Let the motorcycle shops die! As we are all price-driven the solution is so simple and most are following it because one-by-one the local shops are starting to close. As well the disty's are start to go out of business. Give us one reason why we need B&M, we can get the information we need about anything from people who really care and know their stuff by simply asking anyone on this forum. Do we really need to go to a shop to try something on when we can order four different sizes and returns the ones the don't fit? Its time to stop supporting the local shop that has no inventory has people who don't care and only use the catalogue from the disty to order from.
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Showrooming
- Thread starter TK4
- Start date
Um other businesses are not chartered to multiply their capital....like renting the same house to 30 different people all at once.
Because they are chartered by the community they have a responsibility to the community they serve. Credit unions do a better job in that regard.
When the four pillars concept was abandoned ( keeping mortgages, insurance. banking separate by law )...it was an invitation to predation by Canadian banks.
They are not chartered by the community. Your example of renting the same house to 30 people at the same time makes no sense. We should probably discontinue this discourse, I'm a complete capitalist, land owner and altho I sit on the board of a ' not for profit' corporation, its not a no profit.
Wow, how did Showrooming get into a conversation on banks, small business and disty. The issue here is we are all price-driven and it does not matter were get the items from as long as it the cheapest possible price. Let call a spade a spade, we all talk about supporting the little as long it's not a local shop. We have no issue going direct to a little manufacture to buy some obscure part, but when we want a new helmet or the even "that" new Dainese jacket the only place we may get a better deal is that local shop. You can buy direct from Dainese knowing full well they are going to get the highest margin (evil profit - screwing us the customer) for themselves or can buy it from a US or even a Canadian on-line retailer. The problem is some are going into a local shop to try something or learn all about the latest "wiz-bang" just to go home and buy it on-line. Tell me this when all the shops are gone where are you going to try on that jacket? Then again I guess we can start trying on helmets and jacket Thursday nights at Leslie and Lakeshore.
Mad Mike
Well-known member
While it's true there are exclusive distribution agreements in place, these too are generally good for the consumer. The motive for forming exclusive agreements is NEVER centered around jacking prices, it's about accessing the market. Where exclusive deals are in place it's normally because the manufacturer's niche is too small to support multiple distributors (meaning the manufacturer can't convince another distributor to carry their line) OR the manufacturer doesn't have the interest or resources to market inside Canada and a distributor approaches them with a promise of business in exchange for exclusivity - making it bonus revenue for the manufacturer. Either way the product becomes available in Canada (which is the primary benefit to the consumer).
Remember no (free market) businesses have altruistic pricing, they price at a point where they can capture the volume that maximizes profit. profit
This is somewhat true. Exclusive agreements tend to increase access to products in the beginning as they are heavily promoted, for niche products prices will probably rise, for mass products exclusivity almost always falls away as soon as the product has traction in the market as it's no longer the best option for the manufacturer.
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Mad Mike
Well-known member
I think your first statement is a bit of a misconception -- particularly for merchants. Consumers need to understand the benefit of dealing with a vendor, it's the vendor's job to make the benefits clear. A consumer will seek out the 'best price' when all things are equal, however they will pay a premium if they receive a benefit of value in exchange. There are only a handful of valuable benefits a vendor needs to understand - Save money, make money, save time, convenience, and piece of mind -- if a B&M can't deliver additional benefits then all they have to compete is price.
If it was only a best price game, how can we explain why the Canadian market share leaders in these commodities have the highest prices:
- Mobile Phone Service (flanking brands offer 10-30% discounts on plans and phones yet their parent brands hold bigger shares at higher prices)
- Mobile Phones (Prices range from $150-1000+ for similar functionality)
- Personal Banking (you can get free bank accounts, yet most Canadians pay more than $100/year for personal banking and the two biggest banks are the two highest priced)
- Cars explain why they are not being killed by showrooming?)
- Motorcycles
TK4
Well-known member
Do I detect a note of sarcasm ? If so, I approve this post.
I don't know where you get your info, but prior to retirement I spend 35+ years in logistics and procurement and I can tell you with 100% certainty that exclusive distribution rights always resulted in higher selling prices to clients vs. a model where the exact same product was available through multiple channels.
Motovan and Parts Canada own Canadian motorcycle non OEM parts distribution and many, if not most of the product lines they carry, are exclusive to either one of them. At this point US based manufacturers probably have little real incentive to change this arrangement as Canadian customers either purchase parts indirectly through Motovan ot Parts Canada or they purchase then online direct from the manufacturer or through a US retailer. Anyway you look at it they get the sales. The big loser here is the relatively small shop Canadian bike retailer who has little opportunity for parts and accessories sales to contribute to their overall revenue and this is a key contributor to why so many of them going out of business.
bigpoppa
Well-known member
"I am expected to aggressively sell products, especially Visa. Hit those targets, who cares if it's hurting customers."
I've always said debt is a lot like dope, needs strict regulation and enforcement. Like morphine, great in an emergency when prescribed by a qualified physician, but can lead you down a dark and addicting path.
And much like drugs, "Just saying no" sounds great in theory, but in practice it doesnt work like that.
Debt is a personal choice. If a person spends more than they earn and relies on a credit card for basic needs, then they get what they deserve. Most people that do that are using credit for "wants" not "needs".
You can't compare an addicted drug user to a person that has to have their $6 latte on their credit card every morning.
In practice (reality) that is the way it works.
You can't compare an addicted drug user to a person that has to have their $6 latte on their credit card every morning.
In practice (reality) that is the way it works.
Trials
Well-known member
So would you say that anybody who actually uses credit cards for credit is pound salt loony foolish?
Mad Mike
Well-known member
I get my info from managing Canadian, US and European 2 tier distribution strategies for a number of companies for 2+ decades. I do agree that exclusive deals are more likely to juice margins for the distributor however at the end of the day it's still going to be better for the consumer than not having the product in the market. Manufacturers typically don't want exclusive deals -- they are there out of necessity when the market is too small or of little strategic value to them. Remember the grey market for motorcycle things is very accessible to consumers, this keeps prices in check too.
I think you are missing the big picture.
1) Without 2 tier distribution we would be importing every part and accessory through US retailers, they are not a necessary evil, they are part of an efficient supply chain that gets products to market cheaper than any other selling scheme. This benefits consumers with increased availability and lower prices.
2) Exclusive distribution deals further enhance access and reduce prices for consumers. Understand that exclusive deals are always done when it's not practical for a manufacturer to have an open deal, those are the situations that need higher prices to support the lower volume. If everything had to be open, disty's simply wouldn't carry low volume or niche manufacturers and the consumer would bear the additional cost of importation.
I can't see how the 'big loser' is the little bike shop. They have 1-2 day access to millions of parts and accessories, credit (which they aren't getting from a hundred different suppliers), consolidated inbound shipping (imagine shipping cost alone if a dealer had to order a lever from Kimpex, a filter from Yamaha and a bearing set from Alls Balls -- the freight alone would be more than the parts cost). They also get some consolidated marketing support like custom catalogs, banners, and event support.
Absolutely not.I have a few credit cards.(never a balance on them) Paying interest month after month is very foolish tho. Same as borrowing from one card to pay another. Stupid is as stupid does.So would you say that anybody who actually uses credit cards for credit is pound salt loony foolish?
bigpoppa
Well-known member
Buying heroin is also a personal choice. I have never used in my life.
I never thought that I would ever say this, but "I'm glad I'm old" lol
Yes the world is changing, in many ways, but I won't go into all the ones that upset me.
But I agree, in a few years we will have very little choices to buy our motorcycle gear, it will be mostly online.
I love going to motorcycle shops. I love going to motorcycle shows in the winter, I go every year. I can't go riding, but I love the atmosphere, I love looking at all the new and old bikes, new gear, even if I am not in the market to buy anything. I enjoy the experience.
Motorcycle shops are not charging you too much, or ripping you off. They have to stay in business, and that costs money.
Lets say that your wife makes fancy baseball caps. (or whatever) You think I can sell these. So you start a business and you sell these online, out of your basement for $10. Sales are good, you're making money, so you decide to open a retail store. (because you're nuts lol) Now you have to pay rent, insurance, heat, hydro, taxes, staff... So now you can't sell those caps for $10. You might have to charge $15, or more. Are you ripping people of? No, because you need to stay in business. If you enjoy this business this is what you have to do.
Yes the world is changing, in many ways, but I won't go into all the ones that upset me.
But I agree, in a few years we will have very little choices to buy our motorcycle gear, it will be mostly online.
I love going to motorcycle shops. I love going to motorcycle shows in the winter, I go every year. I can't go riding, but I love the atmosphere, I love looking at all the new and old bikes, new gear, even if I am not in the market to buy anything. I enjoy the experience.
Motorcycle shops are not charging you too much, or ripping you off. They have to stay in business, and that costs money.
Lets say that your wife makes fancy baseball caps. (or whatever) You think I can sell these. So you start a business and you sell these online, out of your basement for $10. Sales are good, you're making money, so you decide to open a retail store. (because you're nuts lol) Now you have to pay rent, insurance, heat, hydro, taxes, staff... So now you can't sell those caps for $10. You might have to charge $15, or more. Are you ripping people of? No, because you need to stay in business. If you enjoy this business this is what you have to do.
Someone who is addicted to opiates, got there by trying to relieve a pain of some sort.
Someone who is addicted to credit card use is just stupid or lazy or both.
Perhaps look up fractional lending and we'll leave it at that.
They are chartered by the Canadian Banking Act and last time I checked....that was our current community.
Fractional reserve is useful when used to match an expanding economy with money supply...disastrous when it fuels speculation.
The reserve requirement is often 3% - hence renting out house/money 30 times.
Debt is only a tool and needs to be managed responsibly. Like gambling there will be a segment of society that fails to do so. Payday loans and other predatory practices on a vulnerable segment are somewhat controlled by legislation as is loan sharking.
Given the banks inherent privileges granted by the nation, more can be done to support access to reasonable cost loans to small businesses as other mixed economy nations do.
One positive aspect of the fast moving of information on line it allows small local businesses like AceTech is to get the word spread quickly and cost effectively.
....and the same information flow will at some point link lenders with borrowers equally cost effectively..
and disintermediate the banks.
Re distributors ... As far as I can tell, Parts Canada = Parts Unlimited = Parts Europe. Logo looks too similar to be anything but different branches of same outfit for different geographic areas. But if Parts Canada doesn't have what you want, yet one of the other two does, none of them will lift a finger to help.
bigpoppa
Well-known member
Someone who is addicted to opiates is there because they are stupid, or lazy, or junkies.
See what I did there?
Its always easy to judge.
Debt should be treated like a controlled substance, of course those who peddle it and hand it out like candy or profit from it wont like that idea.
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