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For profit nursing homes have 4 times the death rate as municipal/not for profit run homes(but same infection rate apparently)

I was able to get a hold of the article without the paywall:

Outline.com

outline.com outline.com

Dont tell the americans this

https://imgur.com/BF96lly
 
bigpoppa said:
For profit nursing homes have 4 times the death rate as municipal/not for profit run homes(but same infection rate apparently)

I was able to get a hold of the article without the paywall:

Outline.com

outline.com outline.com

Dont tell the americans this

https://imgur.com/BF96lly
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reach around.

It will be interesting to see what happens with LTC after this mess. It has had chronic funding issues and horrendously long waiting lists. Will a government have the will and budget to fundamentally change things? Probably something like a doubling of the allocated money to make something better (more staff minutes per patient, eliminate ward rooms, more homes on line etc).
 
It will be interesting to see if the PC party changes its tune, too. It ought to be pretty obvious now that you can't cost-cut your way to a good health care system. Doug Ford isn't talking about cost-cuts any more.
 
Brian P said:
Doug Ford isn't talking about cost-cuts any more.
Click to expand...

willingness to change/adapt with the circumstances is a sign of leadership I would say
 
xfactor said:
Should we start subtracting all these deaths from the Total Corona count?

Don't answer me pls, I'm just bored out of my mind. :)
Click to expand...
Actually, tbh, I was wondering earlier on if the resolved cases were still included in the total cases count.
I see now that 680 news and CP24 are clarifying that.
Fyi- resolved cases are included in total count.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk
 
Brian P said:
It will be interesting to see if the PC party changes its tune, too.
Click to expand...
About cuts? Doubtful, it was his entire platform and therefore mandate.

I don't think he should deviate either, not looking forward to seeing the red ink after the dust settles.

speaking of which, haven't heard a peep from the teachers. :unsure:
 
Evoex said:
About cuts? Doubtful, it was his entire platform and therefore mandate.

I don't think he should deviate either, not looking forward to seeing the red ink after the dust settles.

speaking of which, haven't heard a peep from the teachers. :unsure:
Click to expand...
Teachers are back to work I believe. Primary anyways.

I'm thinking that we shouldn't be spending like a drunken sailor in the good times, and like a drunken lottery winner in the bad times.
There's only so long that you can spend more than you make, before someone with a baseball bat comes to collect.
 
Baggsy said:
Teachers are back to work I believe. Primary anyways.

I'm thinking that we shouldn't be spending like a drunken sailor in the good times, and like a drunken lottery winner in the bad times.
There's only so long that you can spend more than you make, before someone with a baseball bat comes to collect.
Click to expand...
exactamundo.
 
GreyGhost said:
Thanks for the reach around.

It will be interesting to see what happens with LTC after this mess. It has had chronic funding issues and horrendously long waiting lists. Will a government have the will and budget to fundamentally change things? Probably something like a doubling of the allocated money to make something better (more staff minutes per patient, eliminate ward rooms, more homes on line etc).
Click to expand...

The way I read it the problem is not as bad in the government and non-profit homes. I would have expected to be treated better when I had to shell out from my own pocket. I've seen some pretty posh for profit LTC homes but does the glitz of the dining room hide the lack of trained cleaning staff and sanitation.

My daughter used to dispatch ambulances to these places and the incoming calls would suggest incompetence. "I'm not sure if the person is breathing. Do we need an ambulance?"

We shop for groceries weekly and get to know what stores have better selections and how to pick the right veggies.

We shop for a LTC home once in a lifetime but do we know what to look for? Nice lobby, dining room and suite so assume it's top notch. Those are one time building expenses that allow for higher prices for decades. Profits are squeezed out of operating expenses by using part time staff, cheap supplies and minimal building services. Think Cadillac Cimarron.

Ethical people do the right things. How does one legislate ethics?

Part timers are a problem but save money. Nothing like a shift change to let something fall through a crack. "I thought the other shift wiped it down."

Can a survival potential chart be developed for all homes. It would be posted on the front door like the green, yellow and red ones for restaurants.
 
Baggsy said:
Teachers are back to work I believe. Primary anyways.

I'm thinking that we shouldn't be spending like a drunken sailor in the good times, and like a drunken lottery winner in the bad times.
There's only so long that you can spend more than you make, before someone with a baseball bat comes to collect.
Click to expand...

IMO the government should be like Scrooge when the economy is hot and people are making money from the private sector. Prices for work are high because of demand. When the economy is down and prices are competitive the government creates employment by opening the purse strings and snags bargains.
 
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nobbie48 said:
IMO the government should be like Scrooge when the economy is hot an people are making money from the private sector. Prices for work are high because of demand. When the economy is down and prices are competitive the government creates employment by opening the purse and strings snags bargains.
Click to expand...
See this right there is your problem. Using logic when it comes to govt spending.
@nobbie48 for PM!
 
nobbie48 said:
The way I read it the problem is not as bad in the government and non-profit homes. I would have expected to be treated better when I had to shell out from my own pocket. I've seen some pretty posh for profit LTC homes but does the glitz of the dining room hide the lack of trained cleaning staff and sanitation.

My daughter used to dispatch ambulances to these places and the incoming calls would suggest incompetence. "I'm not sure if the person is breathing. Do we need an ambulance?"

We shop for groceries weekly and get to know what stores have better selections and how to pick the right veggies.

We shop for a LTC home once in a lifetime but do we know what to look for? Nice lobby, dining room and suite so assume it's top notch. Those are one time building expenses that allow for higher prices for decades. Profits are squeezed out of operating expenses by using part time staff, cheap supplies and minimal building services. Think Cadillac Cimarron.

Ethical people do the right things. How does one legislate ethics?

Part timers are a problem but save money. Nothing like a shift change to let something fall through a crack. "I thought the other shift wiped it down."

Can a survival potential chart be developed for all homes. It would be posted on the front door like the green, yellow and red ones for restaurants.
Click to expand...
Govt spends the same whether a person is in public, private or non-profit nursing home. Most of the private companies profits come from using minimal staffing to keep a piece of that pie. The non-profit and public are also more likely to get additional funding and or volunteer help (why would I volunteer at a private home, they can pay for people to come in).

As a first step, change the funding model to what is actually required to be spent on care instead of saying you get the same money no matter what is spent on care.
 
first day with hardware stores open
went to Rona - as they suck, assuming the lines would be shorter
they were, got what I needed and out fairly quickly

after that stopped at a grocers as the outside lineup was shortish

both stores: zero staff wearing masks
myself and 2 other customers wearing masks in total for the outing
close to zero attempt by customers to safe distance

this is a stark contrast to the behavior of around 2 weeks ago
our numbers are gong to increase
 
J_F said:
first day with hardware stores open
went to Rona - as they suck, assuming the lines would be shorter
they were, got what I needed and out fairly quickly

after that stopped at a grocers as the outside lineup was shortish

both stores: zero staff wearing masks
myself and 2 other customers wearing masks in total for the outing
close to zero attempt by customers to safe distance

this is a stark contrast to the behavior of around 2 weeks ago
our numbers are gong to increase
Click to expand...

Was in the grocery store in Waterdown yesterday. Lots of customers were wearing masks + gloves. Employees on the floor all were, most cashiers were relying on the Plexiglas screen. I was wearing gloves, no mask (only thing I have at home is my painting mask/respirator). No respirators or gloves littering the parking lot.

I'm seeing that where you are makes a big difference. One only has to look at the GTA case map to see that. I think Hamilton is fudging their numbers, though. There's no way they have less cases than Halton. Barton Village alone probably has more.
 
Hom depot line was the entire width of store. I had no interest in going but it is quite obvious this will be ugly.

Even yesterday, ontario chief medical officer said community spread was at 55% and they had no idea why. So more than 50% of cases are spread with an unknown vector during a relative lockdown and you open up? Yeah. That's going to end well.

J_F said:
first day with hardware stores open
went to Rona - as they suck, assuming the lines would be shorter
they were, got what I needed and out fairly quickly

after that stopped at a grocers as the outside lineup was shortish

both stores: zero staff wearing masks
myself and 2 other customers wearing masks in total for the outing
close to zero attempt by customers to safe distance

this is a stark contrast to the behavior of around 2 weeks ago
our numbers are gong to increase
Click to expand...
 
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GreyGhost said:
Hom depot line was the entire width of store. I had no interest in going but it is quite obvious this will be ugly.

Even yesterday, ontario chief medical officer said community spread was at 55% and they had no idea why. So more than 50% of cases are spread with an unknown vector during a relative lockdown and you open up? Yeah. That's going to end well.
Click to expand...
we know there will be a second wave, might as well just get it over with at this point to show people 'we told you so'.
 
Evoex said:
we know there will be a second wave, might as well just get it over with at this point to show people 'we told you so'.
Click to expand...

There will be a spike for sure. It won't be pandemic numbers. The only way around it is to keep everyone at home until they come up with a vaccine, which is a good year out, give or take. That's not feasible no matter how you look at it. There will be nothing left to come back to.
 
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