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Carbon emissions

Thoughts on the green bin program? I gave up a few years ago.
I live in the country. I throw things (including roughly 40 rabbits that insist on getting into the husky pen at night despite the hair and the scat) over the fence and into the property row, which is primarily flat rocks picked off the original field. Nothing much lasts for more than a day although weirdly animals won't touch zuccinis or cucumbers. It's OK, they degrade on their own but it takes a while. So in a sense I have a place that's essentially a green bin, in the greenest of senses.

Trimming the apple trees etc. is another story, I burn everything in my burn pit. Another good part of living in the country.
 
A water bottle has three plastics, the bottle lid and label are different. And there is the label glue.

Coloured plastics create a catch 22 problem. In its own chemical family, plastics can often be recycled by regrinding and mixing in with new material. However coloured plastics can't be made white or clear. They can be made black by dumping carbon pigment into the mix. It only works once because black can't be converted back to white or light colours.

Packaging colours are a big thing in marketing and shades of grey (Or pink or blue) are important. We want white for a lot of our food trays etc. If we made the trays out of blends of colours they would literally look like feces. Ick.

I'm not sure where we stand on throwing the problem back at the producers. My understanding is that the provinces each made their own deal with the devils and Ontario and / or the municipalities took a wad of cash to set up the existing program. Revenues from selling the scrap was supposed to run the system. That was when almost every house had a newspaper subscription. Glass and metal containers were a bigger part of the mix.

Stuff that came in cans and glass jars now come in plastic pouches. Baby foods, non carbonated drinks, soups etc.

Does the deal ever expire or were we Homolka'd?

Could the federals enact a law overruling the provincial one?

Quebec, I think, got a better deal on some aspects of recycling, deposits on cans etc.
I manage the stewardship (blue box program) responsibilities for a fairly large company in the GTA.

Each province has it's own recycling program in place. Most are/were broadly similar in their approaches.

In Ontario under the old system (which is currently being phased out), producers (companies which produce/sell the items/packaging that end up in the blue bin) were responsible for funding 50% of the program cost. The other 50% was funded by the relevant municipality. The municipalities were largely responsible for setting up the contracts with disposal/recycling companies to actually operate the blue bin programs. Producers simply reported how much material they put into the system each year and paid a fee to a provincially regulated not-for-profit which doled out the money to municipalities.

The new system of Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) in Ontario is 100% funded by producers, and is also technically operated by the producers. In reality, there are a handful of not-for-profits that are contracted by producers to manage the program on their behalf. Circular Materials is the main service provider. The new system takes the burden off of the municipalities and the municipal taxpayer. However, the producers can and do simply pass on the cost by increasing prices. At my company, the cost of the stewardship program in Ontario has gone up by about 130%, and is set to increase more next year as the new EPR program come fully online. Other jurisdictions are going up even higher, especially in Quebec where the whole thing is being run by a power-mad non-profit with a government granted monopoly.

Almost all of the other Canadian provinces and territories are in the process of following Ontario's lead and switching to EPR programs. It is currently a nightmare of bureaucracy trying to navigate all of the half-baked programs which all seem to be figuring things out as they go...

In theory, full EPR gives producers control over the materials which end up in the recycling program, allowing them to recoup costs by selling the raw plastics/metals/papers to re-processors. A lot of policy centers are predicting massive growth in the recycled plastic market in particular. In reality, the market is completely saturated with raw plastic so prices are stupidly low. As others here have said, there isn't really much that you can do with recycled plastic.

To conclude my lecture.... the theory that full EPR will encourage/force manufacturers to re-think their processes and products is based on the assumptions that they can a) reduce the quantity of packaging material used, and b) easily re-use the recycled materials to create new packaging. Both of those assumptions are currently false. We'll have to see what innovations come in the future. For now, the added costs of full EPR are being passed onto consumers with little to no environmental benefits.

/end rant
 
I manage the stewardship (blue box program) responsibilities for a fairly large company in the GTA.

Each province has it's own recycling program in place. Most are/were broadly similar in their approaches.

In Ontario under the old system (which is currently being phased out), producers (companies which produce/sell the items/packaging that end up in the blue bin) were responsible for funding 50% of the program cost. The other 50% was funded by the relevant municipality. The municipalities were largely responsible for setting up the contracts with disposal/recycling companies to actually operate the blue bin programs. Producers simply reported how much material they put into the system each year and paid a fee to a provincially regulated not-for-profit which doled out the money to municipalities.

The new system of Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) in Ontario is 100% funded by producers, and is also technically operated by the producers. In reality, there are a handful of not-for-profits that are contracted by producers to manage the program on their behalf. Circular Materials is the main service provider. The new system takes the burden off of the municipalities and the municipal taxpayer. However, the producers can and do simply pass on the cost by increasing prices. At my company, the cost of the stewardship program in Ontario has gone up by about 130%, and is set to increase more next year as the new EPR program come fully online. Other jurisdictions are going up even higher, especially in Quebec where the whole thing is being run by a power-mad non-profit with a government granted monopoly.

Almost all of the other Canadian provinces and territories are in the process of following Ontario's lead and switching to EPR programs. It is currently a nightmare of bureaucracy trying to navigate all of the half-baked programs which all seem to be figuring things out as they go...

In theory, full EPR gives producers control over the materials which end up in the recycling program, allowing them to recoup costs by selling the raw plastics/metals/papers to re-processors. A lot of policy centers are predicting massive growth in the recycled plastic market in particular. In reality, the market is completely saturated with raw plastic so prices are stupidly low. As others here have said, there isn't really much that you can do with recycled plastic.

To conclude my lecture.... the theory that full EPR will encourage/force manufacturers to re-think their processes and products is based on the assumptions that they can a) reduce the quantity of packaging material used, and b) easily re-use the recycled materials to create new packaging. Both of those assumptions are currently false. We'll have to see what innovations come in the future. For now, the added costs of full EPR are being passed onto consumers with little to no environmental benefits.

/end rant
Interesting take. Where I lived in BC, recycling was 'free' and operated by a non-profit. Garbage was either deliver to the transfer station yourself, or pay a private company for pickup. This led to the bizarre sight of three or four garbage trucks, all in different livery, rolling around the neighbourhood on pickup day, depending on who contracted with who.

As for costs being passed on to the consumer, I'm all for that. Disposal of plastics being subsidised has created all sorts of problems, and frankly, people who use more should pay more. Consider it a user fee, a tiny bit closer to the capitalist ideal. Part of the problem has been there's zero incentive for packaging to be more sustainable/reusable/whatever, as the true disposal costs haven't been covered by the producer. It hasn't been cheaper to use things like glass for ages, but maybe it'll make more sense if plastics aren't artificially cheap.

That said, I'm sure even if it all has to be put into landfill, I'm sure single-use plastic is still way cheaper, so until producers are forced to cover the true end-use costs (e.g. things like ocean clean-up), not much will change.
 
I manage the stewardship (blue box program) responsibilities for a fairly large company in the GTA.

Each province has it's own recycling program in place. Most are/were broadly similar in their approaches.

In Ontario under the old system (which is currently being phased out), producers (companies which produce/sell the items/packaging that end up in the blue bin) were responsible for funding 50% of the program cost. The other 50% was funded by the relevant municipality. The municipalities were largely responsible for setting up the contracts with disposal/recycling companies to actually operate the blue bin programs. Producers simply reported how much material they put into the system each year and paid a fee to a provincially regulated not-for-profit which doled out the money to municipalities.

The new system of Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) in Ontario is 100% funded by producers, and is also technically operated by the producers. In reality, there are a handful of not-for-profits that are contracted by producers to manage the program on their behalf. Circular Materials is the main service provider. The new system takes the burden off of the municipalities and the municipal taxpayer. However, the producers can and do simply pass on the cost by increasing prices. At my company, the cost of the stewardship program in Ontario has gone up by about 130%, and is set to increase more next year as the new EPR program come fully online. Other jurisdictions are going up even higher, especially in Quebec where the whole thing is being run by a power-mad non-profit with a government granted monopoly.

Almost all of the other Canadian provinces and territories are in the process of following Ontario's lead and switching to EPR programs. It is currently a nightmare of bureaucracy trying to navigate all of the half-baked programs which all seem to be figuring things out as they go...

In theory, full EPR gives producers control over the materials which end up in the recycling program, allowing them to recoup costs by selling the raw plastics/metals/papers to re-processors. A lot of policy centers are predicting massive growth in the recycled plastic market in particular. In reality, the market is completely saturated with raw plastic so prices are stupidly low. As others here have said, there isn't really much that you can do with recycled plastic.

To conclude my lecture.... the theory that full EPR will encourage/force manufacturers to re-think their processes and products is based on the assumptions that they can a) reduce the quantity of packaging material used, and b) easily re-use the recycled materials to create new packaging. Both of those assumptions are currently false. We'll have to see what innovations come in the future. For now, the added costs of full EPR are being passed onto consumers with little to no environmental benefits.

/end rant
Yay more inflation on everything we buy coming right up.
 
 
Hmm did they other 2 threads get shutdown "These Liberals" & "These Conservatives"?

Anyhow lets see how tomorrow goes with the increase to the carbon tax. It's already hovering around $1.56 - $1.59.
I believe I read someplace the increase should only add 2c - 3c.

But this is also interesting.

Fun times. >_>
moved to 'Trash Talk', because some people couldn't play nice together. Need to be a Site Supporter to see that forum.
 
Liquor store in Waterdown was swamped Saturday afternoon. All but one cashier open.
 
Hmm did they other 2 threads get shutdown "These Liberals" & "These Conservatives"?

The These Conservatives thread is still in Romper Room and open to post in. As of now it's 10 posts down from the top. Speaks volumes if you ask me.
 
Still going to be a hat trick for the feds. More money for the MP's and if they shift the election date a better pension package for some. All paid for by the higher gas tax.

See, the budget does balance itself.
 
Still going to be a hat trick for the feds. More money for the MP's and if they shift the election date a better pension package for some. All paid for by the higher gas tax.

See, the budget does balance itself.

Take them out back of the Parliament Building and line them up against the wall. Ministers go last.
 

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