Why don't car enthusiasts complain about 'nannies?' Or do they!?

Evoex

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So we've all heard the qualms that riders have for the introduction of nannies, no need to rehash.

I've now spent over a year on ethusiasts forums across various car brands and I haven't come across any of these rants;
'Screw ABS!!'
'Why does my 911 come with Traction Control???'
'Learn 2 control your vehicle with the throttle you nubcake'

I wonder why the disparity between the two? :unsure:
 
On a serious note, we did complain about ABS back in the 80's when it was starting to proliferate. I recall one of the Italian CEO's stating that it was useless because most good drivers could perform threshold braking faster (and he was right, at least at that time).
 
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So we've all heard the qualms that riders have for the introduction of nannies, no need to rehash.

I've now spent over a year on ethusiasts forums across various car brands and I haven't come across any of these rants;
'Screw ABS!!'
'Why does my 911 come with Traction Control???'
'Learn 2 control your vehicle with the throttle you nubcake'

I wonder why the disparity between the two? :unsure:

Cars are a lot simpler and less dangerous to drive. That means a lot more low skill owner-enthusiasts who have never experienced the difference.

I grew up driving RWD v8 cars with all season tires. Most of the car enthusiasts i know sre uncomfortable with a stick, if they can drive one at all. Fewer are comfortable with a RWD in the snow.

Let’s just say they need the Nannies.
 
Cars are a lot simpler and less dangerous to drive. That means a lot more low skill owner-enthusiasts who have never experienced the difference.

I grew up driving RWD v8 cars with all season tires. Most of the car enthusiasts i know sre uncomfortable with a stick, if they can drive one at all. Fewer are comfortable with a RWD in the snow.

Let’s just say they need the Nannies.
Uncomfortable with a stick and call themselves an enthusiast? Hmmm.. takes all kinds I guess.

Less dangerous? What are we discussing here, throwing it around the dragon or commuting across the 401.
 
most good drivers could perform threshold braking faster and he was right, at least at that time

The key was good drivers. Now that they'll give a DL to anyone with a pulse and a crayon, the skills have gone right in the toilet. Watching people drive in the recent snowstorms puts a cherry on top of that discussion - coming down the 35/115 a few days ago I counted no less than 6 cars in the ditch or the median between Peterborough and Orono, and one tractor trailer upside down in the rhubarb at the merge. Yeah, the roads were not great, but for anyone actually driving at a sane pace, with a shred of skill, they were totally passable.

Anyhow, as for crutches...meh, I think most people are beyond that now, including enthusiasts. ABS is refined to the point where it just works all the time and benefits the people who still remember to steer in an emergency vs just target fixating and driving right into whatever they're trying to avoid. Traction control and stability control systems make RWD cars behave like they're on rails, better than FWD cars of old even - going back as far as my wife's old Chrysler 300 (RWD) and to her current day Ioniq5 (also RWD), the stability control and traction control are insanely good - I could NOT make either of those cars oversteer, understeer, or have the back end come around when those systems are engaged. Without doubt they've saved tens of millions of accidents from both novice and in-over-their-head enthusiasts as well. "Launch Control" is something that's even actively embraced by the enthusiast crowd it seems.
 
Uncomfortable with a stick and call themselves an enthusiast? Hmmm.. takes all kinds I guess.
I have 2 BILs who call themselves enthusiasts, they have nice cars but couldn’t beat my daughter around a track in her 2l Jetta.
Less dangerous? What are we discussing here, throwing it around the dragon or commuting across the 401.
Both.
 
The key was good drivers. Now that they'll give a DL to anyone with a pulse and a crayon, the skills have gone right in the toilet. Watching people drive in the recent snowstorms puts a cherry on top of that discussion - coming down the 35/115 a few days ago I counted no less than 6 cars in the ditch or the median between Peterborough and Orono, and one tractor trailer upside down in the rhubarb at the merge. Yeah, the roads were not great, but for anyone actually driving at a sane pace, with a shred of skill, they were totally passable.

Anyhow, as for crutches...meh, I think most people are beyond that now, including enthusiasts. ABS is refined to the point where it just works all the time and benefits the people who still remember to steer in an emergency vs just target fixating and driving right into whatever they're trying to avoid. Traction control and stability control systems make RWD cars behave like they're on rails, better than FWD cars of old even - going back as far as my wife's old Chrysler 300 (RWD) and to her current day Ioniq5 (also RWD), the stability control and traction control are insanely good - I could NOT make either of those cars oversteer, understeer, or have the back end come around when those systems are engaged. Without doubt they've saved tens of millions of accidents from both novice and in-over-their-head enthusiasts as well. "Launch Control" is something that's even actively embraced by the enthusiast crowd it seems.
Welcome to try my Jag sometime...it's allegedly AWD but the tail comes around if you sneeze! 😂

Okay so let's just say people are over it now, because why? It works well, it's been decades, new generation?
 
Welcome to try my Jag sometime...it's allegedly AWD but the tail comes around if you sneeze! 😂

Okay so let's just say people are over it now, because why? It works well, it's been decades, new generation?

I think it's a generational thing. A lot of enthusiasts now that aren't of the boomer generation have grown up for the most part knowing of all these features since they began driving. And they don't seem to have the "back in my day we didn't need things like ABS!" mentality that the older crowd have. They just accept that some of these systems do good stuff, using something like Launch Control as an example.

As for the Jag, are you sure the AWD is working? Every Jag I've ever seen had the dashboard lit up kinda like this lol. 😄

1738810459034.png
 
As far as I know, the only people who complain about the nanny stuff is the offroad riders where that stuff gets in the way when it isn't disabled. And the manufacturers make it difficult to easily and instantly disable. You need to be able to disengage ABS on the rear wheel offroad to make a quick J- or U-turn. Same with traction control when you're in the sand or some other situation where wheelspin will help. At least on cars you can press a button to disable TC because they know there are condition on the road where you need to do this (like when stuck in mud or snow).
 
At least on cars you can press a button to disable TC because they know there are condition on the road where you need to do this (like when stuck in mud or snow).

In the snow a few nights ago I disabled the TC on my wife's new (RWD) Ioniq5 in a snow covered parking lot.

Whoaboy that was fun 😄
 
I think it's a generational thing. A lot of enthusiasts now that aren't of the boomer generation have grown up for the most part knowing of all these features since they began driving. And they don't seem to have the "back in my day we didn't need things like ABS!" mentality that the older crowd have. They just accept that some of these systems do good stuff, using something like Launch Control as an example.

As for the Jag, are you sure the AWD is working? Every Jag I've ever seen had the dashboard lit up kinda like this lol. 😄

View attachment 72294
I think you've confused it with every 10 year old Mercedes...when I did valet that was pretty much an easy bet.
 
I think you've confused it with every 10 year old Mercedes...when I did valet that was pretty much an easy bet.
My parents' '99 BMW 323i that was bought new from the dealership and always brought in for service on time eventually developed a habit of having at least one of the dash warnings lit up at all times. Once the underlying issue was fixed, another would come on within a week or two like clockwork. After I stopped taking it to the dealership and started servicing it myself, the lights stopped coming on as frequently.
 
There is a fair bit of skill and hand to eye coordination involved in riding a motorcycle well, so good riders got upset that an average Joe got a bunch of electronic upgrades to bring them to that level, hence the distain.

The thing is though, there is a lot of riders that thought they were good, but if they were, would have adapted and still been miles ahead of the average Joe.
 
The thing with all the nannies is that everything is great till its not and that can catch the unwary or hamfisted out in a big way.
If you don't need them because electronics takes care of it you never develop the skills to be able to truly control your ride when thing go south.
That being said i do appreciate modern conveniences for the daily commute.
Along that topic just watching someone ride their motorcycle in traffic for a minute or two i can tell if they learned to drive on a motorcycle first or a car first with very good accuracy as there are a host of tells.
 
I'm old enough to remember the big debate in the mid sixties about whether or not seat belts were safe. My uncle claimed that they were deadly if a car ran off a bridge and sank. The people in the car would be trapped by their belts and drown. He also claimed it would be better to be "thrown clear" in an accident vs. being crushed in a car. You can't fix stupid.

The vast majority of drivers are better off with ABS, traction control, stability control etc........ Yes, there may be some who can outbrake ABS or are actually highly skilled drivers, but they are in the minority.

Ask anyone if they are an average or above average skilled driver or rider and you'll see examples of the Dunning-Kruger Effect.
 
In the snow a few nights ago I disabled the TC on my wife's new (RWD) Ioniq5 in a snow covered parking lot.

Whoaboy that was fun 😄
That's not where you want it disabled; snow donuts are for kids.

Next time you find a nice twisty country road, shut the traction control off and use the back wheels to help you around some corners.

Not as important in a e-car, but can be just as fun.
 
Many did complain when some of the early nanny devices came out. Yes due to change is bad...but also some of the nannies left something to be desired early on.

I think most of them are at the point tech wise there is not much to complain about unless one is Automotive-Amish and refuses to drive anything without a carb, a column manual...and maybe hand crank depending on the strictness of the sect.
 
Many did complain when some of the early nanny devices came out. Yes due to change is bad...but also some of the nannies left something to be desired early on.

I think most of them are at the point tech wise there is not much to complain about unless one is Automotive-Amish and refuses to drive anything without a carb, a column manual...and maybe hand crank depending on the strictness of the sect.
I don't complain about the nannies being present-- I am saddened that a few of the things that made driving fun are all but cancelled.

I like manual transmissions - I have 3 cars and a Jeep that are all manual. I would drive an 6 or 8 speed manual pickup of I could get one. I like driving RWD cars with manual transmissions - I wish I could get a small one that wasn't a Stang, Camaro or Subaroo - one of my cars is RWD.
 
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