I thanked the Mayor, did you??

[FullMotoJacket]

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Keep the bag fee.

Problem with the bag fee is there is no requirement in place to force the retailers to put the money generated into any form of a recycling program. As it stands, the $.05/bag goes into the corporation's general coffers, so all you're doing is padding their bottom line.

 

[CanadianBiker]

I took the time off to write a letter to the mayor and thanked him.

Good for you! People are always quick to complain but it's rare that anyone takes the time to write or call with thanks for a job well done.
I don't live in Toronto but I did write an email to Mr. Ford during the campaign supporting him and he got back to me within a day with a very nice personal response.

 

[nobbie48]

Problem with the bag fee is there is no requirement in place to force the retailers to put the money generated into any form of a recycling program. As it stands, the $.05/bag goes into the corporation's general coffers, so all you're doing is padding their bottom line.

That's profit they won't have to make on some other item. As a spin off it gets people to think about the environment.
The next step is to stop the influx of throw away paper goods. First floor mops and now someone is trying to bring in disposable hand towels for the home.

 

[CruisnGrrl]

That's profit they won't have to make on some other item. As a spin off it gets people to think about the environment.
The next step is to stop the influx of throw away paper goods. First floor mops and now someone is trying to bring in disposable hand towels for the home.

it's not profit instead of something else, rather it's just added profit. i don't have a problems with companies making $ but if this is for "environmental issues" then the $ should go into that

 

[inreb]

it's not profit instead of something else, rather it's just added profit. i don't have a problems with companies making $ but if this is for "environmental issues" then the $ should go into that

This hasn't been on my radar so just asking: how would 5 cents help with enviromental issues if I take the bag away from the store. Or is the 5 cent "buy in" cost supposed to encourage byob? This is very confusing.

 

[CruisnGrrl]

This hasn't been on my radar so just asking: how would 5 cents help with enviromental issues if I take the bag away from the store. Or is the 5 cent "buy in" cost supposed to encourage byob? This is very confusing.

thing is, it's not just 5 cents, how many bags to you seepeople using when they get a load of groceries... 4 maybe 6 bags? that adds up + the minor effect of encouraging people to use reusable bags.

 

[turbodish]

If the nickel cost encourages people to use reusable bags, then that's plenty enough reason to keep the fee in place. Reusable bags means fewer of the free plastic bags needing to be collected and put into recycling or landfill, and that ultimately saves the city (and the taxpayer) the costs associated with garbage collection and disposal of those plastic bags.

The bigger store chains have pledged to donate the nickel proceeds to environmental causes, and if they do so that's a bonus. And if a given store doesn't, so what? Pricechopper grocery stores were charging for plastic bags long before it was ever mandated by the city. It helped keep shelf prices lower.

 

[inreb]

If the nickel cost encourages people to use reusable bags, then that's plenty enough reason to keep the fee in place.

I don't like that type of social engineering, attaching a financial cost to behaviour. It punishes the poor while letting the rich off the hook. That would be like having only financial punishments for speeding.

If plastic bags are bad, they're bad for everybody. There's got to be a better way.

 

[FullMotoJacket]

Reusable bags means fewer of the free plastic bags needing to be collected and put into recycling or landfill, and that ultimately saves the city (and the taxpayer) the costs associated with garbage collection and disposal of those plastic bags.

Your solution just adds another problem to the mix.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/24/AR2010062406143.html

 

[TimC]

I've been corresponding with Mr. Ford since he threw hit hat in the ring....so I'm not gonna send him a formal thank you at this point

He got my vote...so he's got 4 years from me to prove his worth....but I really do like where his head is at....it's refreshing versus that arrogant condescending doofus Miller

with regard to the 5 cent bag tax....I think it's an insult....you've got a conveyor belt full of plastic-wrapped stuff to the tune of $200 and Miller had the audacity to charge 5 cents for bags so you can carry it out? what a joke....get on the manufacturers about their packaging if you really want to make a dent

so I simply stopped buying the plastic bags for the green bin and use the 5 cent bags instead (they're biodegradable now too) and it actually works out cheaper....so they can keep charging it for all I care, cause I'm not buying a box of pastic bags only to pay a fee for the bag to carry them out

if memory serves, they brought in plastic bags to replace paper bags way back because the tree-huggers were freaking out that we were destroying forests....now they complain about plastic and want us bringing in our own reusable ones....wonder what group is gonna get bent when droves of families are getting continually sick by carrying their groceries in their germ-infested reusable bags?

I get a kick outta watching the do-gooders load their reusable bags into their $70k BMW sport-utes that weigh 4200 lbs and get replaced off-lease every 4 years....way to do your part there Harvard grads

 

[Chaos]

I get a kick outta watching the do-gooders load their reusable bags into their $70k BMW sport-utes that weigh 4200 lbs and get replaced off-lease every 4 years....way to do your part there Harvard grads

You'll find hypocracy in anyone if you look hard enough.

 

[inreb]

You'll find hypocracy in anyone if you look hard enough.

It's easier to spot when it's egregious.

 

[CanadianBiker]

Plastic bags are certainly not good for the environment and using a brand new bag every time you buy one can of dog food is beyond wasteful but:

• most of those plastic bags saw at least one more use, even if it's just to pick up after the dog;
• many people also used them for bin liners, lunch bags, storage, etc. I always keep a couple in my saddle bags to wrap up something that I can't risk getting wet;
• now people who used to use grocery bags for garbage bags, poop bags, whatever are forced to buy use-specific bags for each of those tasks. The number of grocery bags may have declined slightly buy I have yet to see a reliable report stating that overall plastic bag production is down.
• those reusable bags are, as someone already mentioned, breeding grounds for bacteria. Unless you wash them every single time you use them and keep the meat bags separate from the vegetable bags, you're flirting with some very nasty stuff.

The worst part of the bag fee was the heavy-handed way in which Comrade Miller imposed it on the city, then turned it back on the stores by making them keep the fee and look like the bad guy. There's an associated cost to administering that fee and donating it to environmental concerns and guess who underwrites it? Not the stores, that's for sure.
Typical socialist economics.

 

[OliverK]

I don't think cancelling the Transit City plan after 7 years and 137million dollars, along with 1.3 billion in contracts merits a thankyou note.

 

[CanadianBiker]

I get a kick outta watching the do-gooders load their reusable bags into their $70k BMW sport-utes that weigh 4200 lbs and get replaced off-lease every 4 years....way to do your part there Harvard grads

Every single person on this board burns gas for fun, so we're hardly in a position to point fingers.
And no, I don't drive a BMW sport-ute weighing 4200 lbs.
It's a GMC SUV weighing closer to 5000 lbs.
Sure didn't cost $70K, though.

 

[turbodish]

I don't think cancelling the Transit City plan after 7 years and 137million dollars, along with 1.3 billion in contracts merits a thankyou note.

Agreed. His shift to supporting subways over surface light rail while at the same time supporting tax cuts is puzzling. Subways are much more expensive to build, especially in an already heavily built-up urban landscape like Toronto's. Unless Ford plans on having the province and feds kick in more funding (which means taxpayers outside Toronto get their pockets picked and makes a mockery out of Ford's anti-tax platform), this can only mean cut-backs in public transit expansion and increasing traffic congestion by private cars in the city. That is absolutely the wrong track to take for Toronto.

 

[short stop]

Agreed. His shift to supporting subways over surface light rail while at the same time supporting tax cuts is puzzling. Subways are much more expensive to build, especially in an already heavily built-up urban landscape like Toronto's. Unless Ford plans on having the province and feds kick in more funding (which means taxpayers outside Toronto get their pockets picked and makes a mockery out of Ford's anti-tax platform), this can only mean cut-backs in public transit expansion and increasing traffic congestion by private cars in the city. That is absolutely the wrong track to take for Toronto.

This one's easy to explain. When Toronto *doesn't* get the financial support Ford can just blame/vilify the feds and the province.

 

[RockerGuy]

Most ppl complain how with the cut in tax there will be no money to fund our transit system and get anything done. But how about the inherent waste of the tax payers dollars. For instance, I was talking to someone who worked for City Hall and they told me rather than have the excess money collected go to the other guy coming into office, they just had a spending splurge. Hiring ppl for no reason even tho they just come to work and twirl their fingers. What about the waste from those slackers from the TTC and the waste collectors?

Miller think that just taxing the ppl more will be the answer to the problems. That is hardly the solution. Its like celebrities who are in debt, they make millions but still claim they are in debt

 

[Chaos]

Agreed. His shift to supporting subways over surface light rail while at the same time supporting tax cuts is puzzling. Subways are much more expensive to build, especially in an already heavily built-up urban landscape like Toronto's. Unless Ford plans on having the province and feds kick in more funding (which means taxpayers outside Toronto get their pockets picked and makes a mockery out of Ford's anti-tax platform), this can only mean cut-backs in public transit expansion and increasing traffic congestion by private cars in the city. That is absolutely the wrong track to take for Toronto.

To be fair, Toronto generates a LOT of tax revenue for the province and the country. We definitely pay more out than what comes in. To ask for more money from the province and/or country does not bother me.

 

[CanadianBiker]

This one's easy to explain. When Toronto *doesn't* get the financial support Ford can just blame/vilify the feds and the province.

Nah, that was Miller's favourite move. Always somebody else's fault.
McGuinty has already stated that he will work with Mayor Ford on whatever his transit vision is, with the same level of funding he committed to Transit City, though likely no more.
McGuinty, and every other politician in Canada, is very aware of what Mr. Ford's decisive win indicates and he's not going to do anything to upset voters in Toronto, especially with an election this November. McGuinty and every other Liberal and left-leaning pol is scared witless right about now. Watch for all kinds of touchy-feely policies coming from Queen's Park in the next few months as he tries to mitigate two terms of scandals and tax increases.
With Rob Ford at the helm, Toronto might even end up having a working relationship with Ottawa, something Miller and his band of merry syncophants copuld never accomplish.

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