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Y'all might want to keep an eye out for change of plans. Stealth Covid BA.2
- Thread starter MacDoc
- Start date
70+ got me a full shot. The Mrs, sub 70 got half. She also weighs half of what I weigh. Pharmamath?
Sly virus is reloading....
www.npr.org
More contagious version of omicron spreads in U.S., fueling worries
The omicron BA.2 variant spreads about 30% more easily and has caused surges in other countries. Its steady increase in the U.S. raises questions about the wisdom of rolling back COVID restrictions.
www.npr.org
world waking up
www.newsweek.com
nurse my staff's squeeze works with has had Covid 3 times
BEFORE this.
Reality check 70,000 a week dying of covid. Fat lady cowering in the dressing room...
www.newsweek.com
Stealth BA.2 Omicron Variant Can Reinfect People Who Had BA.1, Study Finds
Dozens of people in Denmark have caught BA.2 within months of catching BA.1—meaning they caught Omicron twice.
www.newsweek.com
nurse my staff's squeeze works with has had Covid 3 times
BEFORE this.Reality check 70,000 a week dying of covid. Fat lady cowering in the dressing room...
Conditions 'Ideal' for More Transmissible, Dangerous COVID Variant: WHO
WHO Director-General Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus called it a "dangerous narrative" to believe the pandemic is over.
www.newsweek.com
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Don't worry. Dougie says we're done. What wave was just subsiding?world waking up
Stealth BA.2 Omicron Variant Can Reinfect People Who Had BA.1, Study Finds
Dozens of people in Denmark have caught BA.2 within months of catching BA.1—meaning they caught Omicron twice.
nurse my staff's squeeze works with has had Covid 3 times
Reality check 70,000 a week dying of covid. Fat lady cowering in the dressing room...
Conditions 'Ideal' for More Transmissible, Dangerous COVID Variant: WHO
WHO Director-General Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus called it a "dangerous narrative" to believe the pandemic is over.
lesson here
www.bbc.com
Hong Kong: What went wrong with its Covid plan?
The city saw early success with its zero Covid policy, but Omicron has brought it to its knees.
www.bbc.com
The way through the endemic is more transparency from government and less fear Mongering or divisive policy.
Trust in government and each other is crucial because the damage done by lockdowns and the policy hammer has taken a toll on us.
At this point, unless we see death in the streets, implementing any new restrictive Government policy will be impossible as public opinion and polls are as significant as “science” is in policy making. Witness recent events here and abroad.
Ford was absolutely right in resisting the vaccine passport but unfortunately could not pushback the herds demanding it.
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Ford fumbled hs way through the entire pandemic.
Wanna compare notes?
Ontario 12,288 deaths 14.5 million pop
Australia 5,015 deaths 26 million pop
Keep those rose coloured glasses on ....
www.thestar.com
and the masks
www.scientificamerican.com
Wanna compare notes?
Ontario 12,288 deaths 14.5 million pop
Australia 5,015 deaths 26 million pop
Keep those rose coloured glasses on ....
Ontario’s Omicron death toll on the rise and getting worse
Mounting fatalities come as province grapples with highest number of COVID hospitalizations, rising long-term-care outbreaks and crushing staff shortages.
www.thestar.com
and the masks
zing
There Is Nothing Normal about One Million People Dead from COVID
Mass media and policy makers are pushing for a return to pre-COVID times while trying to normalize a staggering death toll
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DownUnder
Well-known member
Can't compare a province with land borders to an island.. Australia did well at the start of the pandemic and kept the original more deadly virus at bay. Omicron is just too contagious for contact tracing to work well, but the fact it's milder is excellent and as Bill Gates said has become a form of vaccine.Ford fumbled hs way through the entire pandemic.
Wanna compare notes?
Ontario 12,288 deaths 14.5 million pop
Australia 5,015 deaths 26 million pop
Keep those rose coloured glasses on ....
Ontario’s Omicron death toll on the rise and getting worse
Mounting fatalities come as province grapples with highest number of COVID hospitalizations, rising long-term-care outbreaks and crushing staff shortages.
and the masks
zing
There Is Nothing Normal about One Million People Dead from COVID
Mass media and policy makers are pushing for a return to pre-COVID times while trying to normalize a staggering death toll
Again dieing OF covid and dieing WITH covid are terms being used to muddy the waters. After the first year Australia was at about 900 covid deaths... the government at that point admitted they had ALL died WITH covid.
I have a good friend back home that's a pharmasist at one of the hospitals (In Australia there are pharmasists that go from patient to patient to make sure doctors dont kill people with messed up prescriptions). Have talked to him through the whole pandemic and the government was pushing hospital staff extremely hard waiting for the big one. The big one didn't happen, but a lot of staff burned out being on constant high alert.
I do agree ford screwed up a lot, but so did everyone. Look at that moron that's running Victoria.... got the state locked down because instead of using the military like every other state, he hired his friends security company to take care of the quarantine hotels.
Ya I agree...I'm no fan of either JT or DF...but in all honesty...I don't think any of the alternatives would have fared much better.
It's just easier to poo poo the guys in charge...because it's more fun, and it's easy.
Mad Mike
Well-known member
You can't always compare 2 regions without looking at details that contribute to COVID spread. All of Canada sees cold winters which is the perfect environment for spread, COVID likes the cold and when people are clustered indoors. Also remember the population of the GTA and Sydney metros are about the same, however the GTA density is more than double -- another friend of Covid.Ford fumbled hs way through the entire pandemic.
Wanna compare notes?
Ontario 12,288 deaths 14.5 million pop
Australia 5,015 deaths 26 million pop
Keep those rose coloured glasses on ....
Ontario’s Omicron death toll on the rise and getting worse
Mounting fatalities come as province grapples with highest number of COVID hospitalizations, rising long-term-care outbreaks and crushing staff shortages.
and the masks
zing
There Is Nothing Normal about One Million People Dead from COVID
Mass media and policy makers are pushing for a return to pre-COVID times while trying to normalize a staggering death toll
I do think AU did a good job. From what I saw they had a more responsible approach, response was coordinated and managed by their Federal Gov't. Canada's Feds bungled the response -- late deliveries of vaccines and PPE, confusing messaging from Health Canada, and little coordination across the country. Provinces were left to figure out how to fight the pandemic, local public health units were left to handle testing, care, and vaccinations.
Canadian Feds did a good job of blowin' hi-dough.
Keep in mind AU was locking down with only a small handful of cases, and people here complain (FreeDumbConvoy anyone) we are locking down with multiple thousands, imagine if we did what AU did! In the end there were many ways to move forward and most countries did a combination of things, some things more, some less, environmental factors like humidity, geographical, and cultural factors also played a part.
-Lock downs reduce transmission.
-Vaccination rate reduces transmission.
-Social distancing reduces transmission.
-Masking reduces transmission.
-Quality of masks reduce transmission.
-Totally locked Island borders reduces incoming transmission (AU, NZ).
-High humidity reduces transmission.
-Cultures where people contact each other less reduces transmission (less kissing on the cheek type of thing).
-.....etc..
-The only big failure I have seen is contact tracing IMO, I see no examples where it was done well enough to play a big part in control.
Key term is reduces not prevents. We look at infection and death rates around the world and the patterns are clear, some did more of one thing and less of others and that still got a good outcome. Some had border control advantages. Some waited too long to act or did stuff half assed or were slow to roll out vaccinations and played catch-up. Some like say Florida had environmental advantages like humidity.
What many seem to miss and what some media takes advantage of is that no one thing above was the silver bullet, they were all tools in the box. That is where we get the look country X has lower rates and less vaccinated crap, yes that is the case but they did other stuff to do that, stuff the same people will scream about if done that way here.
The danger today is the quick repeal of mandates when at this point we don't know what is coming and putting the cat back in the bag will be difficult. Early last fall most people thought we would be done by xmas, how did that work out?
-Lock downs reduce transmission.
-Vaccination rate reduces transmission.
-Social distancing reduces transmission.
-Masking reduces transmission.
-Quality of masks reduce transmission.
-Totally locked Island borders reduces incoming transmission (AU, NZ).
-High humidity reduces transmission.
-Cultures where people contact each other less reduces transmission (less kissing on the cheek type of thing).
-.....etc..
-The only big failure I have seen is contact tracing IMO, I see no examples where it was done well enough to play a big part in control.
Key term is reduces not prevents. We look at infection and death rates around the world and the patterns are clear, some did more of one thing and less of others and that still got a good outcome. Some had border control advantages. Some waited too long to act or did stuff half assed or were slow to roll out vaccinations and played catch-up. Some like say Florida had environmental advantages like humidity.
What many seem to miss and what some media takes advantage of is that no one thing above was the silver bullet, they were all tools in the box. That is where we get the look country X has lower rates and less vaccinated crap, yes that is the case but they did other stuff to do that, stuff the same people will scream about if done that way here.
The danger today is the quick repeal of mandates when at this point we don't know what is coming and putting the cat back in the bag will be difficult. Early last fall most people thought we would be done by xmas, how did that work out?
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DownUnder
Well-known member
The lockdowns in Australia (other then victoria) were a very different affair. A case gets detected-> the city shuts down-> contact tracing conducted-> everyone that was contaminated got quarantined->, the rest of the city opened back up. Usually a 2-3 day process.
States like Queensland didn't even have mandatory mask rules in place for the vast majority of the pandemic.
At the end of the day it's just a very contagious flu, if your a healthy young person you should have nearly zero chance of death. Canada right now is at 90% vaccinated, what percentage of the unvaccinated have been exposed to the virus and have antibodies too is unknown but I'd say it's probably a lot, I think it's time to open up and stop living in fear.
Except Australian States have land borders and where enforced as with Queensland, deaths were kept to 7 until Omicron came around and still only 550 deaths.....anyone thinking Omicron is "just a cold" is deluding themselves ..and BA2 will be worse ..
Contact tracing and lockdowns when needed and strict border controls....we had a single 3 day lockdown during the whole pandemic because ANY cases were jumped on immediately.
Victoria struggled with erratic policies and difficult population demographics and had far more deaths per capita early on.
Will be interesting ( scary ) to see how opening up impacts the deaths. Me - I'm more concerned now than at the beginning of the pandemic and taking appropriate steps including N95 masks.
For months and months we had zero restrictions except for sign in for contact tracing as there was no community covid at all.
The biggest criticism was getting the vaccines rolling out and accessing...Trudeau did a good job of sourcing and it's up to the provinces to deliver and to set policy so places like Alberta faceplanted trying to open up too early ....Ontario muddled through.....
Anti-vaxxers provided a pool of transmission and a much oversized contribution to hospitalization.....and still do....fuckwits.
But you understand deaths are not and have never been the issue, yes?
Never feels good saying that…sigh
As for the AU approach, it is entirely my point that if you do some of my list more extreme, also some environmental aspects others can be less. It does not at all mean the others do not also work and a solution that uses a different mix is not valid. BTW Australians must be much more pliable than Canadians as that would have never flown here (FreeDumbs!!!!!).
Very contagious flu, lol. BTW based on your flu comments maybe the mainstream media is not your "thing", take a look, we are moving to open things up....
Maybe the the mainstream media is not very reliable purveyor of risk....I'm very aware of the science and medicine...environmental is just a red herring.
You only have to look at the death rates to know what worked and what didn't -
deaths from Covid
16,933 Sweden 10 mill pop
1,549 Norway 5.4 mill pop
What worked is restrictions and tracking. Aus could have done even better and not all states were the same in policy or outcome.
Covid is not the flu
www.forbes.com
Everyone is tired of the pandemic....the virus could give a rats ass.
You only have to look at the death rates to know what worked and what didn't -
deaths from Covid
16,933 Sweden 10 mill pop
1,549 Norway 5.4 mill pop
What worked is restrictions and tracking. Aus could have done even better and not all states were the same in policy or outcome.
Covid is not the flu
Don’t Treat Covid Like Flu, WHO Says, As Nations Ditch Restrictions And Live With Virus
"It's a new virus, and we must go on treating it as though it is full of surprises, very nasty and rather cunning," said the WHO’s Dr. David Nabarro.
www.forbes.com
Everyone is tired of the pandemic....the virus could give a rats ass.
I agree as does a psychiatrist I know. Unfortunately the "Rights" people and those that create terms like vaccine passports instead of calling them immunization records spin the issues into foil hat territory.
At what point does Bill's right to go into a restaurant trump Fred's asthmatic kid's right to live? In wave X we may have to answer that question. If half capacity becomes the norm dining out is going to get really expensive. Half the capapcity = twice the price. Doubling the price will cut the number that can afford outings even further.
We've built a society that has become accustomed to luxuries and few today could withstand the trials of the London Blitz or Siege of Leningrad.
It's only fear mongering when there is little to fear .... not the case just now.
Pubs, elevators, buses, aircraft, even stadiums etc, all venues have restrictions on the number of people/seats available most often for fire purposes just now for distancing purposes.
The basic problem in policy right now is weighing risks of continual spread and pressure on healthcare vs "back to normal"....
Vaccine restrictions have been around a lot longer than this pandemic - there are places you cannot go, jobs you cannot take etc without being vaccinated for certain diseases and not just covid.
What's an acceptable level of deaths/prevention???
Is putting a mask on in public much different than a seat belt in a car? Helmet on to ride? Passport across the border? Hard hat at a construction site?
Anti-vaxxers and freedumbs types are gadflies on policy decisions leaders are elected to make.
Pubs, elevators, buses, aircraft, even stadiums etc, all venues have restrictions on the number of people/seats available most often for fire purposes just now for distancing purposes.
The basic problem in policy right now is weighing risks of continual spread and pressure on healthcare vs "back to normal"....
Vaccine restrictions have been around a lot longer than this pandemic - there are places you cannot go, jobs you cannot take etc without being vaccinated for certain diseases and not just covid.
What's an acceptable level of deaths/prevention???
Is putting a mask on in public much different than a seat belt in a car? Helmet on to ride? Passport across the border? Hard hat at a construction site?
Anti-vaxxers and freedumbs types are gadflies on policy decisions leaders are elected to make.
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