime of apostasy. 1 word answers
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and my point was don't associate ISIS and SAUDI DICTATORS with the actual faith... just like some christians believed and still believe in lynchings of blacks.. doesn't mean its a christian thing
 
shahfaisal said:
and my point was don't associate ISIS and SAUDI DICTATORS with the actual faith... just like some christians believed and still believe in lynchings of blacks.. doesn't mean its a christian thing
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Jesus its like trying nail Jello to the wall. Im not talking about ISIS and the Saudis apostasy is a crime in 23 islamic countries

Do you support the death penalty for apostates from Islam. Heck i will even make it easier for you forget the punishment Should apostasy be a crime.

Pick a one word answer Yes or No
 
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shahfaisal said:
what do you mean i aint answering.. i gave a direct and exact answer to what is allowed in the QURAN.. you point was muslims kill apostates.. so i answered.. unless of course you are trying to take ONE INDIVIDUALS views and paint them as the views of well over a billion people.. are you?

fine AFTER(not before) you read the entire Quran go read the AUTHENTIC HADITH (confirmed to be true).

then you will actually have an understanding of the subject...

***my views since you are so interested are in line with the Quran.***
Click to expand...

shahfaisal said:
faith is between a believer and his/her maker... what right does another have to force it onto one?

In the Quran the faith of a person can only be questioned by Allah.. no human has the right or the authority to decide should/not or how much allah loves that individual.. the faith is between the believer and his/her maker... Mohammad (pbuh) never ordered the death of another simply because he/she believed differently..

its the people/ media who pick a SINGLE line and say **see he said this or did that.. while editing out the entire situation or scenario.

thats why.. educate yourself.. and go download a QURAN APP.. most are free and offer full translations.. the QURAN is meant to be read as a whole not as a single line.. read all of it and then make up your mind..
Click to expand...

man you need to read with greater detail... READ this^^^^^^^
 
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heck no.. cause if apostasy is a crime then by default and by proxy believing in any other faith also leads to a crime...

let the people choose what they want to be.. write or wrong they have to answer for it... (as a society)why take their actions good or bad onto our heads by killing them?
 
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since some people are stuck to single lines


some key verses from the QURAN:

It must be conceded that automatic death for apostasy is not as prominent a theme in the Quran as one would expect. For instance, these verses condemn it, but its punishment is reserved for divine judgment in the Last Day, or its punishment is not clear down here on earth: Suras 2:217; 3:72, 86-87, 90; 4:137; 5:54; 16:106; 33:14; 47:25-27; 73:11; and 74:11.

At first sight the words “seize them and kill them wherever you find them” would suggest that they are to be killed.

But this perception is quickly seen to be wrong if we read the next two verses:

Except those who join a group between you and whom there is a (peace-) treaty or those who approach you with their hearts restraining them from fighting you or fighting their own people. Had God willed he would have given them power over you and they would have fought you. So if they withdraw from you and do not fight you but give you (guarantees of) peace, then God has opened no way for you against them. You will find others that wish to gain your confidence as well as that of their people. Every time they are sent back to temptation they give in to it. If they do not withdraw from you nor give you (guarantees) of peace, nor restrain their hands, seize them and kill them, wherever you find them. In their case We have provided you with a clear warrant against them. (4:90-91).​
 
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shahfaisal said:
and my point was don't associate ISIS and SAUDI DICTATORS with the actual faith... just like some christians believed and still believe in lynchings of blacks.. doesn't mean its a christian thing
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Yup... Forget ISIS, Boko Haram, and the Saudis.

Shahfaisal can point to Malaysia and Iran as guiding lights for a Muslim society:

"Malaysia and iran... you may not agree with iran because they did not abandon their ways and try to be european... but you cant disagree with their forward thinking in almost every field except their version of human rights"

Democracy does not seem to be their thing.
 
Zoodles95 said:


Democracy does not seem to be their thing.
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do you seriously believe we have democracy????

heck iran is more open than US.. at least they know who/what the politicians are actually loyal to.. can you say the same for US?
its like comparing apples to oranges..

iran and malaysia are relatively young nations formed AFTER WW2..

when US,Canada, France, UK, were the same age as a nation they were FAR FAR WORSE.. heck iran and malaysia with their human rights records.. are saints when compare to the above mentioned western nation at the same age... i highly doubt you can disagree with that zoodles
 
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shahfaisal said:
do you seriously believe we have democracy????

heck iran is more open than US.. at least they know who/what the politicians are actually loyal to.. can you say the same for US?
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Iran sounds awesome. Amnesty International has some serious concerns about them:

http://www.amnestyusa.org/our-work/countries/middle-east-and-north-africa/iran

Iran executes members of the LBGT community just like ISIS and the Saudis:

http://www.iranhrdc.org/english/pub...ghts-abuses-against-irans-lgbt-community.html

I used to drive truck and spent more time in the U.S. than I did here. Although the country has its issues I would far rather be there than Iran. Good grief, just check out the atrocities from this link:

http://iranhr.net/

This is the best the Islamic faith can come up for a society?
 
shahfaisal said:
since some people are stuck to single lines


some key verses from the QURAN:

It must be conceded that automatic death for apostasy is not as prominent a theme in the Quran as one would expect. For instance, these verses condemn it, but its punishment is reserved for divine judgment in the Last Day, or its punishment is not clear down here on earth: Suras 2:217; 3:72, 86-87, 90; 4:137; 5:54; 16:106; 33:14; 47:25-27; 73:11; and 74:11.

At first sight the words “seize them and kill them wherever you find them” would suggest that they are to be killed.

But this perception is quickly seen to be wrong if we read the next two verses:

Except those who join a group between you and whom there is a (peace-) treaty or those who approach you with their hearts restraining them from fighting you or fighting their own people. Had God willed he would have given them power over you and they would have fought you. So if they withdraw from you and do not fight you but give you (guarantees of) peace, then God has opened no way for you against them. You will find others that wish to gain your confidence as well as that of their people. Every time they are sent back to temptation they give in to it. If they do not withdraw from you nor give you (guarantees) of peace, nor restrain their hands, seize them and kill them, wherever you find them. In their case We have provided you with a clear warrant against them. (4:90-91).​
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Haven't read the Quran,the Bible or any other fairy tale of that type.Don't need to read stuff to know right from wrong.
 
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