Patrick Brown Elected Head of Provincial Conservatives

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Rob MacLennan said:
And now the Liberals are doing something that was specifically rejected by the Ontario electorate; selling off government assets. They've been given a majority mandate, so no one can stop them from doing it. Yup, it's on the PCs.
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Reverse of federal politics. Voters need to realize that majority is just that. You could universally conclude that majorities are bad for Canadian politics, because the politicians will do anything they want once given such majority mandate. People used to say that majority allows to move things forward (not exactly the way all voters want, but at least for some ...) and minority governments would just stall things. Maybe the stalling is more suited for the Ontario/Canada political spectrum ....
 
Nice start for the new boy yesterday ... embarrassed himself and all of that without a seat in the particular legislature. Jeez, doesn't he have smart advisers??? Oh I forgot, this PC party of Ontario ....
 
I am still trying to get my head around this, but here is one working scenario... Maybe they figure the Liberals are so bad that people will vote for them regardless of what they say or do? So instead of trying to bring the party to the centre to win swing votes (and win the next election) they are instead going to ignore the voters and just push their own personal homophobic, anti-women’s rights agendas and the people will have no option but to vote them in.

Problem is, they have been trying something similar with different out there policies over the last 12 or so years... Did not work then, will not work now.

I also think Wynne is smarter than anyone gives her credit for. She put Brown in that spot (he had no business being there, he does not have a seat) because she knows he is going to crap the bed over and over again. Expect to see more of this. She looks good by letting him do it, the PCs look stupid by letting him talk about actual stuff… If he is not there and he is talking after the fact it gives him time to prepare (or for people to prepare him), on the spot he looks like what he is. Come a bi-election I expect the Liberals to basically let him win so the side show can be everyday...

And of course, won't the PCs need to "bribe" a canidate to step down so he can run?
 
nakkers said:
There is no sign of the Provincial Conservatives getting the message and even if they try to show they are not socially conservative, no one believes them. I don't believe them! I'm a conservative and can't support them.

And that's the problem. There is absolutely no accountability for billion dollar waste so it doesn't matter who is in power. Crap in the sand box and leave.
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I'm in the same boat, as the poster child for "progressive conservatism." I'm a political centrist. The further that the PCs (and Federal Conservatives) move to the wacky social Right, the more they lose me. The more that they talk about how our social safety net is being abused, while creating a safety net for business and the rich, the more they lose me. The more they cry about "law and order", while eroding our rights, the more they lose me.

And that applies to all parties.
 
backmarkerducati said:
And of course, won't the PCs need to "bribe" a canidate to step down so he can run?
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Imagine, nobody will play along which will expose him in possibly weak PC riding and he loses ...what then??? New PC leader elections .... LOL .... How can even choose someone to lead them Ontario and that someone does not have a seat in the current legislature .... mind boggling, at least for me.
 
mxs said:
Time we start seriously talking NDP ... :-)
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What sucks about them in Ontario (recently, not Rae…) is Horwath tried to steer the party a little more centre in the last election and there was an internal backlash about lost "values". They need to be more centre left to get in power but the faithful want them to move more left. Sort of just like the PCs, they need to move centre right to win an election yet the faithful are pulling them further right.

What happens in Alberta will have a big impact on the coming success of the NDP elsewhere in Canada. This is the first time in a long time they have had power in a province with a large economy. I think the last one was BC back in 2001, and that was nowhere near as high profile and did not go all that well if memory serves me correct. As the fortunes of Alberta go in the next few years so does the fortunes on the NDP. They have a chance to become legitimate contenders, if they don't screw up...
 
backmarkerducati said:
What sucks about them in Ontario (recently, not Rae…) is Horwath tried to steer the party a little more centre in the last election and there was an internal backlash about lost "values". They need to be more centre left to get in power but the faithful want them to move more left. Sort of just like the PCs, they need to move centre right to win an election yet the faithful are pulling them further right.

What happens in Alberta will have a big impact on the coming success of the NDP elsewhere in Canada. This is the first time in a long time they have had power in a province with a large economy. I think the last one was BC back in 2001, and that was nowhere near as high profile and did not go all that well if memory serves me correct. As the fortunes of Alberta go in the next few years so does the fortunes on the NDP. They have a chance to become legitimate contenders, if they don't screw up...
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Unfortunately the politicians at the top of all parties, both Provincial and Federal, only listen to their own fart-catchers. When you raise a point in a group of like minded people you're bound to get a pat on the back, even if what you said probably more deserves a punch in the face or, at the very least, a little edjamacation out back of the woodshed.

They also seem to want to more polarize their positions, thinking that it makes for an easier decision come election time. What it actually does, is make voters feel more and more disenfranchised. They stay away from the polls, thinking that no one represents their ideals.
 
Zoodles95 said:
Should have elected Christine Elliot. Brown is a federal PC Neocon and was endorsed by team Ford. Won't be getting my vote that is for sure. I either vote NDP or a protest vote. This indicates to me that the party really has not listened to the people of Ontario. There is a reason they have not been elected since 2003.
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Seriously? If you want someone that represents the average joe, Christine is not the answer. Her law firm did a class action law suit against the Region of Durham because of a lost memory stick that had the names of H1N1 vaccine recipients. The plaintiffs got nothing but her law firm made $500,000.00.
 
Icbones said:
Seriously? If you want someone that represents the average joe, Christine is not the answer. Her law firm did a class action law suit against the Region of Durham because of a lost memory stick that had the names of H1N1 vaccine recipients. The plaintiffs got nothing but her law firm made $500,000.00.
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So Mr. Brown is your man? Just asking.
 
Not sure yet. I just heard that he won, because I sure didn't want Elliot as leader. She backed Hudak and Tory with their loser platforms. She is an elitist lawyer who only backs issues that help her. She knew about the street racing law being based on a lie and she supported it regardless.
 
Icbones said:
Not sure yet. I just heard that he won, because I sure didn't want Elliot as leader. She backed Hudak and Tory with their loser platforms. She is an elitist lawyer who only backs issues that help her. She knew about the street racing law being based on a lie and she supported it regardless.
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If that's your metric then don't forget about everyone else who was sitting in the Assembly, at that time.
 
mxs said:
Time we start seriously talking NDP ... :-)
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The problem with horrorvath was she kept on the soap box about the Libs but propped them up come vote time and got very little to take credit for the NDP support. She ended up looking like a hypocrite.

The NDP are great at offering social programs and tossing funding at make work projects. They just don't have any realistic method that pay for it all. It would be the equivalent of giving them a Amex card with no limit and then finding out they didn't make any payments when up for election.

They will blame the greedy corps for moving business or lay offs.

I'm good with the NDP if they can lay out an economic plan that outlines a responsible budge. It's all smoke and mirror.
 
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Corporate structures demand greed. Personal fiscal accountability is non-existant. Governments waste vast amounts of money and give little value for the rest. And then we have the criminal element. Our culture sucks huge. Why do we expect so much from our institutions? Based on what?
 
Icbones said:
Not sure yet. I just heard that he won, because I sure didn't want Elliot as leader. She backed Hudak and Tory with their loser platforms. She is an elitist lawyer who only backs issues that help her. She knew about the street racing law being based on a lie and she supported it regardless.
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Well... Then who would you have chosen as leader? I can tell you as someone who wants a "Progressive" PC Party that Patrick Brown sure is not it. This guy is another Hudak and that path has clearly been rejected by Ontario voters. I want to vote PC but so long as they want to go the NeoCon/Republican clone route then they can stay on the sidelines until they wake up and move to right of Centre. So long as they stay on this path another party is going to govern this province. It is amazing that they punted away this opportunity.
 
nakkers said:
The problem with horrorvath was she kept on the soap box about the Libs but propped them up cone vote time and got very little to take credit for the NDP support. She ended up looking like a hypocrite.

The NDP are great at offering social programs and tossing funding at make work projects. They just don't have any skin realistic method that pay for it all. It would be the equivalent of giving them a Amex card with no limit and then finding out they didn't make any payments when up for election.

They will blame the greedy corps for moving business or lay offs.

I'm good with the NDP if they can lay out an economic plan that outlines a responsible budge. It's all smoke and mirror.
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She looked like a hypocrite because she was a hypocrite and when she thought she had a shot, she took it.

I will not vote NDP. Period. My world view is too different from theirs. I cannot vote Liberal as I recognized, way back in 2003, that McGuinty was talking out of both sides of his mouth simultaneously during the campaign. The blatant lies continued for years, and yet the electorate kept voting Liberal. Wishfully thinking that they would actually do what they claimed that they would despite evidence to the contrary? Perhaps. The lies, obfuscation, and potentially criminal acts (under investigation) continue.

And during all this time the PCs have failed to provide a reasonable alternative. Ernie Eves squandered the painful gains made under Harris, in just 6 months, by trying to buy his re-election. (As an aside this was the first time, in my life, that I formally declined my ballot in a Provincial election.) Runciman was a non entity. Tory stepped on his dick at every chance he got and ultimately lost because of a platform plank that McGuinty's father had actually put forth, decades before (the schools funding thing). Hudak couldn't decide if he was going to try and buy us all of with cheap beer, or if he was going to single-handedly swell the ranks of the unemployed in this Province by 100K government workers.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
She looked like a hypocrite because she was a hypocrite and when she thought she had a shot, she took it.

I will not vote NDP. Period. My world view is too different from theirs. I cannot vote Liberal as I recognized, way back in 2003, that McGuinty was talking out of both sides of his mouth simultaneously during the campaign. The blatant lies continued for years, and yet the electorate kept voting Liberal. Wishfully thinking that they would actually do what they claimed that they would despite evidence to the contrary? Perhaps. The lies, obfuscation, and potentially criminal acts (under investigation) continue.

And during all this time the PCs have failed to provide a reasonable alternative. Ernie Eves squandered the painful gains made under Harris, in just 6 months, by trying to buy his re-election. (As an aside this was the first time, in my life, that I formally declined my ballot in a Provincial election.) Runciman was a non entity. Tory stepped on his dick at every chance he got and ultimately lost because of a platform plank that McGuinty's father had actually put forth, decades before (the schools funding thing). Hudak couldn't decide if he was going to try and buy us all of with cheap beer, or if he was going to single-handedly swell the ranks of the unemployed in this Province by 100K government workers.
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Rob,

I'm in the same boat. I was being facetious about my comment of supporting the NDP. The reality is, they cannot fund their initiatives without getting cozy to big business. And they are all about the little guy.

All parties lie. It just a matter of which lies can we live with.

Switching gears to federal politics, I think Harper knows he's got no chance next election and doing the things he always wanted as a swan song.

I can't believe the party is supporting the stuff they are doing right now.

Going back to the province, I don't think they need a woman or minority as leader. But, the little track record that exists would suggest it's more of the same.

They need to bring back the progressive elements of the Conservative party and get a little more centre on the social. It's 2015. You can be supportive of family values and be inclusive to all.

Anyways, I've got nothing more to add. It's all just a sheet show.
 
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nakkers said:
I'm good with the NDP if they can lay out an economic plan that outlines a responsible budge. It's all smoke and mirror.
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I would accept such on those basis too, except for your last sentence, because all parties are smoke and mirror as far as economic plan and budget. In another words, they have no idea what will happen to their revenue (market drives that) so it all comes down to spending. PC was all smoke and mirrors as well as Liberals, so I would take this out of the equation to be fair to all three.
 
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