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MotoGP 2015
- Thread starter johnscruiser
- Start date
What he said at the press conference was just the beginning of it. The things quoted in the article are from his post conference scrum with the Italian media. I watched the first practice last night and they talked about it a lot. Apparently Vale showed up to the Italian media scrum with all the lap charts from last week... From all I heard last night, I assure you, he was pretty serious about the sand bagging accusations, as was Iannone. Now the personal stuff about Marc... Well, the master of mind games at work. Should be an interesting weekend.
I don't want to be a fan of Rossi because he's so perfect it's too easy to like him. So as you'd expect, with this claim he's made against MM, he's perfectly right.
I put together this graph of all the riders speeds over the course of the race and it's very, very clear that Marquez was up to something. He was messing up people's lap times in a way that looks entirely deliberate.
He was the most inconsistent rider of them all (orange line), but there is also a pattern to his inconsistency at various parts of the race. It's clear that his goals are to hinder Rossi as much as possible and win the race. We can see that he was by far the fastest, so he has complete control of everyone's pace. In fact Lorenzo was consistently very much slower than both Rossi and Iannone. If it hadn't been for Marquez, he would have finished off the podium. Marquez himself should have rocketed out to the lead while Rossi and Iannone might have had a great battle for 2nd.
It makes sense also looking at the extremely unusual tightness of the pack and number of passes. Sorry to say it, but that wasn't a real race we watched. Even the "greatest pass of all time" was a direct result of Marquez making Rossi's life impossible, and Iannone just being there to scoop up the easy prey.
Awesome graph. Pretty clear to see. Jorge opened up that gap mid race and Marc put in some laps at his real pace as I sighted before, lap 14 he went as fast as he did on the last lap. He had the pace to lead from the front or at least hang right behind Jorge until his customary 8 laps to go, then make his move. He usually does this when he has that kind of pace over the weekend but he didn't this time, and I don't think it's a stretch to infer he was willing to wait and hold Iannone and Rossi up, giving Lorenzo a great shot at the podium and finishing ahead of Vale. I've see a lot of people commenting here and elsewhere about Marc passing Jorge and how that contradicts Rossi's accusations, but I think it's clear, his intent was always to win, and if possible make life hard for Vale. Mission accomplished I'd say.
Vale's pretty smart though. By throwing this out in the public domain he's turned the eyes of the VR46 army on Marc, and if Marc value's his personal brand and all the merchandising $$$ that come with it, he'd be best served to go as fast as possible for the rest of the season. Vale's fans have a long memory, and when he retires, they'll be looking for someone to get behind. It won't be Marc if this continues. Ask Gibernau and Biaggi, or even Lorenzo and Stoner. Quarrel with Rossi and watch your popularity plummet
SweetOnion
Well-known member
This is it for me, to the letter. I have been watching Marquez closely since Moto2 when he was coming from behind on Bradl, and lost out after taking the eye injury. I have been patiently waiting for Rossi to retire and had seen Marquez as the next obvious choice to be my number 1 favourite after he does. Some of the events going on have made me a little bitter towards Marquez, but now that this is happening I am totally drinking the Rossi Haterade of Marquez. It's been a while already, since MM Crashed himself over VR's back wheel, and my friend and I jumped up at the TV screaming F-You Marquez and all the likes.... but if Marc really decides to go to war with Rossi, he will be the hated one of MotoGp for the rest of his career.
Touche... I hear Nicky Hayden Arai's will be on sale soon. haha
Quite possible. I'm not a real Rossi fanatic. But you can't argue with his fan appeal, and you shouldn't test his sway over their opinion. That has been tried before, and he's yet to loss a battle for the affection of the masses. We'll see what Marc does on Sunday
redridernl
Well-known member
Even if Rossi hasn't lost his marbles and MM intentionally slowed him down, so what. When Rossi was dominant he always pulled that crap on his rivals. If someone is slowing you down it's on you to make the pass. If you can't, sad day for you.
lator-illa
Well-known member
JL and MM even called Rossi out on it. To prove it on the track....damn
they're right
When did Rossi do that?
I know Jorge did it to Marquez when they were fighting for the championship, and that's fine. In this case Marquez had nothing to gain by making Rossi and Iannone's life difficult, except to avenge his petty sensibilities about 'injustices' inflicted on him by Rossi. So childish.
redridernl
Well-known member
(1)Practically every race when he was with Honda. Hang out, mess with whoever for 3/4 of the race and then clear off into the sunset.
(2) Exactly. He had nothing to gain. That's why what Rossi is accusing him of is so ridiculous. MM doesn't give a f what happens to anyone else during a race, he just wants to win.
(1) Did his messing about influence a championship battle he had no part in? I don't ever recall a similar situation, and I don't think he has, which is why he said what he said.... I think
(2) After some of the interviews this season and also watching Hitting the Apex, I think there's more to Marc than that goofy smile and the "I just want to win races" mantra. I get the impression he holds onto things.
I'm sorry to all the MM fans but the data seems to back up Rossi's claims.. That doesn't make it a fact, but I'm personally leaning that way, if for no other reason, Marc's attitude after Assen. There was a clear change in his demeanor towards Rossi from that race on... but then there is that data, and it is suspicious to say the least.
22 Oct - Sepang - Friday Tech Talk, Full Rossi Italian Press Interview, etc or TORRENT
Additional video with BTSport: https://www.facebook.com/devino.class/videos/1505775139720569/
Additional video with BTSport: https://www.facebook.com/devino.class/videos/1505775139720569/
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I was surprised to hear Rossi say this. I am a Rossi fan but I do not believe MM intentionally did that. If you remember the race when it went to the last lap between Rossi and MM Rossi had a 1 second lead on MM at the start of the last lap yet MM was able to close the gap on the last lap. Was MM sandbagging in that race as well? Given the pace the four front runners were running at and the closeness of that pack I do not believe MM was sandbagging. It was just good hard racing.
I am a bigger fan of MM than VR, and hate to say it but I just went and watched the race again and I have to agree with VR which until now I thought he was being a dick.
MM had the race under control, he made sure he could keep JL close enough to win but did stay behind to slow down VL, at one point he even looked back, MM never looks back when he is going at it.
IMO he knew exactly what he was doing and had it under complete control. MM wasn't even trying hard, you can see it on his body language.
He tested JL around lap 12 and once he saw he had JL easily on the bag, he slowed down.
If anything watch from lap 4 down, MM was cruising until he was passed by VR then the body language changes and he made sure to go pass VR again
MM had the race under control, he made sure he could keep JL close enough to win but did stay behind to slow down VL, at one point he even looked back, MM never looks back when he is going at it.
IMO he knew exactly what he was doing and had it under complete control. MM wasn't even trying hard, you can see it on his body language.
He tested JL around lap 12 and once he saw he had JL easily on the bag, he slowed down.
If anything watch from lap 4 down, MM was cruising until he was passed by VR then the body language changes and he made sure to go pass VR again
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It was pretty obvious MM stayed back to mess with Rossi. Around the last 6-8 laps, Lorenzo was slow enough that both Ianone and Rossi would have went past him, but it was MM who prevented that by holding back Rossi and Ianone. I would like Rossi to win, but may the best rider win between Lorenzo and Rossi in an open honest battle. I never liked any of the Spanish riders, but I'm going to hate Marquez for the rest of his career, as many will do, if he interferes with who wins the championship this year. If he has a hard on for Rossi now it's his own immature "all or nothing" attitude. Both times MM crashed behind Rossi it was his own fault, in Assen he cut the corner himself while he hit and pushed Rossi wide, did he expect Rossi from a leading position to open the door to him to fly by?!
The body language was a huge part of it for sure, and I'm betting it was for Rossi as well. You race with someone for a few years, you'll get to know their style, and when they're really giving it their all. There are tells for sure, Marc's poker face needs work
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