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Justin Time

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Always the same thing, gun laws change and the gun lovers point out that some recent shooting still happened...like any change will catch 100%.... if it is not 100% then do nothing--nice logic?

Harper was SO brave that smuggling through reserves did not happen under his watch, really? Turns out he was a coward as well? And so would have Scheer....
 
Always the same thing, gun laws change and the gun lovers point out that some recent shooting still happened...like any change will catch 100%.... if it is not 100% then do nothing--nice logic?

Harper was SO brave that smuggling through reserves did not happen under his watch, really? Turns out he was a coward as well? And so would have Scheer....
When was the last time you heard of a shooting in Canada using any of the legally acquired guns on the list? This change would prevent 0% of shootings in Canada is recent memory.

RR bikes kill infinitely more people than the entire collection of legal guns on that list. By your logic, RR bikes should be instantly banned and you are criminal if you want to own one because a life may be saved potentially, at some point in the future, maybe, if they were all crushed.
 
When was the last time you heard of a shooting in Canada using any of the legally acquired guns on the list? This change would prevent 0% of shootings in Canada is recent memory.

RR bikes kill infinitely more people than the entire collection of legal guns on that list. By your logic, RR bikes should be instantly banned and you are criminal if you want to own one because a life may be saved potentially, at some point in the future, maybe, if they were all crushed.

People are using RR bikes to murder other people, didn't know that was happening. Did not even know that was one of the purposes of an RR bike, learn something new everyday.

And yes Harper is still a coward...
 
As a reference lets look at some (most) of the most popular hand gun brands as used in crime and where they come from:

Glock -- Austria/USA.
Ruger -- USA
Sig Sauer -- Germany
Smith and Wesson -- USA
Springfield -- USA/Croatia
Taurus -- Brazil
Charter Arms -- USA

Hardly exhaustive and there may be some more offshore for these brands that I am not aware of but this gives a pretty good idea of "where" these guns are coming from (and where the companies are based). If it is not DIY made, they were legal sometime/somewhere....

Just so I do not have to type it again (hand gun examples above), they start as legal weapons in the first world, it is an international problem.... No legislation will be 100% unless the problem is stopped at the source.
 
People are using RR bikes to kill other people, didn't know that was happening. Did not even know that was one of the purposes of an RR bike, learn something new everyday.

And yes Harper is still a coward...
People are using RR bikes in deaths infinitely more often than the legally acquired guns on JT's list.

I did not comment on Harper because they are all idiots. JT is not worse, just different.
 
Just so I do not have to type it again (hand gun examples above), they start as legal weapons in the first world, it is an international problem.... No legislation will be 100% unless the problem is stopped at the source.
So stop handguns at the source. That is 99% of the problem.
 
Always the same thing, gun laws change and the gun lovers point out that some recent shooting still happened...like any change will catch 100%.... if it is not 100% then do nothing--nice logic?

Harper was SO brave that smuggling through reserves did not happen under his watch, really? Turns out he was a coward as well? And so would have Scheer....
Not do nothing, do something that makes sense. Speak with data.
 
People are using RR bikes in deaths infinitely more often than the legally acquired guns on JT's list.

I did not comment on Harper because they are all idiots. JT is not worse, just different.

More people drown in pools.... but are pools used to murder people? Is killing someone the purpose of pools? Gun crowd logic...
 
More people drown in pools.... but are pools used to murder people? Is killing someone the purpose of pools? Gun crowd logic...
I don't know what you are missing. The targeted pool of guns have not been used to kill people. You need to target the guns being used, not just a random pool of guns that looks scary.
 
I don't know what you are missing. The targeted pool of guns have not been used to kill people. You need to target the guns being used, not just a random pool of guns that looks scary.

Like the handgun list above.... every gun used in the Nova Scotia killings started out as a legal gun somewhere. Then there is the purpose of said device....not sure why THAT is hard to understand????

Does the ban list go far enough, nowhere near. Can more be done, yes of course. Is it a start, yes.

Luckily the gun crowd has been posting up lists of the equivalent weapons they missed, so the list can be updated/expanded next year... Nice of them to do that.
 
Like the handgun list above.... every gun used in the Nova Scotia killings started out as a legal gun somewhere. Then there is the purpose of said device....not sure why THAT is hard to understand????

Does the ban list go far enough, nowhere near. Can more be done, yes of course. Is it a start, yes.

Luckily the gun crowd has been posting up lists of the equivalent weapons they missed, so the list can be updated/expanded next year... Nice of them to do that.
They started as a legal gun not in Canada. The existing laws already made his possession illegal. Making thousands of guns not used in crimes illegal without even attempting to deal with the main source is the worst kind of politics.
 
Like the handgun list above.... every gun used in the Nova Scotia killings started out as a legal gun somewhere. Then there is the purpose of said device....not sure why THAT is hard to understand????

Does the ban list go far enough, nowhere near. Can more be done, yes of course. Is it a start, yes.

Luckily the gun crowd has been posting up lists of the equivalent weapons they missed, so the list can be updated/expanded next year... Nice of them to do that.

Every alcohol starts out harmless but kills more and ruins more lives. How many people are killed from a drunk driver every year or have family members suffering from alcohol abuse? More in a week than guns do in a year in Canada.
What is the purpose of said drug?
So lets punish all the law abiding people enjoying their hobby? Let's shut down distilleries, bars, LCBO. Turn in your now illegal whisky collection, it could get stolen and end up in the wrong hands.

No it would be senseless, we look at stopping drunk drivers, create a stigma, help those with abuse issues.
Same thing with these shootings, the target should be mental health, youth outreach in known gang-areas. It's all kids in their teens doing these shootings.
 
They started as a legal gun not in Canada. The existing laws already made his possession illegal. Making thousands of guns not used in crimes illegal without even attempting to deal with the main source is the worst kind of politics.

It is why it is a global problem and we have it tougher than most due to the US and their screwed up gun culture. But every single one of those guns started its life as a legal firearm.

Like I said in the dog thread, these bans (like pitbull) are not simplistic and just about the banned thing. The ban also targets the type of people that own these types of items. Not everyone who owns them is the type, but too many are. It is almost always deeper than what it seems... Generally the guy (like me) who owns a hunting rifle is different than the guy that has a bunch of "black guns"....

Every alcohol starts out harmless but kills more and ruins more lives. How many people are killed from a drunk driver every year or have family members suffering from alcohol abuse? More in a week than guns do in a year in Canada.
What is the purpose of said drug?
So lets punish all the law abiding people enjoying their hobby? Let's shut down distilleries, bars, LCBO. Turn in your now illegal whisky collection, it could get stolen and end up in the wrong hands.

No it would be senseless, we look at stopping drunk drivers, create a stigma, help those with abuse issues.
Same thing with these shootings, the target should be mental health, youth outreach in known gang-areas. It's all kids in their teens doing these shootings.

Same tired old strawman arguments.... look at this other thing.... who will think of the children... blah blah blah...

Alcohol is not made for someone to use to kill someone else. I'm sure it happens but that is not the intended purpose of alcohol, or pools or RR bikes or sports cars, or whatever tired old strawman argument. The intended purpose of the device is the difference. A hunting rifle as an example, can very easily kill someone but that is not the main purpose of the device.

Now if we were debating a smoking ban (as an example) than these specific strawman arguments would have direct meaning because the subject is not the intended purpose but instead just the outcome. For the very incomplete "assault" rifle ban, intended purpose of the device appears to be more, or as, important than the simplistic numbers outcome.


I still say the simple solution, every gun should be hot pink (all of it), that way the need a gun to feel like a big man crowd will just stick to giant pick-ups...
 
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It is just as much about targeting Canadians that are just like this guy or look up to Americans like this.... than anything else. BTW look at where this idiot's finger is!

Coward.jpg
 
Like I said in the dog thread, these bans (like pitbull) are not simplistic and just about the banned thing. The ban also targets the type of people that own these types of items. Not everyone who owns them is the type, but too many are. It is almost always deeper than what it seems... Generally the guy (like me) who owns a hunting rifle is different than the guy that has a bunch of "black guns"....

I still say the simple solution, every gun should be hot pink (all of it), that way the need a gun to feel like a big man crowd will just stick to giant pick-ups...
Pitbulls were legal, their legal owners were the type that you mentioned, it does suck that the ones legal were wrapped up in it.
But what 'type' of gun owner are you talking about? No one with 'scary black rifles' in Canada have gone on shootings for over 20 years. There are no 'types' of legal gun owners committing crimes.
That is the issue, that's like targeting the people on prescribed opiods because of dealers selling illegal ones. It's two different groups.

The original design of every gun back historically was to shoot and kill something. But the none of the ones sold in Canada are designed to kill people. They are for hunting or sporting, that's it. All of these rifles are designed to hunt or shoot targets, all the ones on the ban list are actually terrible at killing people, the round is too small. Shotguns, larger caliber hunting rifles do a much better job.

Yes, think of the children, think of the lives. Isn't the point of a ban, save lives? I am just showing you an alternative that saves more lives with something just as non-essential in everyday lives.

But if you just think guns = killing/bad , then there is no argument.
 
Are we really suggesting that we should be creating laws against people we "don't like" because "we don't like them"? That's a VERY slippery slope.

The whole "guns are always legal at some point" argument doesn't make any sense whatsoever. "gun culture" doesn't kill anyone either, and neither does dressing up and cosplaying like a soldier doesn't kill anyone either. It may make you uncomfortable and it may be stupid af, but it doesn't kill anyone. There is no study suggesting that playing dressup or liking black 'scary' guns causes you to kill people; correlation is not causation, even if there was a correlation. That just sounds like the old "violent video games are tainting our children and making them killers" argument that has never panned out.

Just like addiction problems, we are going to have to do something other than banning things. There needs to be action taken to solve root causes of why people start wanting to kill others, and then follow through on it. Liking guns is not a root cause in the same way that liking bread doesn't turn you into a farmer.
 
Like the handgun list above.... every gun used in the Nova Scotia killings started out as a legal gun somewhere. Then there is the purpose of said device....not sure why THAT is hard to understand????

Does the ban list go far enough, nowhere near. Can more be done, yes of course. Is it a start, yes.
Again you're missing the point. Speak with data.

If the issue doesn't stem from Canadian gun owners then why are we targeting them and spinning it like it does.
 
"Legal" guns are used in mass shootings and murders in the US all the time. They hide the statistics and the NRA hides behind the concept that once the gun is used in a crime it is no longer legal regardless of how it was obtained.... Look at Sandy Hook as an example, both guns were legally purchased by his mother, sure he took the guns and killed her, but they were legally purchased guns he had access to. To the NRA and gun lobby they were illegal... semantics.

Any legislation is always about more than just the one obvious thing, the world is not one dimensional, super cute to think otherwise. Yes this legeslation is not just about what is in black and white on the paper, it is also about idiots like the guy in the meme and not letting it get like that in Canada (or more like that), sucks non-idiots get lumped in.
 
"Legal" guns are used in mass shootings and murders in the US all the time. They hide the statistics and the NRA hides behind the concept that once the gun is used in a crime it is no longer legal regardless of how it was obtained.... Look at Sandy Hook as an example, both guns were legally purchased by his mother, sure he took the guns and killed her, but they were legally purchased guns he had access to. To the NRA and gun lobby they were illegal... semantics.

Any legislation is always about more than just the one obvious thing, the world is not one dimensional, super cute to think otherwise. Yes this legeslation is not just about what is in black and white on the paper, it is also about idiots like the guy in the meme and not letting it get like that in Canada (or more like that), sucks non-idiots get lumped in.
So to prevent something that has never happened in Canada, you should punish tens of thousands of law abiding people to potentially stop one person in the future?

The program seems to be to be grossly disproportionate in scope compared to the real problem. That money would make a much larger difference in safety in Canada if it was targeted at actual documented problems (eg gangs, handguns, illegal imports, etc) that happen almost daily instead of a potential theoretical thing that may happen at some point in the future.
 
Again you're missing the point. Speak with data.

If the issue doesn't stem from Canadian gun owners then why are we targeting them and spinning it like it does.

No data is needed. They were made in a factory in a first world country and sold legally into a supply chain. From there, stolen, straw buying and smugling... But they left the factory as perfectly legal firearms for the intended market.

Or are you saying US and European fore arm factories are selling arms directly to the black market?

Exceptions, DIY, 3D printing and maybe the odd weapon coming from the third world, not in this case.
 
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