Biggest political lie

Schneller

Schneller

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IMO is that Conservative/Republican party policies benefit middle and lower working class people.

Ironically, they are the largest supporters of these political parties. I guess they believe what they are told that smaller government and lower taxes are the answers to their problems. In my view, Conservative/Republican party policies are looking after the wealthy and are responsible for the alarming decline of the middle class.

If these currently downwardly mobile groups would wake up to this, we could see the next French Revolution when the peasants decided to no longer accept the exclusion from wealth by the noble classes.

i imagine this will help you understand where I'm coming from.
 
Schneller said:
If these currently downwardly mobile groups would wake up to this, we could see the next French Revolution when the peasants decided to no longer accept the exclusion from wealth by the noble classes.
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Not in Canada..Genrally a nation that is very bad a revolution

For some historical context of what i'm saying

When the Lower Canada Rebellion broke out in the Fall of 1837, Sir Francis Bond Head sent the British troops stationed in Toronto (formerly York) to help suppress it. With the regular troops gone, William Lyon Mackenzie and his followers seized a Toronto armoury and organized an armed march down Yonge Street, beginning at Montgomery's Tavern (on Yonge St just north of Eglinton Avenue – the present-day site of Postal Station K) on December 4, 1837.
Colonel Robert Moodie attempted to lead a force of loyalists through the rebel roadblock to warn Governor Bond Head in Toronto. Moodie fired his pistol, apparently in an attempt to clear the way. A number of the rebels returned fire, killing him.[SUP][3][/SUP]
On the same day, December 5, Mackenzie's approximately 500 rebels marched upon Toronto's city hall in an effort to seize the arms and ammunition that were stored there. They were met by a truce party, to whom Mackenzie explained the rebels' demands.
Later that afternoon, Mackenzie led his troops farther down Yonge Street towards the city, where their advance was stopped by a party of 27 loyalist volunteers, led by William Botsford Jarvis. The loyalist men fired a volley then dropped to reload their guns. Mackenzie's men ran towards them, believing they had killed the loyalists. They met the loyalist fire unprepared. The rebels dispersed, losing hundreds of deserters. That night, reinforcements for the loyalists arrived from Hamilton. By the next day, these forces were 1,500 strong.
 
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Schneller said:
IMO is that Conservative/Republican party policies benefit middle and lower working class people.

Ironically, they are the largest supporters of these political parties. I guess they believe what they are told that smaller government and lower taxes are the answers to their problems. In my view, Conservative/Republican party policies are looking after the wealthy and are responsible for the alarming decline of the middle class.

If these currently downwardly mobile groups would wake up to this, we could see the next French Revolution when the peasants decided to no longer accept the exclusion from wealth by the noble classes.

i imagine this will help you understand where I'm coming from.
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How exactly are the Dems helping the lower/middle class????

And how exactly is the Ontario libtards who have turned our province from a have into a huge have not province good for the lower/middle class?

You may not like the conservatives but just as the US has found out the very very very hard way, if we ever have Justine in power you'll be wishing for Harper and his crew back like there's no tomorrow.

I think the biggest political lie is those who proclaim that the left aren't a bunch of socialist/commie idiots whose social engineering agenda is "good" for us all...........
 
Snobike Mike said:
I think the biggest political lie is those who proclaim that the left aren't a bunch of socialist/commie idiots whose social engineering agenda is "good" for us all...........
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i bet your support a number of socialist ideas.. unless your a supporter of Objectaivism.
 
For Mike: Remember that the provinces are operating under a federal conservative government. But the provincial liberals are more likely to support social programs that help the less fortunate than a Conservative party in power.

the wealthy love the Conservatives/Republicans because these parties are more likely to cut social programs in favour of lower taxes, and the wealthy are more than capable of paying for whatever extra services they desire and are less "socially responsible".

And yet a large number of working class people support them when clearly it is not in their best interest. Take a national health care system for example. Yes, some rates will go up in order to subsidize care for those who can't afford to pay. Who does that benefit?

And yes, on the left there are those who consider social engineering schemes to benefit society as a whole. IMO, that is a vital role of a government. Look at the top countries in the world in terms of standards of living.

Anyway, I post this to explain and express myself rather than change anyone's view which in religion and politics is pretty rigid.
6984f577b8bc9a30cd1bf357a7dd93d3.jpg
 
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Schneller said:
For Mike: Remember that the provinces are operating under a federal conservative government. But the provincial liberals are more likely to support social programs that help the less fortunate than a Conservative party in power.
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Whether or not the Feds are a differing party, it doesn't change the fact that Ontario is now a have not province under the careful watch of the Liberals. So to make the claim that the Right isn't for the falling middle/lower class which by default implies that the left is does not follow logically. The left has done at least as much as the right to destroy the middle/lower class (see Dems and Obamacare as a great example...)

Schneller said:
the wealthy love the Conservatives/Republicans because these parties are more likely to cut social programs in favour of lower taxes, and the wealthy are more than capable of paying for whatever extra services they desire and are less "socially responsible".
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The wealthy are the ones that CREATE the economic engine that allows for social programs in the first place. You can't have programs without dough. Why doesn't the left get that and why do they deflect onto the right by saying the rich are getting richer and that's "bad"?

Schneller said:
And yet a large number of working class people support them when clearly it is not in their best interest.
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Keeping in mind that it is the left in power in the US and also in Ontario so your statement isn't really holding water.

Schneller said:
Take a national health care system for example. Yes, some rates will go up in order to subsidize care for those who can't afford to pay. Who does that benefit?
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News flash, the US can't afford to pay and that is becoming and will continue to become even more evident as the obamacare debacle unfolds. And it isn't just "some rates" that are going up.

Schneller said:
And yes, on the left there are those who consider social engineering schemes to benefit society as a whole. IMO, that is a vital role of a government. Look at the top countries in the world in terms of standards of living.
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Rest assured I don't need a commie/socialist/liberal to tell me what's best for me and in fact if you really look under the hood, you'll find that the social engineers really are only scheming to make "their" lives better ;) (kinda sounds like the leftist mindset is the same as that in your pic)

Schneller said:
Anyway, I post this to explain and express myself rather than change anyone's view which in religion and politics is pretty rigid.
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Pot meet kettle no? :)
 
Schneller said:
For Mike: Remember that the provinces are operating under a federal conservative government. But the provincial liberals are more likely to support social programs that help the less fortunate than a Conservative party in power.

the wealthy love the Conservatives/Republicans because these parties are more likely to cut social programs in favour of lower taxes, and the wealthy are more than capable of paying for whatever extra services they desire and are less "socially responsible".

And yet a large number of working class people support them when clearly it is not in their best interest. Take a national health care system for example. Yes, some rates will go up in order to subsidize care for those who can't afford to pay. Who does that benefit?

And yes, on the left there are those who consider social engineering schemes to benefit society as a whole. IMO, that is a vital role of a government. Look at the top countries in the world in terms of standards of living.

Anyway, I post this to explain and express myself rather than change anyone's view which in religion and politics is pretty rigid.
6984f577b8bc9a30cd1bf357a7dd93d3.jpg
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How would you explain Detroit? It's been a Liberal Utopia since the '60s.
 
Pot meet kettle: absolutely! I'm not about to change my world view due to some chatting on an off topic thread on a motorcycle Internet forum. Like I said, I'm just expressing my opinions. We're just having fun here.
 
Baggsy said:
How would you explain Detroit? It's been a Liberal Utopia since the '60s.
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I hope you're not simple minded enough to ignore the world and social context, and blame municipal liberal mismanagement for Detroit's problems. They had crooked mayors too, but its not even their fault.
 
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Baggsy said:
How would you explain Detroit? It's been a Liberal Utopia since the '60s.
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You stole the words outta my mouth, lol.

I guess I will be Liberal if I like to leech off the system & depended on social programs such as welfare. People who worked for their money & believe the only way to make it in life is to earn it, will be Conservative.

Just thinking aloud
 
RockerGuy said:
.People who worked for their money & believe the only way to make it in life is to earn it, will be Conservative.
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Believe both those things (well you could steal it obviously but i digress). Not a conservative a good social safety net is important for a healthy society. Now has it been run well in the past .. No

Part of the issue today is that its become and US vs them in group out group thing. People calling people commies or Fascists and over simplification of nuanced positions is one of the reasons its impossible to have a decent conversation with hardly anyone now.. even with people that are otherwise fully functioning adult humans.
 
Two50noob said:
Believe both those things (well you could steal it obviously but i digress). Not a conservative a good social safety net is important for a healthy society. Now has it been run well in the past .. No

Part of the issue today is that its become and US vs them in group out group thing. People calling people commies or Fascists and over simplification of nuanced positions is one of the reasons its impossible to have a decent conversation with hardly anyone now.. even with people that are otherwise fully functioning adult humans.
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Hey in communist Cuba, people get free health care, schooling & taken care of. That can't be a bad thing, right?
 
RockerGuy said:
Hey in communist Cuba, people get free health care, schooling & taken care of. That can't be a bad thing, right?
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And in Denmark, Sweden, Germany, Norway, Belgium, Luxemburg, Switzerland, etc. Yes, it's a good thing.
 
Schneller said:
And in Denmark, Sweden, Germany, Norway, Belgium, Luxemburg, Switzerland, etc. Yes, it's a good thing.
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I think you missed his point, however, generally if affordable, universal healthcare (if it remains efficient) is beneficial. However, what is going down in the US is neither beneficial nor sustainable in any possible way.
 
Schneller said:
Pot meet kettle: absolutely! I'm not about to change my world view due to some chatting on an off topic thread on a motorcycle Internet forum. Like I said, I'm just expressing my opinions. We're just having fun here.
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Actually, why does the locale or messenger matter? If it so happens that something said here is logical, reasonable, etc isn't it worth real consideration? oh wait, this is GTAM OT..... :)

And of course we can have fun along the way.....
 
Surely it's obvious that big government has been bad in all its forms? And surely it's obvious that our Conservatives have not acted conservatively?
 
Schneller said:
I hope you're not simple minded enough to ignore the world and social context, and blame municipal liberal mismanagement for Detroit's problems. They had crooked mayors too, but its not even their fault.
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I'll leave that preogative to the original poster. :D

“Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains.”
― Winston Churchill http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/aging <-Hey it's a misquote :D Does that mean it's the biggest lie? (Francois Guisot) http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/List_of_misquotations
 
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Snobike Mike said:
Actually, why does the locale or messenger matter? If it so happens that something said here is logical, reasonable, etc isn't it worth real consideration? oh wait, this is GTAM OT..... :)
And of course we can have fun along the way.....
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In a motorcycle forum, there is going to be a larger yahoo index than in a more egghead/academic/professional type of forum.
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