In the father's defense, who the f steals a '97 Camry?
Amber alert
- Thread starter ToSlow
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unbelievable.
glad that they found the kid safe..... and again the alert system sucks the hind tit.
I was driving back from the States, I saw the digital highway sign a few miles after I crossed the border at Fort Erie. Then the alert came over the radio....couldn't understand a word that was said. They really need to do something about that robot.
I was driving back from the States, I saw the digital highway sign a few miles after I crossed the border at Fort Erie. Then the alert came over the radio....couldn't understand a word that was said. They really need to do something about that robot.
Thirty or forty years ago it wasn't uncommon for our parents to carry babies on their laps while in the car. Kids used to roam around the car, unbelted, as they cruised down the highway . Parents used to smoke a few packs on the way up to the cottage, kids in the back seat. And yes, parents used to "dash into" a store to get something with a young kid in the back seat, engine running, doors unlocked.
Times change. We don't do any of that **** anymore and for good reason.
They say airplane crashes never have a single cause. That is, a single failure in the weather, the piloting or the aircraft itself is almost never to blame. It's always a number of things that went wrong that led to the accident. In this case, the real criminal is the car thief but the father can't be absolved of his failures to carry out his responsibilities for the welfare of the child; leaving the kid unattended in a sketchy situation (a flea market parking lot...), leaving the the kid unattended in a car; leaving the kid in a car with the engine running and the doors unlocked. I mean...seriously?
How can dad's actions be looked at as anything other than negligent and thus borderline criminal vis a vis child welfare and parental responsibility? People are ****** at "dad" because while the perp stole a POS Camry it was dad that put the child in such danger in the first place. In my book, that's worse that losing a crappy Toyota.
Blackfin, I fully understand and agree with what you're saying except the last paragraph. It's not borderline criminal imho no matter what the law says. It's poor judgement at best. Keep criminal charges out of questionable parenting. Don't dog pile with police (who everybody distrusts otherwise) backing. Let's concentrate on the real criminal. Odd that the value of the stolen item has any bearing at all. Says a lot about our sense of criminal justice.
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I hear you. But I see one criminal and one extremely negligent person. that's all. If the criminal decided to do something else, there would be no stolen car, no missing child and no amber alert. If the negligent person was less negligent there was still a stolen car, but no missing child nor amber alert.
The problem is, times have changed dramatically in the last 15-20 years and people don't realize always that nobody can control what goes in mind of other people, but everyone can control their own actions (barring some extreme cases). Always the simpler route to take ...
I would suggest that you view the father as an "extremely negligent person" in the context of your perception of the world we live in rather than the reality of the world we live in. You could downgrade "extremely negligent, charge him criminally" to "maybe not the best idea somebody have a chat with him".
Hey, they have to put warning signs on laundry detergent pods bc people were giving them to kids to play with.
They took wheels off of those walker things bc kids were rolling down the stairs.
And kids are getting car-jack-napped bc people are leaving a 3 month old in an unlocked running car.
There should be some sort of test or certification before some people should be allowed to reproduce. I may or may not fall into that category.
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They took wheels off of those walker things bc kids were rolling down the stairs.
And kids are getting car-jack-napped bc people are leaving a 3 month old in an unlocked running car.
There should be some sort of test or certification before some people should be allowed to reproduce. I may or may not fall into that category.
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I'd like to see the video of what actually happened.
I can tell you that I have done this scenario a few times times with my wife and kid ... think of a -20c day in january for this and I don't think there is anything unusual with what I'm doing. lots of people do what I do below.
1. We pull up to the front of a restaurant
2. wife gets out to go inside and put our name down
3. I get out of the car to walk to the passenger rear of my car
4. I take my kid out of the passenger rear car seat
5. I bring the kid inside to my wife who now has our name down
6. I come back out to my running car and go find parking
If the thief jumped into the drivers seat right after my step 3 before I could get to step 4 then he would have stole my car and kidnapped my kid. Was I negligent ? I don't think so, I was just walking around my car to get my kid out.
again, I'd like to see the video of this.
I can tell you that I have done this scenario a few times times with my wife and kid ... think of a -20c day in january for this and I don't think there is anything unusual with what I'm doing. lots of people do what I do below.
1. We pull up to the front of a restaurant
2. wife gets out to go inside and put our name down
3. I get out of the car to walk to the passenger rear of my car
4. I take my kid out of the passenger rear car seat
5. I bring the kid inside to my wife who now has our name down
6. I come back out to my running car and go find parking
If the thief jumped into the drivers seat right after my step 3 before I could get to step 4 then he would have stole my car and kidnapped my kid. Was I negligent ? I don't think so, I was just walking around my car to get my kid out.
again, I'd like to see the video of this.
@chiller I agree with your post. I always would put my sons in the car, then go around and load the groceries etc, so they were not in the cold. And I would feel terrible if that is what happened. But my understanding is it was father and child, and he went into a flea market for "2 minutes".
Fwiw, best investment for me was auto starter. Heat on, start car, put kids in, load up. Someone tries to steal it, car shuts off bc no keys.
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Fwiw, best investment for me was auto starter. Heat on, start car, put kids in, load up. Someone tries to steal it, car shuts off bc no keys.
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"IMHO" is cool. It's all most of us have
But legally-speaking there is a fine line between "poor judgement" and "negligence." In LaPlante v. Laplante, the judge wrote:
"“… “[E]rror of judgment" alone will not amount to negligence. That must,of course, be right, in the sense that there may be several courses ofconduct any of which a reasonably careful parent might follow in a givensituation, and it will be enough to answer a claim in negligence that thecourse adopted by the defendant parent was one of those which thereasonable careful parent might have taken, even though events may, ofcourse, have shown the choice to have been unfortunate.”"
A paper on the issue of parental responsibility and negligence includes:
"The LaPlante decision also indicates that the test to be applied in determiningwhether that duty has been discharged is an “objective” one in the sense that theparent is expected to do, or not to do, that which, according to community standardsof the time, the ordinary reasonably careful parent would do, or not do, in the samecircumstances. The test does, however, have a subjective element in that thereasonable parent must be put in the position in which (and with the knowledgewhich) the defendant parent found him/herself."
I've underlined something of interest: As I mentioned previously, thirty or forty years ago this sort of thing may have been within the norms of community standards but what happened the other day is not; times have changed and so have norms. Errors in judgement happen all the time but errors of a particularly egregious nature, errors that no reasonably careful parent nowadays would make, tread that fine line.
Leaving a 3 month old in a running, unlocked car in a public place because it's too inconvenient to take 10 seconds to park the car and pull the kid out of a car seat is pretty egregious. Even if we say, "Okay, it's just bad judgement, no police involvement..." I'd still expect some form of visit from child protective services to establish whether or not there's an ongoing risk to that child's safety from repeats of this or other parental behaviours.
I get freaked out when I can't see him because he's moving from one structure to another in the McDonald's PlayPlace.
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Your understanding based on what? Your amorphous anger at society? Witnesses have said the father actually got shoved out of the way by the thief. Which explains why having the kid in back didn't deter him; he was too busy to notice the kid was there. This was clearly a crime of opportunity, and as soon as he realised there was a kid in back he was going to ditch the car, which he did 7km away.
No, not all.
The report I saw stated that he left the car running, doors unlocked, child in car and went into the flea market "for only 2 minutes". My comments are based on that. Like I posted, if loading groceries and a guy jumps in, or was pushed out of the way, that's different. I am going by the story that was first told.
Now, I'm sure the "pushed out of the way" story would make the father seem less negligent. But I haven't heard that yet. And when the father was interviewed on CP24 he didn't say he was pushed. (Although his son went missing, he may not have been thinking straight.)
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http://www.citynews.ca/2016/03/21/should-the-father-in-sundays-amber-alert-face-a-charge/
This says he left the kid in the car. Did he come back out and get pushed?
^^^^ this reads like I'm trying to start an argument, but not my intention.
Just posting my view. Based on the fact that my kids arethe most important things to me in this world and I don’t know how I could live if anything ever happened to them as a result of my bad judgment.
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This says he left the kid in the car. Did he come back out and get pushed?
^^^^ this reads like I'm trying to start an argument, but not my intention.
Just posting my view. Based on the fact that my kids arethe most important things to me in this world and I don’t know how I could live if anything ever happened to them as a result of my bad judgment.
Sent from a Samsung Galaxy far, far away using Tapatalk
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