How to keep young people from turning to ISIS? | Page 22 | GTAMotorcycle.com

How to keep young people from turning to ISIS?

shahfaisal said:
The only thing I would like to bringto light is the shocking similarity between your EVIDENCE/point of view and the same provided by the nazis pre/during ww2
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"Recently ISIS has brought further disgrace on itself by adding vandalism to its atrocities. In Mosul, Iraq, its followers burned 8,000 books they found in libraries. “These books promote infidelity and call for disobeying Allah,” according to one ISIS soldier on the scene. “So they will be burned.”"

Weren't the Nazis fans of a good 'book bbq'?
 
klr_guy said:
Weren't the Nazis fans of a good 'book bbq'?
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As were/remain some southern Christians...

Pastor Terry Jone burned a Quran in Florida, and with righteous Christian glory blazing in his heart then proceeded north to burn the Quran in Dearborn Michigan.

Several instances of southern Christians burning the Harry Potter books.

Pastor Marc Grizzard planned to burn various editions of the Bible that he viewed as being heretical because they were not the King James Verion of the Bible. Apparebtly God got wind of the good Pastor's plans and intervened with heavy rains that day.

Of course Christians are not alone. Mass book burnings are popular symbolic repudiations committed by all sorts of religious and secular groups rejecting of all sorts of religious and secular ideas and beliefs. And guess what? Each and every one of them feels righteously justified in doing it.
 
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griff2 said:
As were/remain some southern Christians...

Pastor Terry Jone burned a Quran in Florida, and with righteous Christian glory blazing in his heart then proceeded north to burn the Quran in Dearborn Michigan.

Several instances of southern Christians burning the Harry Potter books.

Pastor Marc Grizzard planned to burn various editions of the Bible that he viewed as being heretical because they were not the King James Verion of the Bible. Apparebtly God got wind of the good Pastor's plans and intervened with heavy rains that day.

Of course Christians are not alone. Mass book burnings are popular symbolic repudiations committed by all sorts of religious and secular groups rejecting of all sorts of religious and secular ideas and beliefs. And guess what? Each and every one of them feels righteously justified in doing it.
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I would prefer that Islam burn books rather than burning, beheading and generally killing whomever they please.......
 
Snobike Mike said:
I would prefer that Islam burn books rather than burning, beheading and generally killing whomever they please.......
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Islam doesn't burn, behead and generally kill any more than Christianity burned, terrorized and generally killed blacks in the southern US. Deviants who distort their respective religions to justify such acts do that.
 
Snobike Mike said:
Here is a quote from this article: "“We are indeed here in America,” he said. “We’re in each and every state. We’re here in Ohio. We’re more organized than you think.”
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What you have is a quote from an individual. Nothing more. You can find similar quotes in every sphere.

By the way, a current Israeli MK who is a high-ranking minister in the current Israeli government and who is running for re-election is calling for the beheading of "disloyal" Israeli-Arabs. He claims to speak for many Israelis. Shall we take his words spoken as an individual as being representative of Israeli Jews? https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=...=MgoVy4XERwxonLlbIe1oOA&bvm=bv.87611401,d.eXY
 
griff2 said:
What you have is a quote from an individual. Nothing more. You can find similar quotes in every sphere.

By the way, a current Israeli MK who is a high-ranking minister in the current Israeli government and who is running for re-election is calling for the beheading of "disloyal" Israeli-Arabs. He claims to speak for many Israelis. Shall we take his words spoken as an individual as being representative of Israeli Jews? https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=...=MgoVy4XERwxonLlbIe1oOA&bvm=bv.87611401,d.eXY
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I see, so unless the individual says something loving about Islam it's discredited.

PS: It's kinda hard to have a group without a bunch of individuals..............
PPS: When you have enough in a particular group beheading and the like it warrants more than a shrug and the search for a new latte.......
 
Snobike Mike said:
I see, so unless the individual says something loving about Islam it's discredited.

PS: It's kinda hard to have a group without a bunch of individuals..............
PPS: When you have enough in a particular group beheading and the like it warrants more than a shrug and the search for a new latte.......
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1.8 billion Muslims in the world. Odds are good that you will have some extremists in there.
 
griff2 said:
If the jackboot fits...
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I am surprised at this post and also disappointed. You usually make informed, logical, and rational points in your posts. Shahfaisel equated me with Nazis and now you have elevated me to wearing part of the uniform of an SS member. I expected better of you.

At the very least you could have combed through Shahfaisal's post and found Nazi quotations and attempted to find things I have posted that would somewhat fit with that to somewhat substantiate Shahfaisal's hate filled allegations.
 
Zoodles95 said:
There are 2.2 Billion Christians in the World. There are not nearly the atrocities taking place with Christian hands presently.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_populations

If Christians were acting proportionally like Muslims right now the World would be pretty much done for.
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At one point not so very long ago, Christians were acting just as badly.

Let's not forget that a lot of the current violence in the emerging nations is a direct consequence of recent colonial rule and meddling in those nation's affairs by predominantly Christian western nations.

Those emerging nations are still in a nation-building stage equivalent to when Europe was transitioning from the dark ages to even recent times as it evolved to modern nation states? Do I need to remind you how many MILLIONS people died in the atrocities in the Christian world called WW1, WW2, the Balkan Wars, Kosovo, never mind the hundreds of European conflicts in predominately Christian realms before then? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_conflicts_in_Europe

What is happening in the middle east is little different. The nations there are artificial constructs drawn in pencil by Western powers on a map with little or no regard for ethnic and tribal differences. Now that the Western nations have by and large ended their colonial age and pulled out of direct rule over the middle east, now the indigenous people in that region are left to pick up the pieces.

Europe took centuries to resolve the worst of conflict there. Hopefully the middle east will work out their issues sooner than that.
 
griff2 said:
1.8 billion Muslims in the world. Odds are good that you will have some extremists in there.
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No doubt....

20% of Australian Muslims say Islamic State has legitimate grievances

People are surprised, are they? Why? These numbers reflect polls in many Western countries. The enemedia is blaming the Aussie government — as if defense against savagery, beheading, genocide, gender and creed apartheid is the fault of a government that would oppose it.

Notice that nothing in this article faults Muslims or their outrageous sanction of bloody jihad.

Moderates unmasked.


“Survey reveals Aussie Muslims who think ISIS has legitimate grievances,” By Neil Doorley,The Sunday Mail, March 08, 2015

A DISTURBING number of Australian Muslims say terror groups such as ISIS have legitimate grievances, despite condemning terrorism.

And the findings of a study to be released this week reveal the terrorists’ relentless propaganda war is tapping into Islamic community angst over Australia’s counter-terrorism crackdown.

“One of the key messages of terrorist groups … is that Muslims are a victimised and suppressed minority,” University of Queensland researcher Dr Adrian Cherney said.

He said the survey of 800 Muslims showed political leaders’ attacks on Muslims “can push them to actually say: ‘Well hang on a second, the terrorists are right. Some of their grievances are true’.

“I think that’s what it is tapping into,” Dr Cherney said. “But that doesn’t mean they (Australian Muslims) are going to go out and start attacking people.”

More than one in five participants agreed terrorists had legitimate grievances.

But Brisbane Muslim leader Ali Kadri stressed the findings should not be interpreted as supporting terror groups.

“(Most) Muslims do not condone the killing and persecution of innocent people ,” Mr Kadri said. Citing atrocities committed by the Assad regime in Syria, he said: “Protecting civilians from these atrocities is a legitimate grievance, however using terror and persecution … is not legitimate or productive.”

http://pamelageller.com/2015/03/20-o...ievances.html/
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griff2 said:
At one point not so very long ago, Christians were acting just as badly.
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Sources please.

griff2 said:
Let's not forget that a lot of the current violence in the emerging nations is a direct consequence of recent colonial rule and meddling in those nation's affairs by predominantly Christian western nations.
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Who exactly are you claiming are Christian western nations?

griff2 said:
Those emerging nations are still in a nation-building stage equivalent to when Europe was transitioning from the dark ages to even recent times as it evolved to modern nation states? Do I need to remind you how many MILLIONS people died in the atrocities in the Christian world called WW1, WW2, the Balkan Wars, Kosovo, never mind the hundreds of European conflicts in predominately Christian realms before then? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_conflicts_in_Europe
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Utter horse manure. Neither of the wars you list were waged in the name of Christianity. Find a better source than Wiki please.

griff2 said:
What is happening in the middle east is little different. The nations there are artificial constructs drawn in pencil by Western powers on a map with little or no regard for ethnic and tribal differences. Now that the Western nations have by and large ended their colonial age and pulled out of direct rule over the middle east, now the indigenous people in that region are left to pick up the pieces.

Europe took centuries to resolve the worst of conflict there. Hopefully the middle east will work out their issues sooner than that.
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By killing all infidels?
 
Snobike Mike said:
Sources please.

Who exactly are you claiming are Christian western nations?

Utter horse manure. Neither of the wars you list were waged in the name of Christianity. Find a better source than Wiki please.

By killing all infidels?
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Sources? Are you blind to a major part of WW2? Six million people of one religion were wiped out by those of another religion, and the start of oppressing this group of 6 million was acceptable only because the Church had spent centuries beforehand demonizing them as being killers of Christ. With Europe being predominantly Christian, most of the population viewed Jews with great fear/hate/suspicion. Even the guy with the mustache invoked God many years before he actually started his little blood bath.

Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.
-Hitler (Mein Kampf)
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Christian Western nations should be obvious, mainly western Europe who was responsible for the most exploitative colonialism in the world starting from around the times of Columbus. The US joined in later, particularly in the years after WW1. That close of that colonial era is barely a few decades old, but the effects are still grossly manifest in various parts of the world.

ISIS has no aim of killing all infidels. The vast majority of their victims are Muslim, and their's is more a civil war in search of ruling power than it is a clash of religions. They invoke God to motivate their fighters to motivate their fighters and to attract others to their cause.

In that sense they are little different than Bush and Rumsfeld invoking their God-given mission to fight terrorists prior to unleashing the US military on Iraq and Afghanistan. Bush even referred to Afghanistan as a "Crusade on terrorism". Given the history of Christian Crusades rampaging through Muslim nations, I have to wonder how many new terrorists were inspired by that little Bushism.

"Killing in the name of God" is a good balanced read. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alon-benmeir/killing-in-the-name-of-go_b_3611883.html
 
ISIS to be more than just a Middle Eastern problem:

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/boko-ha...onalize-nigeria-s-conflict-analysts-1.2269743

This could lead to the Nigerian problem languishing longer.

""over time this pledge of allegiance might lead to the internationalization" of a threat that until now has been mostly confined to a single region of Nigeria with occasional spillover into neighbouring countries, warned J. Peter Pham, director of the Washington-based Atlantic Council's Africa Center."

"The international support pouring into anti-Boko Haram forces from the United States, France, the United Kingdom and others "may render the Nigerian militants' fight all the more attractive to these foreign jihadists," Pham said."


 
griff2 said:
Sources? Are you blind to a major part of WW2? Six million people of one religion were wiped out by those of another religion, and the start of oppressing this group of 6 million was acceptable only because the Church had spent centuries beforehand demonizing them as being killers of Christ. With Europe being predominantly Christian, most of the population viewed Jews with great fear/hate/suspicion. Even the guy with the mustache invoked God many years before he actually started his little blood bath.

Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.
-Hitler (Mein Kampf)
​
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Horse manure. Hitler's writings in Mein Kempf were written long before WW2 and post those writings he renounced Christianity. Hitler made no distinction on Jews, he wanted them all dead, even the Christian ones.

griff2 said:
Christian Western nations should be obvious, mainly western Europe who was responsible for the most exploitative colonialism in the world starting from around the times of Columbus. The US joined in later, particularly in the years after WW1. That close of that colonial era is barely a few decades old, but the effects are still grossly manifest in various parts of the world.
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How is colonization a "Christian" thing or done in the name of Christianity? Oh right, it isn't but of course in an attempt to deflect from the atrocities of Islam you need to attack other groups.

griff2 said:
ISIS has no aim of killing all infidels. The vast majority of their victims are Muslim, and their's is more a civil war in search of ruling power than it is a clash of religions. They invoke God to motivate their fighters to motivate their fighters and to attract others to their cause.
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So now ISIS isn't a acting on the teaching of the great prophet but it's now a civil war? Strong is the spin-doctoring in this one yes.

PS, what are they "fighting" and isn't "fighting" a bit violent? Sounds a bit like they need to be beheading, burning and generally killing "others" no?

griff2 said:
In that sense they are little different than Bush and Rumsfeld invoking their God-given mission to fight terrorists prior to unleashing the US military on Iraq and Afghanistan. Bush even referred to Afghanistan as a "Crusade on terrorism". Given the history of Christian Crusades rampaging through Muslim nations, I have to wonder how many new terrorists were inspired by that little Bushism.

"Killing in the name of God" is a good balanced read. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alon-benmeir/killing-in-the-name-of-go_b_3611883.html
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I was hoping you'd bring up the Crusades.......

Misconceptions about the Crusades are all too common. The Crusades are generally portrayed as a series of holy wars against Islam led by power-mad popes and fought by religious fanatics. They are supposed to have been the epitome of self-righteousness and intolerance, a black stain on the history of the Catholic Church in particular and Western civilization in general. A breed of proto-imperialists, the Crusaders introduced Western aggression to the peaceful Middle East and then deformed the enlightened Muslim culture, leaving it in ruins. For variations on this theme, one need not look far. See, for example, Steven Runciman’s famous three-volume epic, History of the Crusades, or the BBC/A&E documentary, The Crusades, hosted by Terry Jones. Both are terrible history yet wonderfully entertaining.

So what is the truth about the Crusades? Scholars are still working some of that out. But much can already be said with certainty. For starters, the Crusades to the East were in every way defensive wars. They were a direct response to Muslim aggression—an attempt to turn back or defend against Muslim conquests of Christian lands. Christians in the eleventh century were not paranoid fanatics. Muslims really were gunning for them. While Muslims can be peaceful, Islam was born in war and grew the same way. From the time of Mohammed, the means of Muslim expansion was always the sword. Muslim thought divides the world into two spheres, the Abode of Islam and the Abode of War. Christianity—and for that matter any other non-Muslim religion—has no abode. Christians and Jews can be tolerated within a Muslim state under Muslim rule. But, in traditional Islam, Christian and Jewish states must be destroyed and their lands conquered. When Mohammed was waging war against Mecca in the seventh century, Christianity was the dominant religion of power and wealth. As the faith of the Roman Empire, it spanned the entire Mediterranean, including the Middle East, where it was born. The Christian world, therefore, was a prime target for the earliest caliphs, and it would remain so for Muslim leaders for the next thousand years.

With enormous energy, the warriors of Islam struck out against the Christians shortly after Mohammed’s death. They were extremely successful. Palestine, Syria, and Egypt—once the most heavily Christian areas in the world—quickly succumbed. By the eighth century, Muslim armies had conquered all of Christian North Africa and Spain. In the eleventh century, the Seljuk Turks conquered Asia Minor (modern Turkey), which had been Christian since the time of St. Paul. The old Roman Empire, known to modern historians as the Byzantine Empire, was reduced to little more than Greece. In desperation, the emperor in Constantinople sent word to the Christians of western Europe asking them to aid their brothers and sisters in the East.

That is what gave birth to the Crusades. They were not the brainchild of an ambitious pope or rapacious knights but a response to more than four centuries of conquests in which Muslims had already captured two-thirds of the old Christian world. At some point, Christianity as a faith and a culture had to defend itself or be subsumed by Islam. The Crusades were that defense.
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