I might have done that pass as the bike too. That front rider was all over the place and parking it in the corners. I would have put the hammer done to open up some more space though.THis thread reminds me of this video
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Sunday Morning Rides are Over - Cyclists win.
- Thread starter Merkid
- Start date
Might be waiting a while for a response. He hasn't logged in since being called out a few months ago.
At a rally in Arkansas a guy was bragging about doing the same but he used his gun to ensure compliance by the cross traffic.
Nikola Tesla
Well-known member
I cycle….. there are ALOT of noob cyclists I’ve seen on the road….big danger to themselves and others
THis thread reminds me of this video
Good lord. If you're getting passed by bicyclists in the squirllies, you are in over your head.
And 30 seconds later...yep, confirmed.
What a waste of a nice road to get stuck behind a tool like that. Reminds me one of my rides down Iron Mountain Road in the Black Hills / South Dakota while at Sturgis - it's well marked on all the Sturgis maps as not being a newbie road and many of us riding it were having a ball. I came up to one of the famous corkscrews and was dragging hard bits through it only to nearly pile into the back of an ******* on a full dresser Harley duckwalking through the corner, clearly terrified and barely able to keep his bike up because of the camber. And there were lots of people on the other advanced roads like Needles who would also refuse to let faster riders go around them. Grrrr.
I drive on Danforth all the time, I like the one way each direction traffic. Less morons trying to jump into the right lane and cut you off during the intersection before they hit the parked cars in front of them.
Yah until every other block with Uber Drivers and Taxis using it as a parking lane. Even on Sherborne with it being raised wasn't enough, which is why all the new lanes come with concrete dividers.
Property taxes pay for roads, gas taxes pay for the Ontario highways. With the City allowing developers to cut back on parking spots in condo buildings. Eventually we will become a city of cyclists whether anyone likes it or not. And their property taxes are paying for the roads just as much as yours.
Tradespeople don't have the option of taking the TTC or GO trains. Expect to pay more for service calls unless everyone else leaves their cars at home.
Mad Mike
Well-known member
I’m not downtown enough to comment on Uber andTaxi drivers. Out here in the suburbs most cyclists stick to the cycling lanes. I do have complaints - cyclists don’t always see stop signs or traffic signals, some use sidewalks, many are inconsiderate on the multiuse pathways around here.
I’m not going to waste a lot of time educating you on shared costs and civics. I’ll leave it at this: user fees and gas taxes collected by Ontario equal 100% of public spending on road building, maintenance and policing including road and roadside bike lanes. If you happen to live in southern Ontario, It’s closer to 110%.
Oh trust me I know. I drive a service van every day.
You can leave it at whatever you want it to be, but you are wrong.
Government Spending on Transportation - Tables 1-6
Local Municipalities are paying $13.148 billion for municipal roads. Federal and Provincial transfers amounted to $1.4 billion. A mere 9.6% of local roads were funded through gas taxes and provincial/federal fees. AND that also is lumped together with the provincial and federal transit subsidies. So no, municipal roads are still being paid for primarily by property taxes.
The Ontario provincial government spent $7.964 billion on roads, but user fees and provincial gas tax revenues accounted for $3.279 billion. Which means that short fall of $4.7 billion was income taxes that paid for it. So even the provincial highway system is dependant on taxation of all Ontarians not just "drivers".
Danforth was two full lanes with the parked cars. Either the city screwed it up, or people disregarded the signs and the city did nothing.
Used to drive from Main St. to Davenport every day after school in the inside lane during high school. It wasn't a problem.
Two full lanes during rush hour when parking is supposedly prohibited. Which never stopped people from stopping.
The right lanes on Danforth were never wide enough for driving on with cars parked (unlike parts of Young or Mount Pleasant).
The people who think they fit, yet had half their cars in the left lane were part of the problem. Which has now been eliminated.
Mad Mike
Well-known member
LOL.Oh trust me I know. I drive a service van every day.
You can leave it at whatever you want it to be, but you are wrong.
Government Spending on Transportation - Tables 1-6
tc.canada.ca
Local Municipalities are paying $13.148 billion for municipal roads. Federal and Provincial transfers amounted to $1.4 billion. A mere 9.6% of local roads were funded through gas taxes and provincial/federal fees. AND that also is lumped together with the provincial and federal transit subsidies. So no, municipal roads are still being paid for primarily by property taxes.
The Ontario provincial government spent $7.964 billion on roads, but user fees and provincial gas tax revenues accounted for $3.279 billion. Which means that short fall of $4.7 billion was income taxes that paid for it. So even the provincial highway system is dependant on taxation of all Ontarians not just "drivers".
Canadian (fed/prov/municipal) gov't don't use strict earmark budgets, they collect into general revenues then redistribute to fund programs and adhoc transfers to provinces, who ultimately look after capital and maintenance spending on roads. . If drivers contribute $1 and the cost or maintaining the road is $1, it doesn't matter what level of gov't is paying for it.
By the way, Ontario taxpayers pay about $2 billion in driver/motor vehicle licensing and vehicle registration fees, $7 billion in fuel taxes ( your numbers were a decade old), and another $3.2b in HST. In total the motorists using the roads cough up approx $12.2B. You were correct on the spend being somewhere around $8B.
Numbers are a decade old but at least they are verifiable.
Right from the Ontario budget Fuel Taxes collected ...
2018-2019 $774 million
2019-2020 $807 million
2021 Ontario Budget | Chapter 3
2021 Ontario Budget — Ontario's Action Plan: Protecting People's Health and Our Economy
budget.ontario.ca
So even if I take your $2 billion in licensing at face value, you are still about $5 billion dollars short in covering provincial road costs.
Mad Mike
Well-known member
You forgot a the federal taxes paid by road users. Also remember HST is collected on rose taxes.Numbers are a decade old but at least they are verifiable.
Right from the Ontario budget Fuel Taxes collected ...
2018-2019 $774 million
2019-2020 $807 million
2021 Ontario Budget | Chapter 3
2021 Ontario Budget — Ontario's Action Plan: Protecting People's Health and Our Economy
So even if I take your $2 billion in licensing at face value, you are still about $5 billion dollars short in covering provincial road costs.
it doesn’t matter which coffer the tax goes into, it’s all general revenues.
If you really want to simplify things, cut off all road use taxes and fees paid by drivers to operate vehicles and you lose $12.2b revenues. Do the same for cyclists and you lose exactly $0.
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Straw-man argument. If it was only bicycles on the roads what would the road repair budget look like?
Mad Mike
Well-known member
Empty argument. There would only be dirt paths.
maybe dirt paths can again be part of the solution.
Federally it's 10%, provincially it's 14.7%
So simple math since we know the provincial collections...
$807 million * (10%/14.7%) = $549 billion Federal Fuel taxes
($807 + $549)*1.13 = $1.532 billion
I still don't see your quoted $7 billion in taxes.
Edit ... To break it down even including the carbon taxes and all other portions of tax on gasoline....
48.5 cents per liter is all taxes. Provincial is 14.7 again...
$807 * (48.5/14.7) = $2.66 billion
Still not getting to your make believe number of $7 billion in fuel related taxes... I wonder why. Oh right it's complete ********.
Let alone the fact you still don't understand municipalities pay for their own roads, and they collect revenues from property taxes. The transfers down from fuel taxes and other revenues amount to less then 10% of the cost of roads for municipalities.
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Or the fact the majority of the provincial fuel taxes he is assuming pays for municipal roads, goes to the 400 Series highway system.
Don't need to pay for that if all people had were bikes.
And of course, as we covered, the people in these TdF wannabe groups also own vehicles and also tend to be wealthy enough to afford four (even five) figure bikes. They pay plenty of taxes already. These routes are also far enough away odds are they actually drove said vehicle to the meeting point.
The people that are riding bikes to commute in the city because they do not own a car (usually not in the money for them) are the ones not paying "MM's taxes". That and of course kids. How is it ethical/moral to tax either of these groups in an attempt to get them off bicycles???? (Sorry to pay thier "fair share", but we know that is not what this is about.....). In the case of commuters they also pay rent, which contributes to property taxes, which pays for part of the city streets......
The people that are riding bikes to commute in the city because they do not own a car (usually not in the money for them) are the ones not paying "MM's taxes". That and of course kids. How is it ethical/moral to tax either of these groups in an attempt to get them off bicycles???? (Sorry to pay thier "fair share", but we know that is not what this is about.....). In the case of commuters they also pay rent, which contributes to property taxes, which pays for part of the city streets......
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