Will the real Pierre Poilievre please stand up? | Page 14 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Will the real Pierre Poilievre please stand up?

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A completely unknown web site.

You know, 99.999999% of the websites on the internet are "unknown" to most people. Again, this doesn't change the reality the words posted on said websites may actually be valid.

But it ignores reports that say that more than 60% of Canadians *DO NOT* take home more from the rebates than they spend. In fact, even the Liberals themselves have acknowledged this.

Citation please? Lets reference sources here please.
 
Don't know anyone else's specifics but I'm rural residential, my mail gets put in the mailbox mounted on the wall beside my front door by someone walking the route, and someone in a little postie truck comes every day at a different time and delivers the packages separately.
In the GTA at least, deliveries can be in waves. If the 1st guy is gone by the time the parcels are delivered to the depot then someone 'sweeps', aka is responsible for delivering all parcels still in the depot. Said person has free reign to deliver wherever, whenever, as long as it's done.
 
My brother in Christ, you just proved my point without realising it.

It's a wealth distribution scheme. Nothing more, nothing less. There's no government income, there's no spending going on from it, there's exemptions for the big players and the rest of the industry just passes the cost on to the consumer market.

... and most of those consumers are getting a bigger rebate than they're paying. "Axe the tax" would make THEM pay more and save the rich money.

I have no issue with the rich paying more taxes than the poor. And this is not a self-interest statement, either.

All your CBC story (*cough cough something something propaganda pushers*) does is point out that the wealthy (whoever they are) would get to keep more of their money and the poor would have less money because the scheme that gives them more welfare on the backs of the working class would be axed. I'M ALL FOR THAT. Workers are taxed enough and the poor are not my @#$% responsibility, I wasn't born in to serfdom at least in concept.

But it ignores reports that say that more than 60% of Canadians *DO NOT* take home more from the rebates than they spend. In fact, even the Liberals themselves have acknowledged this. So where the CBC gets off making up their own data, I don't know. Secondly, since 47% of Canadians pay no net taxes, this makes their claims highly specious because they happily skew the stats to look just as rosy as they can make them.

If they AXED the tax (and the rebate) THEN the wealthy would keep more of their money and the poor would have less because they would no longer be getting their rebate. And the CBC article does get into the proportion of Canadians in various income groups who get a net rebate. (It's not an exact income-dependent number, because it's carbon-usage-dependent, and they're correlated but not the same.) 94% who earn below $50k per year have a benefit under the current scheme (and would lose out under "axe the tax"). At around $250k it's roughly even split, some gain a little, some lose a little.

Please provide supporting information for "more than 60% of Canadians do not take home more from the rebates than they spend", because I can't find it.
 
You can't force a private business to service an unprofitable segment without, well....paying them to do it. Either that means your parcel that would have been $25 with Canada Post becomes $250 with UPS, and your lettermail becomes $50 instead of $2, or the government subsidizes it. Then instead of funding a public service, you're funding a for-profit business, and almost certainly ending up paying more in the end because contrary to what is often public opinion, quite often public services end up being cheaper than private replacements

It's not cut and dried. When I lived in Wendake Beach anything through CP I had to pick up at the convenience store in Wyevale, mail included (I had a mailbox in the wall of mailboxes in the store). UPS, FedEx came to my door.
 
Growing up in the boonies in NS we had a community mail box. Some still had and individual mailbox at the end of the driveway but was get pushed out over the yrs
 
If Canada Post sales was well organized and aggressive, they could eat the competition.
 
It's not cut and dried. When I lived in Wendake Beach anything through CP I had to pick up at the convenience store in Wyevale, mail included (I had a mailbox in the wall of mailboxes in the store). UPS, FedEx came to my door.
What happened when UPS or FedEx used the knicky knicky nine door technique? Did you have to drive to another city for pickup?
 
What happened when UPS or FedEx used the knicky knicky nine door technique? Did you have to drive to another city for pickup?
They come back up to 3 times unlike Canada post who makes you drive a hour for a package they never tried to deliver and admit that is against the terms of service but they have no accountability so suck it.

Sent from the future
 
They come back up to 3 times unlike Canada post who makes you drive a hour for a package they never tried to deliver and admit that is against the terms of service but they have no accountability so suck it.

Sent from the future
Canada Post sends large packages to the nearest Shopper's down the street here, which has a post office.
Smaller packages fit inside the super box, and I get a key.
Our driver, they're all drivers now, none of them seem to be allowed to walk anymore, might be taking Thursdays off.
FedEx is a longer drive, and UPS had my $4,000+ computer fall off the back of their truck.
The three times thing would be great, but I've chased the truck down the road unsuccessfully a few times, when they left the sticker, and didn't even knock or ring. Rinse, repeat.
Amazon tends to drop it on the porch and may or may not take a picture.
Edit: Having multiple companies doing to your door delivery is inefficient and wasteful.
Something for the people worried about climate, pollution etc. to consider.

A long time ago, I had to go downtown to near where the old Redpath was in Toronto, to pick up a package from one of the couriers, as that was the nearest depot.
 
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I was really sour loosing door delivery, but now don’t worry about a pile of stuff when gone for two weeks and the junk mail just drops into the recycling box of the way by .


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Canada Post sends large packages to the nearest Shopper's down the street here, which has a post office.
Smaller packages fit inside the super box, and I get a key.
Our driver, they're all drivers now, none of them seem to be allowed to walk anymore, might be taking Thursdays off.
FedEx is a longer drive, and UPS had my $4,000+ computer fall off the back of their truck.
The three times thing would be great, but I've chased the truck down the road unsuccessfully a few times, when they left the sticker, and didn't even knock or ring. Rinse, repeat.
Amazon tends to drop it on the porch and may or may not take a picture.
Edit: Having multiple companies doing to your door delivery is inefficient and wasteful.
Something for the people worried about climate, pollution etc. to consider.

A long time ago, I had to go downtown to near where the old Redpath was in Toronto, to pick up a package from one of the couriers, as that was the nearest depot.
I have Amazon etc packages sent to the nearest post office because of porch pirates. I pick up at my convenience.
 
The federal government is not going to be able to do anything meaningful about affordable housing. Period. Supply and demand governs.
Yes they can. The liberals created the problem by juicing demand by doubling immigration and quintupling intl student visas. For decades Canada accepted new comers at a rate health care and housing growth could accommodate.

This crisis was created in the last 5 years, it can be undone just as fast with the right leadership.
WHY does that one-bedroom apartment in Toronto rent for $2k per month?
- Because the portion of the cost of the building that it's in which is allocated to that apartment, is probably half a million and it probably has a mortgage on it for most of that. Whatever portion of it doesn't have a mortgage on it, is still tied-up money that could be doing something else as opposed to being tied up in bricks and mortar, so even if there isn't "mortgage interest" on a paid-off building, there's still a lost-opportunity-cost for having money tied up ... call it even.
- Because the interest on that mortgage (or the lost-opportunity-cost investment rate) probably eats up most or all of the rent payments the way interest rates have been lately. Plus maintenance plus property tax plus a risk premium (bad tenants can destroy the investment - and there are sure bad tenants out there, and the landlord and tenant act tips things strongly towards the tenant and against the landlord).
- So, "reduce interest rates". Except, the recent spike in interest rates (which everyone who was paying attention knew was going to happen) was to dampen inflation by intentionally slowing the economy down a little. Which it did. And now the upcoming direction of interest rates is probably down (slowly).
- Or, "reduce housing costs". HOW? Supply and demand governs this!
Interest rates are also a product of federal leadership. They dumped an enormous amount of money into the economy without a plan. That juice demand faster than supply can build. Too much money chasing goods makes inflation. Taming inflation is painful as the core perscription increases the cost servicing debt, which for many adds to the pain.
What of all this, is under the responsibility of the federal government?
Inflation, monetary policy, immigration. Which would be just about most of it.
Corporate greed/profits is behind some of the unaffordability situation. There's some big companies out there setting record profits ... so, maybe, we (and the americans) need to make sure billionaires are paying their share. But this has to be done internationally, because otherwise they'll bury their profits in some other lower-tax country. Good luck with that!
True. But that too can be fixed. I’m not worried about extracting more tax from the 60 Canadian billionaires, if you were already paying 1000x the tax of an average Canadian, you might look at it differently. Do the billionaire math sometime… if all 60 contributed their entire wealth, you’d fund about a year of JTs deficit spending.

Drive those 60 billionaires out and every Canadian would have to pay about 50% more income tax to fund the government.
We know PP wants to "axe the tax" (the carbon tax). Except ... Most people (~80%) are getting a bigger rebate than what they're contributing. (Those who are complaining that they're not getting a rebate, either haven't been paying attention to their bank accounts, or didn't file their income tax last year, or didn't sign up for electronic deposit, or are owing money and the rebate was applied to their balance owing, or something of that sort. I've been getting quarterly rebate deposits.) So, "axe the tax" also means axe the rebate. So then 80% of the population gets (a little) worse off, and the rich get (a little) richer, and it basically doesn't make a difference to government coffers. The nonsense spread about the carbon tax being responsible for businesses going bankrupt is just that - nonsense. If a company was going to go bankrupt because they were heavy energy consumers then it wasn't the carbon tax that put them over the edge, they were going bankrupt anyhow. Now look at this, and tell me where the real money is going: https://www.suncor.com/-/media/Proj...rnings-q2-2023-en.pdf?modified=20230907164333

(Mandatory disclaimer, I own some SU in an investment account.)
Carbon tax isn’t a simple debit/credit tax. When a gallon of oil gets taxed, if gets added into the input cost for bushel of grain, the grain farmer raises his price. The feedmills increase their cost of chicken feed to cover the grain cost. Chicken farmer does same, chicken processor does same, retailer does the same. Same for all the other ancillary services (trucking, vet, heat) Oops, fuvk, inflation!

You may get the pennies back in tax paid at the pump, not you’re not getting back the pennies added to a loaf of bread.
 
They could move to weekly delivery and really make no difference in service. Even if you cut Canada post and via completely it is just 1 billion a small rounding error on the total budget. Do you cut veterans off, the military or indigenous people. Those are 3 of the big ones.

Sent from the future
The biggest is the size of the civil service. Do like a big business - hey managers, 10% reduction in budgets, figure it out. Or we’ll get someone capable to do it for you ( get the hint?).
 
Do like a big business - hey managers, 10% reduction in budgets, figure it out. Or we’ll get someone capable to do it for you ( get the hint?).
Concur, the change from private to public corporation still has my head spinning. The amount of waste is astronomical.

I like to joke to the old hands here, back in private corp land; if even 1 employee booked 1 hour overtime to finish their task, there would be a management meeting the next day and the GM would be fired up asking department heads why the employee needs OT to complete their tasks.
 
Yes they can. The liberals created the problem by juicing demand by doubling immigration and quintupling intl student visas. For decades Canada accepted new comers at a rate health care and housing growth could accommodate.

This crisis was created in the last 5 years, it can be undone just as fast with the right leadership.

Yes, high immigration has consequences. The Bank of Canada knows this (and this publication is very recent):


"The rise in immigration is nonetheless contributing to pressures in inflation components linked to house prices, given that it is adding more to housing demand than to housing supply in the context of structural imbalances in the Canadian housing market."

The consequences are not simple, and a knee-jerk reaction probably isn't a good idea. A knee-jerk reversion to pre-2020 numbers probably is, but I will defer to experts on this, which is not me (and probably not PP).

Interest rates are also a product of federal leadership. They dumped an enormous amount of money into the economy without a plan. That juice demand faster than supply can build. Too much money chasing goods makes inflation. Taming inflation is painful as the core perscription increases the cost servicing debt, which for many adds to the pain.

Worldwide issue arising from the pandemic. Our situation relative to the G7 is not bad (higher only than USA and only by a smidge):

Inflation, monetary policy, immigration. Which would be just about most of it.

True. But that too can be fixed. I’m not worried about extracting more tax from the 60 Canadian billionaires, if you were already paying 1000x the tax of an average Canadian, you might look at it differently. Do the billionaire math sometime… if all 60 contributed their entire wealth, you’d fund about a year of JTs deficit spending.

Drive those 60 billionaires out and every Canadian would have to pay about 50% more income tax to fund the government.

Hence my "good luck with that" comment. Something like this would require international co-operation.

Carbon tax isn’t a simple debit/credit tax. When a gallon of oil gets taxed, if gets added into the input cost for bushel of grain, the grain farmer raises his price. The feedmills increase their cost of chicken feed to cover the grain cost. Chicken farmer does same, chicken processor does same, retailer does the same. Same for all the other ancillary services (trucking, vet, heat) Oops, fuvk, inflation!

You may get the pennies back in tax paid at the pump, not you’re not getting back the pennies added to a loaf of bread.

Yes, you are. If the farmer paid $1 in carbon tax to feed the tractor and raised his price on an arbitrary product by that $1 then that $1 extra goes all the way down the line (through the feedmill, through the chicken farm, through the chicken processor, through the retailer) until that $1 ends up at the consumer and then it ends up in the pool of money that gets rebated to consumers.

Each step along the way has another energy contribution that they're paying carbon tax on, so hypothetically it's $1 via the farmer and $0.10 to the feedmill and $0.10 to the chicken farm and $0.10 to the chicken processor and $0.10 to the retailer = $1.40 extra at the consumer but all that energy cost spent along the way ends up in the pool of money that gets rebated to consumers.

Now if each of those steps is marking up the extra upstream costs then that's something you'll have to chat about with people like Galon Weston. And companies like Suncor, for that matter.

If the costs incentivise an individual farmer to buy a more efficient tractor, or work in a more energy-efficient manner, so that he's paying less in carbon tax (and a far bigger amount less in fuel overall) then that farmer gets to stick those savings in his pocket, and that's the reason the carbon tax exists.
 
Yes, high immigration has consequences. The Bank of Canada knows this (and this publication is very recent):


"The rise in immigration is nonetheless contributing to pressures in inflation components linked to house prices, given that it is adding more to housing demand than to housing supply in the context of structural imbalances in the Canadian housing market."

The consequences are not simple, and a knee-jerk reaction probably isn't a good idea. A knee-jerk reversion to pre-2020 numbers probably is, but I will defer to experts on this, which is not me (and probably not PP).



Worldwide issue arising from the pandemic. Our situation relative to the G7 is not bad (higher only than USA and only by a smidge):
I prefer a more granular comparison. I also prefer to be compared to winners, not losers.

Hence my "good luck with that" comment. Something like this would require international co-operation.
Internationally we compete, not cooperate.
Yes, you are. If the farmer paid $1 in carbon tax to feed the tractor and raised his price on an arbitrary product by that $1 then that $1 extra goes all the way down the line (through the feedmill, through the chicken farm, through the chicken processor, through the retailer) until that $1 ends up at the consumer and then it ends up in the pool of money that gets rebated to consumers..


Each step along the way has another energy contribution that they're paying carbon tax on, so hypothetically it's $1 via the farmer and $0.10 to the feedmill and $0.10 to the chicken farm and $0.10 to the chicken processor and $0.10 to the retailer = $1.40 extra at the consumer but all that energy cost spent along the way ends up in the pool of money that gets rebated to consumers.

Now if each of those steps is marking up the extra upstream costs then that's something you'll have to chat about with people like Galon Weston. And companies like Suncor, for that matter.
That’s true BUT since the tax is not flow thru, it’s added to the cost base. That means it gets an inflationary margin attached at every step in the supply chain. You don’t get that back, a neither my business or Galen’s will be discussing cutting our margins to support extra taxes any time soon.
If the costs incentivise an individual farmer to buy a more efficient tractor, or work in a more energy-efficient manner, so that he's paying less in carbon tax (and a far bigger amount less in fuel overall) then that farmer gets to stick those savings in his pocket, and that's the reason the carbon tax exists.
The incentive to cut costs is always there, the carbon tax doesn’t incentivize much when a portion is already round tripped. Driving behaviours with tax requires an enormous tax, like you see on cigarettes or alcohol.
 
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