Chauvin going to jail? | Page 9 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Chauvin going to jail?

Not everyone thinks like you...
Many people do not want to become better.
You are suggesting we become less harsh on crime. For petty weed charges (in the US) absolutely but
it needs to be more tough on violent crime when the person is a repeat offender.

Define "Get tough". Brutal punishment? The three strikes law? Or trying harder to understand the motives of the offender?

I'm not delusional. Some people are pure evil and can't be helped.

What do you do with people that have had so much evil dumped on them that their brains have become evil? You an't let them become a danger to others but their behaviour is due to treatment they received from others.

Aileen Wournos, a prostitute, was executed for multiple murders of her clients. What about the sexual assaults she endured at the hands of just about every male in her family, including the ones that pimped her out. Who would expect her to be normal?

The human brain doesn't have a control-alt-delete reset that puts everything back to normal. We have no button on the back of out necks to return us to factory settings.

Life isn't simple.
 
Aileen Wournos....... just when you think your day is looking up, it turns out you've booked an escort whos actually a serial killer.

There's an awkward funeral eulogy , he died doing what he loved.....
 
just when you think your day is looking up, it turns out you've booked an escort whos actually a serial killer.

I had a friend that died from injuries incurred from a beating by a pimp. Always square up your bill with your off-grid purchases.
 
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Apparently at some point he tried and the crown rejected.
I get the impression that it is to minimize chances of a plea reversal at a later date and the evidence / testimony not being recorded with a guilty plea.

Also, reverse the plea and get the trial a few years later when other things are on people's minds.
 
I get the impression that it is to minimize chances of a plea reversal at a later date and the evidence / testimony not being recorded with a guilty plea.

Also, reverse the plea and get the trial a few years later when other things are on people's minds.
Depending on the timing, I am ok with them rejecting the plea. If it was very early on (eg. first few weeks after the incident), I hope they would take it. If it was after the trial was going badly for him, f that, his supporters would use that to prop up their crap positions. In between those two cases, I would lean a lot harder towards rejecting the deal as it is obvious he is pleading to minimize the penalty not because he believes he did something wrong.
 
Depending on the timing, I am ok with them rejecting the plea. If it was very early on (eg. first few weeks after the incident), I hope they would take it. If it was after the trial was going badly for him, f that, his supporters would use that to prop up their crap positions. In between those two cases, I would lean a lot harder towards rejecting the deal as it is obvious he is pleading to minimize the penalty not because he believes he did something wrong.

It was earlier on in the process... months before the trial.
 
Not everyone thinks like you...
Many people do not want to become better.
You are suggesting we become less harsh on crime. For petty weed charges (in the US) absolutely but
it needs to be more tough on violent crime when the person is a repeat offender.

Prisons don't work though.

My knowledge for personality development and psychology is pretty limited. However, I've enough personal experience with trauma and done plenty of reading on subjects involving personality disorders.

Nurture takes a massive account for how an individual's personality ends up. A sure fire way to create an abomination of a human is for the parents to neglect, abuse, and manipulate the kid regularly. These learned behaviors will be projected in the child's social interactions, at school for example. These are your classic bullies.

Prison is full of these damaged souls: putting a bunch socially ****** people together is a ******* stupid idea =) The expectation is that they will "come out a changed man." What do you think actually happens when you put a bunch of people lacking empathy or social skills together? lol

Honestly, I see your suggestion as torture: mercy would be execution but we know that can be abused via executing the innocent through loopholes.
 
So what is your solution then?
How do you balance keeping society safe while allowing dangerous people more freedom? Whose interests are more important protecting?
The majority of people who have had less than stellar childhoods dont end up committing violent crime.

The idea that the purpose of prison is to make people come out changed is nonsense IMO.
Prison acts as a huge deterrent and as a vehicle of punishment.

You see my suggestion as torture but I see it as protecting society. I have little concern in the well being of people who have absolutely no regard for human life.
One of gang bangers who shot that 12 year old to death in November had been in jail before.
Lock these people up and throw away the keys...
 
Extra juror said they would have voted to convict as well.



Christensen praised Frazier for shooting the video, saying without it she didn't think the case would have been possible.

“Dr. Tobin was the one that really did it for me. He explained everything to me, I understood it, down to where he said, `This was the moment where he lost his life.' Really got to me.”

Christensen was critical of the defence, saying attorney Eric Nelson “ overpromised in the beginning and didn't live up to what he said he was going to do.”
 
So what is your solution then?
How do you balance keeping society safe while allowing dangerous people more freedom? Whose interests are more important protecting?

Put them all on an island. Name it Australia 2.0
 
So what is your solution then?
How do you balance keeping society safe while allowing dangerous people more freedom? Whose interests are more important protecting?
The majority of people who have had less than stellar childhoods dont end up committing violent crime.

The idea that the purpose of prison is to make people come out changed is nonsense IMO.
Prison acts as a huge deterrent and as a vehicle of punishment.

You see my suggestion as torture but I see it as protecting society. I have little concern in the well being of people who have absolutely no regard for human life.
One of gang bangers who shot that 12 year old to death in November had been in jail before.
Lock these people up and throw away the keys...

In an ideal world where the system is perfect, execution via open source law enforcement software/robots. One's worth is their output ability, and if it's negative, well...too bad lol. There's a lot of fine print with this view point and it maybe too anarchist.

The less homicidal/retarded route: find a way to undo the ****** upbringing (psychotherapy? gene therapy?) and reinsert them back into society. This is the goal of prison, go Google the reoffend rates: Canada is 35%, USA is 40%. More jobs and hope with this route, but holy **** I don't want to be whoever/whatever is doing the rehabilitation and I hope they're paid $200k+ a year.
 
So what is your solution then?
How do you balance keeping society safe while allowing dangerous people more freedom? Whose interests are more important protecting?
The majority of people who have had less than stellar childhoods dont end up committing violent crime.

The idea that the purpose of prison is to make people come out changed is nonsense IMO.
Prison acts as a huge deterrent and as a vehicle of punishment.

You see my suggestion as torture but I see it as protecting society. I have little concern in the well being of people who have absolutely no regard for human life.
One of gang bangers who shot that 12 year old to death in November had been in jail before.
Lock these people up and throw away the keys...

There is no solution at present. That doesn't mean we shouldn't keep looking.

Are you suggesting non violent crime doesn't hurt? No bruises on the skin but plenty on the brain.

The thing that annoys me the most on this subject is that people on one hand say "It isn't brain surgery" suggesting that brain surgery is the ultimate challenge and then the same person says "Just get over it, I did" insinuating that all brains are created equal. They aren't.

Look at two brothers or two sisters that aren't identical twins. Do they look exactly the same?

The husky brother can take a tackle and shake it off. The thin wiry one would be limping for a week. Brains are the same.

Why would anyone think their brains are exactly the same?

I don't know [B]油井緋色[/B] personally but he has posted indicating that a lot of programmers are wired differently. That doesn't mean they're bad. The problem emerges when someone forces another person into the wrong shaped mold.

"The idea that the purpose of prison is to make people come out changed is nonsense IMO.
Prison acts as a huge deterrent and as a vehicle of punishment."


Do you have any statistics on recidivism? Your statement implies you haven't studied the subject and TBH the subject isn't easy. There are lot of con artists and theories out there. Results are hard to judge as they can't be measured by micrometers or weigh scales.

Revenge is letting the other person live rent free in your brain.

That doesn't mean I would throw open the prison doors and let every prisoner out but if we don't give them something attainable to look forward to we might as well weld the doors shut.

Follow that course and some day, someone will object to your behavior and the door will be welded shut behind you. I've seen it happen in churches where people started playing the "I'm holier than you" game.
 
@nobbie48 for statistics
Ontario

USA

I don't think anyone is evil or bad btw. I think everyone is capable of immense evil and good. A lot of this is tied to upbringing. So yeah, I agree with you, it's not their fault.

Oh, and I missed @ChrisCBR's part about prisons being a deterrent...they're not a deterrent to people who think they can get away. Why do you think so many of us have tried to break the sound barrier on our supersport/superbikes in places where we shouldn't? lol
 
@nobbie48 for statistics
Ontario

USA

I don't think anyone is evil or bad btw. I think everyone is capable of immense evil and good. A lot of this is tied to upbringing. So yeah, I agree with you, it's not their fault.

Oh, and I missed @ChrisCBR's part about prisons being a deterrent...they're not a deterrent to people who think they can get away. Why do you think so many of us have tried to break the sound barrier on our supersport/superbikes in places where we shouldn't? lol
There are certainly evil and bad people in our world. Im currently listening to the Tim Bosma murder on a podcast. Dellan Millard had a better upbringing that me and probably everyone else on this site but he chose to be a manipulative, murdering, psychopath. He is evil.

You cant compare breaking the speed limit in the middle of nowhere to serious crime...
 
@nobbie48 for statistics
Ontario

USA

I don't think anyone is evil or bad btw. I think everyone is capable of immense evil and good. A lot of this is tied to upbringing. So yeah, I agree with you, it's not their fault.

Oh, and I missed @ChrisCBR's part about prisons being a deterrent...they're not a deterrent to people who think they can get away. Why do you think so many of us have tried to break the sound barrier on our supersport/superbikes in places where we shouldn't? lol
If we treated misbehaving high school students like criminals they would get thrown out of the education system and never be able to get a job. They see their classmates get nice jobs and nice stuff. Jealousy sets in followed by angry thoughts and anger breeds more bad decisions.

The result is more cops, more judges, more jails, more insurance payouts for damages and more security systems.

It's pie in the sky thinking but it would be nice if some of that money went to prevention instead.

If someone thinks they are a contributing member of society with a decent job, family and degree of work and community respect, think about something you did that could have gone wrong but didn't. A close call the could have caused an injury and a dangerous driving criminal charge, a DUI or you got touchy-feely thinking she was into it and got a sexual assault conviction because she wasn't.

A court paper pusher I know says most of his clients are roofers and landscapers because those are the only jobs they can get because of bad decisions.

Some appropriate timely intervention would help. Take the motorcycle safety course before you crash. I was lucky. I didn't and only broke a mirror.
 
If we treated misbehaving high school students like criminals they would get thrown out of the education system and never be able to get a job. They see their classmates get nice jobs and nice stuff. Jealousy sets in followed by angry thoughts and anger breeds more bad decisions.

The result is more cops, more judges, more jails, more insurance payouts for damages and more security systems.

It's pie in the sky thinking but it would be nice if some of that money went to prevention instead.

If someone thinks they are a contributing member of society with a decent job, family and degree of work and community respect, think about something you did that could have gone wrong but didn't. A close call the could have caused an injury and a dangerous driving criminal charge, a DUI or you got touchy-feely thinking she was into it and got a sexual assault conviction because she wasn't.

A court paper pusher I know says most of his clients are roofers and landscapers because those are the only jobs they can get because of bad decisions.

Some appropriate timely intervention would help. Take the motorcycle safety course before you crash. I was lucky. I didn't and only broke a mirror.
Misbehaving students are an interesting group. I know one teacher (Grade 4) that had a kid taken out of his class and sent to a special school (1:4 ratio IIRC) as their behaviour was so unmanageable. The special school decided they were unable to deal with the kid and they got punted back to the normal classroom. If the kid can't be handled at 1:4 how the hell is a teacher with xx kids supposed to deal with them (and teach the rest of the kids)?

I used to work above a high school for prick kids. They would be taxied in from all over (up to one hour each way apparently). Teacher to students 1:4 or so. Wow, were those kids ever messed up. They needed a real intervention, not just education theatre. They were smoking by gas meters (probably ~14 yo) and a co-worker politely suggested that wasn't a great plan and they should move some distance away. The flicked the cigarette into his face, pushed him and asked what he was going to do to make them. The co-worker fought MMA for fun and was ~220. Kid was maybe half that. They are just full of bravado and want to cause trouble to get attention. I held very little hope for those kids going forward. We were pouring money at them with almost nothing to show for it other than pretending that we did what we could.
 
There are certainly evil and bad people in our world. Im currently listening to the Tim Bosma murder on a podcast. Dellan Millard had a better upbringing that me and probably everyone else on this site but he chose to be a manipulative, murdering, psychopath. He is evil.

You cant compare breaking the speed limit in the middle of nowhere to serious crime...
I assume you infer he had more money but did he have better parenting? Was he born a psychopath?

My late brother was a bit more than a year older than me. I'm still with wife #1. The woman at his side when he died was #8. He came across as a nice guy but if he was put under a magnifying glass he comes across as a womanizer, fraud artist, blackmailer, cheat, ticket fixer when a cop and a few other things I can't come up with names for. Same DNA and upbringing.

Because my parents split up my brother felt he had been hard done by and his life could have been so much better. I always felt it could have been so much worse. I loved my mother but there was something in the Manitoba drinking water, aunts had it too. Life is 10% what you're given and 90% what you make of it.

Define "Middle of nowhere" and degree of law breaking. Marco Muzzo would have made it home if other people hadn't gotten in his way.

There is nothing wrong with going as fast as you want. That's why they have race tracks. But that of course means not being able to speed wherever and whenever a person wants because the rules don't apply to them and everyone else should get out of their way.
 
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Misbehaving students are an interesting group. I know one teacher (Grade 4) that had a kid taken out of his class and sent to a special school (1:4 ratio IIRC) as their behaviour was so unmanageable. The special school decided they were unable to deal with the kid and they got punted back to the normal classroom. If the kid can't be handled at 1:4 how the hell is a teacher with xx kids supposed to deal with them (and teach the rest of the kids)?

I used to work above a high school for prick kids. They would be taxied in from all over (up to one hour each way apparently). Teacher to students 1:4 or so. Wow, were those kids ever messed up. They needed a real intervention, not just education theatre. They were smoking by gas meters (probably ~14 yo) and a co-worker politely suggested that wasn't a great plan and they should move some distance away. The flicked the cigarette into his face, pushed him and asked what he was going to do to make them. The co-worker fought MMA for fun and was ~220. Kid was maybe half that. They are just full of bravado and want to cause trouble to get attention. I held very little hope for those kids going forward. We were pouring money at them with almost nothing to show for it other than pretending that we did what we could.

A friend is a retired shop teacher. He signed off early because he got so angry with one kid he was ready to punch the punk and it wasn't worth the grief. The kid's parents were teachers.

Why do the kids act up? Nature, various spectrum syndromes, sometimes multiples at once or nurture, bad parenting or home situations, attention disorders etc.

While 1:4 is expensive would 1:1 be a better use of resources. I know a couple of people that are fine in 1:1 situations but add another person and they go from zero to jackass in two seconds. insecurity issues? I'm not a shrink.
 
A friend is a retired shop teacher. He signed off early because he got so angry with one kid he was ready to punch the punk and it wasn't worth the grief. The kid's parents were teachers.

Why do the kids act up? Nature, various spectrum syndromes, sometimes multiples at once or nurture, bad parenting or home situations, attention disorders etc.

While 1:4 is expensive would 1:1 be a better use of resources. I know a couple of people that are fine in 1:1 situations but add another person and they go from zero to jackass in two seconds. insecurity issues? I'm not a shrink.
I'm ok with 1:4 if it worked. To me it looked a hell of a lot like everyone associated was just putting in the time until they aged out of the system. Maybe conventional school is not the right path and we should go to vocational learning early on to give them both useful skills and and avenue to get some anger out. Maybe they need boot camp. Maybe they need hardcore therapy. Maybe they need someone to help address their home situation. I don't know enough to know what they need but from what I saw, we were throwing a lot of useless money at the problem.
 

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