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YellowDuck said:
I suggest that fast guys who recommend that just have no recollection of what 1:37 feels like.

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When I was teaching for racer5 could do it on the 125 and 250cc bikes that racer 5 was using as student bikes for the first couple of years and I know the other instructors could as well(Mike Bevan, Scott Rupert et al) its about doing it properly.

these bikes would do a 1:37 if you dropped them from orbit.
 
All the bumps Jamie mentions are not as bad as he says. Mainly due to the fact that his rear shock is done and it just bounces him around making them feel bigger then they are.
 
I remember, it was 1.5 years ago and I didn't open my mouth to tell anyone how to go fast, I asked questions and listened. I did have a bit of an attitude though lol.
 
If you learn the faster lines then you dont have to retrain the brain when you do start to giddyup...
 
Xtina said:
I'm pretty sure people miss turn 1 because they are coming in too hot.
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More likely because they over shot their normal brake marker which was never right to begin with...

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk 2
 
reciprocity said:
When I was teaching for racer5 could do it on the 125 and 250cc bikes that racer 5 was using as student bikes for the first couple of years and I know the other instructors could as well(Mike Bevan, Scott Rupert et al) its about doing it properly.

these bikes would do a 1:37 if you dropped them from orbit.
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Hmmm...okay. Something to work on on the 20th then.

But seriously, not everyone is doing it. I just watched a couple videos of SOAR races to make sure I wasn't full of crap on this, and nearly everyone was standing it up at least a little bit between those two corners. I don't doubt that to do a 1:15 you are going to have to knit it together, but apparently lots of people find amateur racing pace without figuring that out.

I suspect some less experienced people here are claiming to do it on one line, but what they really mean is that they are not bringing the bike fully upright between the corners. That is a different world than making one turning input at 2 and then holding the same lean angle past the apex of 3.
 
YellowDuck said:
Hmmm...okay. Something to work on on the 20th then.

But seriously, not everyone is doing it. I just watched a couple videos of SOAR races to make sure I wasn't full of crap on this, and nearly everyone was standing it up at least a little bit between those two corners. I don't doubt that to do a 1:15 you are going to have to knit it together, but apparently lots of people find amateur racing pace without figuring that out.

I suspect some less experienced people here are claiming to do it on one line, but what they really mean is that they are not bringing the bike fully upright between the corners. That is a different world than making one turning input at 2 and then holding the same lean angle past the apex of 3.
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lolwat
 
Last time I was there I ran 1:20's and made it one line. It's not about speed, you can do it slow, it's about your entrance and exit of the corner. Turn in early, you'll find a spot where there's no bump and keep it tight on the exit to line up the next corner, that will make it one corner. I don't know if this is the exact line but it was my line.
 
Great info! I'll read everything with a grain I salt. But a map sure helps.

My first TD will be the 20th. If you see a guy fumbling around, looking like he has no clue what he's doing, and he's beside a white Streetfighter. Come say hello and tell me to relax. lol
 
SFer said:
Great info! I'll read everything with a grain I salt. But a map sure helps.

My first TD will be the 20th. If you see a guy fumbling around, looking like he has no clue what he's doing, and he's beside a white Streetfighter. Come say hello and tell me to relax. lol
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Sounds good :) If you see a blue bike getting black flagged for wheelies that'll be me, come say hi :)

-Jamie M.
 
YellowDuck said:
Hmmm...okay. Something to work on on the 20th then.

But seriously, not everyone is doing it. I just watched a couple videos of SOAR races to make sure I wasn't full of crap on this, and nearly everyone was standing it up at least a little bit between those two corners. I don't doubt that to do a 1:15 you are going to have to knit it together, but apparently lots of people find amateur racing pace without figuring that out.

I suspect some less experienced people here are claiming to do it on one line, but what they really mean is that they are not bringing the bike fully upright between the corners. That is a different world than making one turning input at 2 and then holding the same lean angle past the apex of 3.
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Pretty big assumption
 
toysareforboys said:
Sounds good :) If you see a blue bike getting black flagged for wheelies that'll be me, come say hi :)

-Jamie M.
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If you expect to be taken seriously then stop posting flippant comments like that. A wheelie closed TMP for about 50 riders 2 seasons ago, had an ambulance crew and fire truck crew delpoyed, had the OPP there half the day and generally wasted a lot of peoples time, effort and money. If you want to pull wheelies then stay the **** away from the track.
 
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You don't make friends at the track or on here by saying your going to outright disobey rules. I've been to a TD where wheelies were allowed, I don't go there anymore, I'm not out there to show off and act like a goof, that's not what the track is for.
 
Fiery254 said:
This is what marks you out as a serial knob. If you expect to be taken seriously then stop posting flippant comments like that. A wheelie closed TMP for about 50 riders 2 seasons ago, had an ambulance crew and fire truck crew delpoyed, had the OPP there half the day and generally wasted a lot of peoples time, effort and money. If you want to pull wheelies then stay the **** away from the track.
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LOL :) It was a joke, yikes!

I did not hear about that unfortunate indecent you speak of.

-Jamie M.
 
ZX600 said:
Pretty big assumption
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Not really an assumption - more of an educated guess (I said "suspect"). Yes, you can find video of SOAR guys truly making 2/3 on one line, not to mention some of Eric Teal's mind-blowing video. So of course some folks pull it off regularly.

But, I have done maybe 300 laps in Intermediate group at TMP, and I am just not seeing that from many (any?) of my fellow riders. For example, here is a video from this year. I don't know the rider personally but he is obviously on a seriously fast bike, and the rider is reasonably skilled for yellow group - doing 1:25s with clear track. There is not one lap that he makes 2/3 without doing a double dip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1v5Lnlu7lZ0

All I am saying is that this is typical (actually, better than average) in intermediate from what I have seen.

Here's a SOAR Rookie Cup race (great video!).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujhCFAZt2r4

At 0:50 and 2:16, everyone including our man with the camera stands it up a bit between 2 and 3. But those are traffic / passing situations, so surely not representative. On the next three laps (3:25, 4:40, 5:58) our guy has clear track, and you would have to be really nit-picking to say he wasn't taking 2/3 as one corner. Very nice. That's what we are shooting for, yes? On the next lap, (7:15) we get to watch another competitor with clear track negotiate the 2/3 combination. Big double dip.

I'm only posting these examples to clarify what I am talking about. If (like me!) you are standing it up even a little between 2 and 3 before adding more lean to negotiate 3, then there is still room for improvement compared to the guys who really have it figured out.
 
YellowDuck said:
I'm only posting these examples to clarify what I am talking about. If (like me!) you are standing it up even a little between 2 and 3 before adding more lean to negotiate 3, then there is still room for improvement compared to the guys who really have it figured out.
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This is where the problem starts at trackdays.

most just ride around and look at laptimes as a basis for improvement and then wonder why they get to a certain level and go no further.

In those 300 laps of TMP, you've never decided to spend an afternoon working on JUST this corner??

Give up the rest of the lap and focus!


The reason you see the double dip is the need to slow down for the 2nd part of the turn.

The inexperienced get into that turn too quickly and have to stand the bike up to brake or risk running WAY wide or tucking the front pulling more lean angle to complete the turn.

try slowing, then accelerating all the way through the turn(bikes turn MUCH better on the gas than they do on the brakes)

This one's free.

The next tip, I'm sending you an invoice!.
 
reciprocity said:
The reason you see the double dip is the need to slow down for the 2nd part of the turn.

The inexperienced get into that turn too quickly and have to stand the bike up to brake or risk running WAY wide or tucking the front pulling more lean angle to complete the turn.

try slowing, then accelerating all the way through the turn(bikes turn MUCH better on the gas than they do on the brakes)

This one's free.

The next tip, I'm sending you an invoice!.
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Wow, thanks for the insight. I thought I couldn't do it as one arc because I was entering turn 2 too slow! But it seemed the faster I went in, the worse it got, because I needed to roll off the throttle or brake to scrub some speed for 3. Makes perfect sense the way you've explained it!!

I'll try it if I make it to the Sept 20 TMP day :)

-Jamie M.
 
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