Good place for a 14yr old to work? | Page 5 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Good place for a 14yr old to work?

mimico_polak said:
What’s technical debt?
Click to expand...
In software it’s more specifically called code debt. It’s a bit abstract and near impossible to quantify.

In simplistic terms it’s the code that isn’t perfect, but good enough to start selling the product. A developer will repay the debt by going back and fixing things (bugs, performances and error handling. Since it’s a deferred cost of development, it’s called debt.
 
Mad Mike said:
What’s sad about those numbers is they were higher in 1990.
Click to expand...

What were the averages?

I know dev work is in more demand than ever now so I find this info very surprising.

EDITEDIT: Actually, couldn't find info on this (including inflation factors.) In fact everything states it's been going up; I'm calling ******** till proven wrong =P
 
Last edited:
油井緋色 said:
I didn't go into game development for the same reason lol
View attachment 50001
View attachment 50002

The first one involves death marches and constantly overtime :')



lol I admittedly wasn't born yet. It would've been around 1991 for me, with an Apple 2 and creating "Hello World" in C/C++.

I haven't done imbedded stuff aside from one Bluetooth driver. My problem sets are all over the place tho: browser, game engine, finance, 3d modelling tool, medicine, and hacking (game consoles, school network back high school, etc.) come to mind.
Click to expand...
I believe I cut my teeth doing “hello world” too before I got a job. I only had access to 6502 assembler.
油井緋色 said:
What were the averages?

I know dev work is in more demand than ever now so I find this info very surprising.

EDITEDIT: Actually, couldn't find info on this (including inflation factors.) In fact everything states it's been going up; I'm calling ******** till proven wrong =P
Click to expand...
More demand yes. Way more supply of coders today - dime a dozen. Companies also have cheap access to coders in India, Asia, and recently South America.

Imagine developing a spreadsheet like Supercalc that ran under CP/M inside 64k of Ram.

I don’t know where you can find historical data other than talking to old timers. I know in 98/99 my wife was pulling $100/hr from IBM as an independent contractor working on Y2K COBOL, Pascal and RGB code reviews. In 95 I found programmers for we’re getting cheaper as basic, C and cobol lowered the entry barriers. Not long after that cheap memory and PCs made programming even more accessible so colleges and units started pumping out programmers. Around then l switched from PCs to telecom gear (mo money), everyone on my team made well over $100k.
 
Mad Mike said:
I believe I cut my teeth doing “hello world” too before I got a job. I only had access to 6502 assembler.
Click to expand...

Were you 4? =P lol

Mad Mike said:
More demand yes. Way more supply of coders today - dime a dozen. Companies also have cheap access to coders in India, Asia, and recently South America.

Imagine developing a spreadsheet like Supercalc that ran under CP/M inside 64k of Ram.

I don’t know where you can find historical data other than talking to old timers. I know in 98/99 my wife was pulling $100/hr from IBM as an independent contractor working on Y2K COBOL, Pascal and RGB code reviews. In 95 I found programmers for we’re getting cheaper as basic, C and cobol lowered the entry barriers. Not long after that cheap memory and PCs made programming even more accessible so colleges and units started pumping out programmers. Around then l switched from PCs to telecom gear (mo money), everyone on my team made well over $100k.
Click to expand...

There are definitely more programmers but quantity != quality. You should know better than most that cheap ass outsource coders are mostly **** and require a few developers here to work with them to prevent quality control issues. Even the skill gap here between an underachiever versus someone truly passionate is massive (and the pay gap as well.) I think business owners are finally catching on to this from the salary spike trend.

I wonder how much US paid back then because if I were to move down south, I'd be pulling in $200k - $300k CAD. If you guys were making over $100k counting inflation, that means even the upper end of the salary range is barely even with 90s salaries.
 
油井緋色 said:
Were you 4? =P lol



There are definitely more programmers but quantity != quality. You should know better than most that cheap ass outsource coders are mostly **** and require a few developers here to work with them to prevent quality control issues. Even the skill gap here between an underachiever versus someone truly passionate is massive (and the pay gap as well.) I think business owners are finally catching on to this from the salary spike trend.

I wonder how much US paid back then because if I were to move down south, I'd be pulling in $200k - $300k CAD. If you guys were making over $100k counting inflation, that means even the upper end of the salary range is barely even with 90s salaries.
Click to expand...

its the same as every field, theres competition, and quality varies.
If I want a plumber or carpenter or accountant, there are many out there as well
 
Talked to a buddy yesterday. He said their developers in house are used for the more involved dev work, but for the ‘grunt work’ they utilize their Indian office for $11/hr and get what they need out of those guys.

Said you can’t beat the price, and the quality is comparable to what they’d have to pay 30-40/hr here.
 
mimico_polak said:
Talked to a buddy yesterday. He said their developers in house are used for the more involved dev work, but for the ‘grunt work’ they utilize their Indian office for $11/hr and get what they need out of those guys.

Said you can’t beat the price, and the quality is comparable to what they’d have to pay 30-40/hr here.
Click to expand...
"grunt work" ....
Give them a set of detailed instructions to follow and mostly they get it right.
However hit a "speed bump" and the "car" grinds to a halt.

side note .....
a lot of the grunt work can be achieved on-site with the use of bots (Robotic Process Automation)

back to the main thread ...
I hear that the City of Mississauga is hiring, so is TJX, but the "14" may be an issue.

digression ....
Am all for the "independence" that a job/salary, brings. Thing is, getting an association of that "independence" with wise decisions.

Hope something works out for the kid!
 
Last edited:
Jayv said:
We spend all our adult lives working.

Let the kid enjoy life.

Money isn’t everything.
Click to expand...
I would totally agree if a kid doesn’t want to work, but this one wants to. She sees how much it costs to buy the more expensive toys and gadgets and wants to contribute. She also wants to start gaining some experience and wants to meet more people.
 
I remember in my early years of high school when the internet was in it's infancy (Hell, I was still running a BBS) there was such a push for students to go for IT careers.

"Get the education and you'll make millions!" they said.

Many of those jobs pay less than I make now because there was such a massive glut of people that jumped on that bandwagon back in those early days.

Mad Mike said:
Companies also have cheap access to coders in India, Asia, and recently South America.
Click to expand...

My company has a piece of software we use on tablets every day for work. They farmed it out overseas for the programming, and we got exactly what we paid for - problematic junk that crashes often, doesn't work properly regularly, and never seems to get fully fixed without adding some other bug elsewhere.

They also recently farmed out some of our other work that required transposing things from electronic documents to one of our internal systems. Similar results quality wise. I swear they must spend more time and money fixing the mistakes and chasing the discrepancies than they're saving having eliminated our Canadian staff that used to do the job. :/
 
A digression from OP's topic (apologies Shane!), but it is important to acknowledge the truth of PP's observation i.e. "they must spend more time and money fixing the mistakes and chasing the discrepancies than they're saving having eliminated our Canadian staff that used to do the job."

Thing is that the costs of the "fixing" are not reflected in the books and all that the bean-counters see is cost savings due to the reduced head-count and the per/hr labour savings.
 
Evoex said:
All they did was write bad code and it creates perpetual job security for fixing it 😂
Click to expand...
either way, not the bargain the beancounters were hoping for.

Time lost and inefficiencies multiplied over-time will cost the company, even if it isnt counted in the books

#edit

I had a friend years ago who intentionally wrote bad code no one else could read for job security 🤷‍♂️
 
Last edited:
bigpoppa said:
either way, not the bargain the beancounters were hoping for.

Time lost and inefficiencies multiplied over-time will cost the company, even if it isnt counted in the books

#edit

I had a friend years ago who intentionally wrote bad code no one else could read for job security 🤷‍♂️
Click to expand...
You would be surprised how little they care, vs up front cost. anything could happen down the road.
 
Baggsy said:
Rideau St Ottawa.
47 Rideau
Click to expand...
I will talk to my buddy as he was on that job. There were a couple of issues out in Ottawa during tunnelling. More than 1 sinkhole and a flooded shaft when they hit a large diameter water line. Oops.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom