Does anyone know USA medical costs?

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murf said:
When I was in Detroit I didn't pay dime and had the best coverage I could imagine. I had an offer in silicone valley last year and the company would pay $1300 a month to cover my family and I would pay $250. I think it was only $10 per doctor visit and perscription. Deductibles for surgery were only $1000 per surgery up to $2000 or $3000 max per year for the family. Pretty good I think.
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That would be the difference between group and individual coverage. Group plans are great; when we were covered by my partner we had excellent coverage for about $350 a month total. As I am the only employee of our church, we don't have a group plan. U.S. insurance is so weird that our folks in the denomination are covered by a group plan, but because the denomination is in a different state, I can't get it.

I repeat, the U.S. system is broken.
 
I'd say that rather than being broken, it works as designed. If you have money, and lots of it, you get to live.
 
OpenGambit said:
I am sure you can too, I was really trying to get at the question of how much that would be.
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It really depends on the company you work for, and how much the company will pay on your behalf. I have several options at the company I work for. I pay $90/month (the company covers about ~$350/month) and most services have a $20 or $100 deductible (depending on the service), and the policy has a $1500/year maximum out of pocket. Sounds pretty good, except that I can only get care at specific facilities designated by the insurance company (ER visits are the exception), otherwise the insurance does not cover it.

The company has another policy that allows "out of network" coverage, but coverage is limited to 85% for 'in-network' providers, and only 60% covered for 'out of network' providers. I chose not to go with this policy.

One of the biggest problem with the US system is that healthcare has been turned into a business. The insurance company can override your doctor's decision if it isn't 'cost effective'. Likewise, you sometimes hear horror stories of insurance companies dropping people after racking up large healthcare bills due to illness or disability. It's more 'cost-effective' to let someone die than to continue paying for their medical bills.
 
Brian said:
It really depends on the company you work for, and how much the company will pay on your behalf. I have several options at the company I work for. I pay $90/month (the company covers about ~$350/month) and most services have a $20 or $100 deductible (depending on the service), and the policy has a $1500/year maximum out of pocket. Sounds pretty good, except that I can only get care at specific facilities designated by the insurance company (ER visits are the exception), otherwise the insurance does not cover it.

The company has another policy that allows "out of network" coverage, but coverage is limited to 85% for 'in-network' providers, and only 60% covered for 'out of network' providers. I chose not to go with this policy.

One of the biggest problem with the US system is that healthcare has been turned into a business. The insurance company can override your doctor's decision if it isn't 'cost effective'. Likewise, you sometimes hear horror stories of insurance companies dropping people after racking up large healthcare bills due to illness or disability. It's more 'cost-effective' to let someone die than to continue paying for their medical bills.
Click to expand...

I don't think they can drop you if you are in a group plan with your employer?
 
revrandy said:
That would be the difference between group and individual coverage. Group plans are great; when we were covered by my partner we had excellent coverage for about $350 a month total. As I am the only employee of our church, we don't have a group plan. U.S. insurance is so weird that our folks in the denomination are covered by a group plan, but because the denomination is in a different state, I can't get it.

I repeat, the U.S. system is broken.
Click to expand...

it wasn't broken from me.

One could argue about the sustainability of the Canadian system:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/pointofview/...-report-what-do-you-think-should-be-done.html
 
Trump, er god help you if you ever need a transplant. However, it's good to know that you can get discounts for bundled transplant purchases.

From http://www.transplantliving.org/beforethetransplant/finance/costs.aspx

A detailed report is at http://publications.milliman.com/research/health-rr/pdfs/2008-us-organ-tisse-RR4-1-08.pdf , but below is just one summary table from that report.

Estimated U.S. Average 2011 Billed Charges Per Transplant

[TABLE="class: listTable, width: 90%"]
[TR]
[TH]Transplant
[/TH]
[TH]30 Days
Pre-transplant[/TH]
[TH]Procurement[/TH]
[TH]Hospital
Transplant Admission[/TH]
[TH]Physician
During Transplant[/TH]
[TH]180 Days
Post-transplant
Admission[/TH]
[TH]Immuno-
suppressants[/TH]
[TH]Total[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"] Heart Only[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$47,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$80,400 [/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$634,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$67,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$137,800[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$30,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$997,700[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line2"]
[TD="width: 16%"] Single Lung[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$10,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$73,100 [/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$302,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$33,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$117,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$23,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$561,200[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Double Lung[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$21,400[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$90,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$458,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$56,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$142,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$28,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$797,300[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line2"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Heart-Lung[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$56,800[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$130,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$777,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$81,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$169,100[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$33,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$1,148,400[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Liver[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$25,400[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$71,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$316,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$46,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$93,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$23,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$577,100[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line2"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Kidney[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$17,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$67,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$91,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$18,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$50,800[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$18,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$262,900[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Pancreas[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$17,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$65,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$108,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$17,800
[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$61,400[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$19,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$289,400[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Intestine[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$55,100[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$78,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$787,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$104,100[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$146,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$34,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$1,206,800[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
 
Last edited:
Rob MacLennan said:
That's what you get when all of the people who have been constantly tapped for more taxes, in order to support the bone headed ideas of everyone in government, get too old to be paying taxes anymore.
Click to expand...

The topic is packed with judgementalism.
Do we deny lung cancer treatment to smokers?
Heart condition treatment to the obese?
Gunshot treatment to those with violence records?
If someone makes a 20 billion dollar machine that cures a rare condition that is only affecting one person on the planet do we buy/rent the machine at any cost? It depends on whether the person is special to you.
I wonder what the world would be like if they could eliminate the greed gene from human DNA.
 
nobbie48 said:
I wonder what the world would be like if they could eliminate the greed gene from human DNA.
Click to expand...
I would personally really like to see the results...
 
nobbie48 said:
The topic is packed with judgementalism.
Do we deny lung cancer treatment to smokers?
Heart condition treatment to the obese?
Gunshot treatment to those with violence records?
If someone makes a 20 billion dollar machine that cures a rare condition that is only affecting one person on the planet do we buy/rent the machine at any cost? It depends on whether the person is special to you.
I wonder what the world would be like if they could eliminate the greed gene from human DNA.
Click to expand...

I'm talking specifically about the health care system and why there's not going to be enough money to support it, in future. A lot of questionable things have been supported, by government, outside of important things like health care, education, and a basic social safety net. The population is aging. That's a fact. As a result there are fewer and fewer people working to support the necessities, let alone all of the ill conceived crap that people thought was a good idea, when the tax base was larger.

That's not judgmentalism, nor is it about greed. It's simple economics. The fewer people who you have, who are financially supporting government initiatives, the more you're going to have to bleed them in order to maintain the status quo. That leaves you with 3 choices; keep bleeding taxpayers until they're dry, drastically reduce services, or increase taxation while also reducing services. Option 3 is where things are likely to go. That's assuming we keep something that looks like our current system.

At this point it looks like the only real way to proceed is to go to a 2-tier system, with income from the pay-for tier going to support the public tier. Also, a consolidation of single or related services, into care specific health centres, could be used to reduce costs. Got a broken bone? Off to St. Mike's. Cancer? They deal with that out at CVH. Transplants? Princess Margaret.
 
Well if any country goes to hell, do the only thing you can do... move =D
 
turbodish said:
Trump, er god help you if you ever need a transplant. However, it's good to know that you can get discounts for bundled transplant purchases.

From http://www.transplantliving.org/beforethetransplant/finance/costs.aspx

A detailed report is at http://publications.milliman.com/research/health-rr/pdfs/2008-us-organ-tisse-RR4-1-08.pdf , but below is just one summary table from that report.

Estimated U.S. Average 2011 Billed Charges Per Transplant

[TABLE="class: listTable, width: 90%"]
[TR]
[TH]Transplant
[/TH]
[TH]30 Days
Pre-transplant[/TH]
[TH]Procurement[/TH]
[TH]Hospital
Transplant Admission[/TH]
[TH]Physician
During Transplant[/TH]
[TH]180 Days
Post-transplant
Admission[/TH]
[TH]Immuno-
suppressants[/TH]
[TH]Total[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"] Heart Only[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$47,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$80,400 [/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$634,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$67,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$137,800[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$30,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$997,700[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line2"]
[TD="width: 16%"] Single Lung[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$10,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$73,100 [/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$302,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$33,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$117,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$23,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$561,200[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Double Lung[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$21,400[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$90,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$458,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$56,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$142,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$28,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$797,300[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line2"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Heart-Lung[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$56,800[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$130,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$777,700[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$81,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$169,100[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$33,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$1,148,400[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Liver[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$25,400[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$71,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$316,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$46,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$93,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$23,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$577,100[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line2"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Kidney[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$17,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$67,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$91,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$18,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$50,800[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$18,200[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$262,900[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Pancreas[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$17,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$65,000[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$108,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$17,800
[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$61,400[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$19,300[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$289,400[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="class: line1"]
[TD="width: 16%"]Intestine[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$55,100[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$78,500[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$787,900[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$104,100[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$146,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$34,600[/TD]
[TD="width: 12%"]$1,206,800[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Click to expand...

My insurance covered all that. No worries.
It certainly would suck for the unemployed though, or that can't get insurance. I think there needs to be a two tiered system. Does it make sense for am employed person to wait for a knee surgery the same as a retired person? Not to me.
 
Last edited:
murf said:
How many would be accepted for immigration by the other country?
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Oh god.... immigration is the biggest pain in the ***.
To be able to move anywhere you better be prepared to marry someone from that country and afford the filing fees....
 
murf said:
Does it make sense for am employed person to wait for a knee surgery the same as a retired person? Not to me.
Click to expand...

Is it right for someone who did hard physical work all of his life to have to wait endlessly for his knee to be fixed so he could enjoy a few years of getting around. If there aren't enough services to go around the ones on the back burner will never get served because they aren't important enough. If their taxes prepaid the services they deserve the services.

Due to the legalities of responsibility I believe that in the USA, the prison population has greater access to medical procedures than those on the outside.
 
Cat13 said:
Oh god.... immigration is the biggest pain in the ***.
To be able to move anywhere you better be prepared to marry someone from that country and afford the filing fees....
Click to expand...

lol.
Obviously emigrating is not a solution for the vast majority.
 
murf said:
Does it make sense for am employed person to wait for a knee surgery the same as a retired person? Not to me.
Click to expand...

It doesn't make sense if you buy into the idea that a person's value is tied strictly to their productivity. We gotta be a good little peon to get our perks, like butting in front of needy elders for health care?

Love it.
 
nobbie48 said:
Is it right for someone who did hard physical work all of his life to have to wait endlessly for his knee to be fixed so he could enjoy a few years of getting around. If there aren't enough services to go around the ones on the back burner will never get served because they aren't important enough. If their taxes prepaid the services they deserve the services.

Due to the legalities of responsibility I believe that in the USA, the prison population has greater access to medical procedures than those on the outside.
Click to expand...

Then the currently employed person can't work with the bad knee. Not good for the GDP, and now more taxpayer money has to support him on disability. A retired person I know just had a knee replacement scheduled 5 months away........doesn't bother her cause she's not working, would be different if they were middle aged and working.

I'm sure we can agree 5 months is not a reasonable time? Especially since that retired person that worked hard all his life enjoyed quick medical care 20 or 30 years ago.
 
Last edited:
murf said:
Then the currently employed person can't work with the bad knee. Not good for the GDP, and now more taxpayer money has to support him on disability. A retired person I know just had a knee replacement scheduled 5 months away........doesn't bother her cause she's not working, would be different if they were middle aged and working.

I'm sure we can agree 5 months is not a reasonable time? Especially since that retired person that worked hard all his life enjoyed quick medical care 20 or 30 years ago.
Click to expand...

Reasonable people accept reasonable schedules and delays but any good system allows for emergencies. That's why hospitals have ERs that work seperately, to a degree, from planned admissions.

If the retiree can't get around then he/she sits around and obesity and therefore blood pressure, heart disease, diabetes etc causes a greater drain on services.
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