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Motorcycle Parking Fees Recommended without Notice or Public Consultation

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Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

My response to the form letter:

Thank you for your response.



I feel compelled to point out that any of the solutions, that have been put forth so far, will cost considerably more than the income received from parked motorcycles. Additionally the removal of the free on-street parking, in pay and display areas, will foster a situation conducive to exactly the sort of behaviour you wish to stop; parking on sidewalks and on the boulevard. Beyond that, it will limit the space available to other motor vehicles for parking, by segmenting that which already exists.



Maintaining the status quo, while actively pursuing those who choose to illegally park on sidewalks and the boulevard, is both the logical and fiscally responsible choice.

 
Re: We might lose free parking in Toronto

One thing I haven't seen on this discussion is how a rider will pay for a full days parking on street parking. Most cars don't park for a full day at a metered space...far too expensive. They park their cars in parking lots but I understand that many parking lots aren't too keen on having motorcycles in their lots so possibly we are out of luck. The other lots that did allow bikes used to charge the full whack for the spot as if we were a car so we don't get a break anywhere. If our lobbying efforts aren't successful I think we are in for a more expensive commute on our bikes.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

correct me if wrong, but isnt the sticker what they use over the pond?

i remember my cousin in sicily mentioning something like that, but i barely understand that ****ed up version of italian so who knows...

seems like the only viable option aside from scrapping the report and leaving as is.

I just hate politics, a motion to vote for a report to motion to vote then a motion to waste more time/money on frivolous things in our city and then somehow it will be passed and cost like a million and a half to implement...jezuz ****
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

Face said:
You can always send him an e-mail thanking him for his support! Councillor's get sick of always hearing complaints, and a little recognition goes a long way.

The public can't speak to the issue at the February Council meeting. Our chance to be heard is at the January 4th Public Works and Transportation Committee. Please see my earlier post, its #208 on page 11 for detailed info on how to get on the agenda so that you can speak.
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You are right and I just sent him a thank-you letter and also asked him what is going to happen now that the majority has voted for it.

Also, I'm not sure how many of you have been to Montreal and parked but they have a brilliant system when it comes to parking and paying for your spot.

Each spot is marked clearly on the road and has a post on the side walk or store wall stating the spots number. You go to the meter and pay like you do here but you put in the spot number. You get your ticket and you keep it. If you notice your time is about to run out you can go to the nearest meter to add time which is great becuase you don't need to rush back to your vehicle. It also makes the parking enforcements job much easier as they wouldn't have to walk up to each vehicle to even check if they have a ticket all they would have to do is check to see which spots are not payed for and see if there is a vehicle parked in it.

It's the only way I can ever see making riders pay for parking work for the city.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

rafiki911 said:
You are right and I just sent him a thank-you letter and also asked him what is going to happen now that the majority has voted for it.

Also, I'm not sure how many of you have been to Montreal and parked but they have a brilliant system when it comes to parking and paying for your spot.

Each spot is marked clearly on the road and has a post on the side walk or store wall stating the spots number. You go to the meter and pay like you do here but you put in the spot number. You get your ticket and you keep it. If you notice your time is about to run out you can go to the nearest meter to add time which is great becuase you don't need to rush back to your vehicle. It also makes the parking enforcements job much easier as they wouldn't have to walk up to each vehicle to even check if they have a ticket all they would have to do is check to see which spots are not payed for and see if there is a vehicle parked in it.

It's the only way I can ever see making riders pay for parking work for the city.
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Other cities around the world have similar parking or often, FREE parking sections on every other street for motorcycles. No sidewalk parking allowed.So, Imagine the cost of having meters put in for every spot in the city.. not something the council here will want to do as they just reduced costs by having those pay and display machines rolled out everywhere.

Interesting that in Tennessee, there is regulation against stipulating no Motorcycle parking on City owned lots and buildings. Building owners and managers have been forced to remove those signs. (I cant find the link, but found it the other day when reading about Deals Gap :) )

Oh, this article on segregation of parking is good: http://www.nbm.org/about-us/national-building-museum-online/inside-the-lines.html
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

It's not a meter for every spot. It is set up like ours where there is one on every block or so. I also did not say it would be cheap to set this up, I just said this would be one of the only ways to solve the motorcyle parking ticket issue if they want us to pay....

Either way I think it's rediculous to charge us for parking.
kiwi said:
Other cities around the world have similar parking or often, FREE parking sections on every other street for motorcycles. No sidewalk parking allowed.So, Imagine the cost of having meters put in for every spot in the city.. not something the council here will want to do as they just reduced costs by having those pay and display machines rolled out everywhere.

Interesting that in Tennessee, there is regulation against stipulating no Motorcycle parking on City owned lots and buildings. Building owners and managers have been forced to remove those signs. (I cant find the link, but found it the other day when reading about Deals Gap :) )

Oh, this article on segregation of parking is good: http://www.nbm.org/about-us/national-building-museum-online/inside-the-lines.html
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Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

aircooled5 said:
note that there will be regulations specifying that we must park at 90 degree's to the curb or as close to that as possible to allow others to make use of the extra space that a motorcycle doesn't take up. Lots of red tape and sticky things. Glad I'm retiring soon so I won't have to deal with this. However you can bet that the industry lobby group will be active in fighting this including the scooter importers and retailers.
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You currently can get ticketed for 90 degree parking. Its to stop people fitting in a tight gap and blocking cars from exiting. You need to park 60 degrees or less to the curb.

Havent heard much from the industry on this.. yet.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

rafiki911 said:
It's not a meter for every spot. It is set up like ours where there is one on every block or so.
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oh, that would be much more feasible.

Interesting.. maybe they are catching up on technology. In NZ we're been able to pay parking meters from cellphones for 5+ years. Similar method to what you describe.. remember the parking spot number and txt msg a number. You get billed on your phone bill.

I wonder if then they will make sidewalk parking illegal for scooters? (I always thought sidewalk scooter parking was legal if they are parked next to a bike stand) or do a crackdown on it?
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

aircooled5 said:
One thing I haven't seen on this discussion is how a rider will pay for a full days parking on street parking. Most cars don't park for a full day at a metered space...far too expensive. They park their cars in parking lots but I understand that many parking lots aren't too keen on having motorcycles in their lots so possibly we are out of luck. The other lots that did allow bikes used to charge the full whack for the spot as if we were a car so we don't get a break anywhere. If our lobbying efforts aren't successful I think we are in for a more expensive commute on our bikes.
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It's not that most cars don't park for a full day, it's that most cars aren't supposed to. There's a 3 hour limit on street parking that actually gets enforced on cars during peak times. These limits apply to bikes as well, but taggers/police have been letting it slide.

And I already addressed the "no motorcycles in parking lots" issue in another thread, but here it is again:

It has nothing to do with YOU, but has everything to do with other cars. The gates usually have sensors on the ground which the motorcycle may or may not trigger. Every time it doesn't trigger, a car gets out for free because you've left the gate open. They wouldn't close on you randomly unless you waited for about 5 minutes under one (and most don't even have a timer because of liability issues).

If you don't want to lose the privilege of parking in lots, any time you enter/exit and the gate doesn't close behind you, press the help button so they can close it manually. ALSO, the sticker on the machines comes from the company who makes the machines, not from the parking lots that use those machines. ;)

As for not allowing you in, they have every right as a private business (even green p falls under this). But most companies would have to be real jerks to actually enforce that rule.
 
Knowledge, good to know that information. Thanks , I must have missed the thread.

Oh, my point in tennessee was about vehicle segregation mainly.

If it Looks like there will something implemented.. Let's hope it's not just parking meters, but they put aside space for motor scooters and motorbikes to park every other street.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

In my opinion, the only way to realistically stop this from going forward is to get the 99.9% of city population that does not ride, i.e drivers, transit users, cyclists etc etc, to realize that this could result in a complete waste of their tax dollars. Other arguments like saving space, avoiding congestion, using less fuel etc, would have to be backed up factually to get the city to even consider it. This was addressed in other posts.

Honestly, the only thing politicians care about is votes I guess. If there's sufficient publicity, on how this could cost more tax dollars payers to implement and enforce, than the revenue it would generate, we might have a chance.

We'll have to look at how the city really plans on "implementing" this scheme. If it's a $100-200 a year, for a fixed secure tag mapped to say a license plate (to deter the possibility of theft) then it might not be a big dent to most commuters. However, to develop and implement a system like that is cost prohibitive. We simply don't have enough motorcycles parking in Toronto to justify a scheme like this. I'm pretty sure that we will see a drop in the number of commuters downtown, reducing revenues from 2 wheelers but probably allowing a fraction more spots to be used by cars.

It's just an idea, but if it can be shown that the city will not make any money, or probably lose more from it, it might get the rest of the public on our side.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

First they came for the garbage men, and I said nothing.
Then they came for the lazy slobs with subsidized housing, and I said nothing.
Now they come for me.

Ford, you used to be my hero, now I don't believe in anything no more.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

I wrote my councillor even tho I do not go downtown often.

xxx,


Thank you for emailing me on the issue of motorcycle parking. My office is compiling a list of local residents who feel strongly that the motorcycle parking exemption 2005 bylaw should not be revoked. Appreciated if you could send me your complete mailing address.

Below is the link to Councillor Del Grande's motion that has been referred to the Public Works & Infrastructure Committee for relevant City staff to report on the issue, additionally the public will have an opportunity to depute.

http://app.toronto.ca/tmmis/viewAgendaItemHistory.do?item=2011.MM14.19

The parking fee exemption for motorcycles can be found in the October 2005 minutes of Toronto City Council

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/2005/agendas/council/cc051026/wks9rpt/cl002.pdf
Appreciated if you could provide us with your complete address on Linden Avenue?

If you have further questions, please do not hesitate to contact my Executive Assistant, David Cavaco at 416-392-1660.
Thank You,




Michelle Berardinetti
Councillor, Ward 35 - Scarborough Southwest
Toronto City Hall
100 Queen Street West
2nd Floor - Suite A8
Toronto, Ontario M5H 2N2
' tel. 416-392-0213
: councillor_berardinetti@toronto.ca
Go to my website and sign up for my monthly e-newsletter!
P Go Green! " Re-think the way you print " Please consider the environment before printing this email.
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I hope this turns out in our favour
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

Everyone keep writing their councillors and copy Rob Ford (mayor_ford@toronto.ca). Here's what I've sent to my councillor and the mayor:

I was surprised to hear that this issue is being revisited as a means of earning more revenue. I thought it was the old council that sought to raise fees and taxes to cover out of control spending. This new council was supposed to find savings so that we don't have to pay more for services.

I believe that free parking for motorcycles has probably saved the city money. Free parking was one of the incentives that I considered when I decided to buy a motorcycle this year. Rather than driving my SUV to go shopping on Queen Street or for trips downtown, I now take my motorcycle which I can easily park in small spaces between parked cars.

I suppose if it weren't for free parking, I might be more inclined to take the SUV rather than the motorcycle, and with limited street parking spaces I doubt that any more money would be raised. Meanwhile, I would be contributing more to wear on the roadways, traffic congestion and air pollution by driving the larger vehicle.

If I had to pay to park my motorcycle on the street, I would have to pay the same rates as cars that take up five times as much space and contribute so much more to traffic congestion. I would also have to find a way to hold the parking permit onto my motorcycle. Without doubt it would often be stolen by others, perhaps to provide free parking for a big SUV. So instead of giving away parking for a motorcycle tucked in between cars, it will often be the Hummer driver who will get the free parking.

Of course, I will keep the receipt portion of every parking pass I pay for and will challenge any tickets I might receive in court. That will tie up the court's time, and the time of prosecutors working for the city. My fines will be reversed at great cost to the city, while the person who stole my parking pass will continue to enjoy free parking.

Its is fundamentally unfair to charge motorcyclists the same rate as vehicles that take up much more parking space. Unfortunately, the technology doesn't exist to charge different rates for different vehicles, or to ensure that the motorcyclist's parking pass isn't taken and used by others. Until the city can provide for this, it should leave free parking for motorcycles alone.
 
Re: City council voting on getting rid of free parking for motorcycles today

I missed the segment on the John Oakley show @ 640 AM radio, but I did catch a bit of it this Sunday. Mr De la Grandiose stated the usual and said that this as far as parking goes they're evaluating and if it turns out to be something that is not feasible then they would just shelve the program.

But it was interesting how he kept alluding to using cell phones to take a picture of the plate and make a payment. That still doesn't make sense, unless they plan on doing it for everyone and not just motorcycles as it doesn't justify the cost. So guess what, for those that don't have cell phones, the city now had to find a way of giving you one if they implement this system.
 
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