Two Wheel overly picky on safety? | GTAMotorcycle.com

Two Wheel overly picky on safety?

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kamper

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I'm selling my 2011 250R, which I bought new from Snow City. I took it to Two Wheel in Guelph for the safety and they failed me, which surprised me. I wonder if anyone can comment on some of their claims?

  • throttle cable is routed incorrectly
  • missing rear side reflectors
  • headlight aim is too high
Aside from the possibility that I lost the reflectors (although I don't think I did), these all seem strange to me because they should have come properly set up from the factory. Is Two Wheel making stuff up? Did Snow City somehow mess up the bike setup?

  • play in rear linkage
They claim a couple of parts will need to be replaced and it'll cost a few hundred. The bike has only been gently ridden for around 7500 km. Does it seem reasonable that they'd need to be replaced already?

Aside from that, they claim that the steering head is loose and the rear axle is not aligned, which seem to me like plausible wear and tear. I'm assuming that isn't too difficult to fix.

Anyway, I'm trying to decide if I should pay Two Wheel to do the repairs or get a second opinion. Apparently riding the bike far will mean I have to pay to have it resafetied if Two Wheel does the work, and I also want to get this done quickly if possible because the buyer has been waiting a while already. I'm not interested in getting a not-too-thorough safety cert if there is actually anything wrong with the bike, but at the same time, I don't want to get hosed by Two Wheel if they're being overly picky for the sake of drumming up service work.
 
Yeah, some of that stuff sounds pretty sketchy, especially the veiled-threat bit about losing your safety money if you leave the shop. Well, good to know to stay away from Two Wheel anyway!
 
Get your safety done elsewhere.
Also, when did Snow City start selling Honda's again?
 
kamper said:
I'm selling my
Click to expand...
Important words. They know the next owner will be all over them if a safety is given when there are items like you listed that should have been caught. There is a shop who has given more relaxed safeties, well known, and is slammed for what he let's slip through. All the items needing attention are safety related, and the mechanic did what sounds like a proper inspection.
 
mikbusa said:
Important words. They know the next owner will be all over them if a safety is given when there are items like you listed that should have been caught. There is a shop who has given more relaxed safeties, well known, and is slammed for what he let's slip through.
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Yes, that's certainly possible. My concern is that they can easily use that as an excuse to do unnecessary work and I have no way of evaluating what they claim.

mikbusa said:
All the items needing attention are safety related, and the mechanic did what sounds like a proper inspection.
Click to expand...

Can you comment in more detail? As I mentioned, some of the items seem questionable to me, both the things that should have been correct coming from the factory and the rear linkage which shouldn't be shot after just 2 years. I'm hoping someone can provide insight into those specific issues, although I realize that's difficult without seeing the bike. That's why I'm leaning towards going for a second opinion at another mechanic. Worst case scenario is that I spend a little extra money for some piece of mind and Two Wheel's approach gets validated.
 
reflectors are mandatory by law, but no one...including cops give a crap (unless you are giving them a hard time and they are having a bad day)

and headlights aimed too high can blind oncoming traffic and people infront of you...though it's more annoying than anything since SUVs and their damn headlights are always aimed high anyways....easily adjusted with 3 screws

i had a 250r as my first bike the, big 30mm bolt in the middle was loose too, after 1500km...i retightened it to spec w/ torque wrench and thats it...

as for rear being misaligned....did you adjust your own chain? if not its highly unlikely that it's misaligned unless you been hitting some SERIOUS pot holes and curbs at speeds lol

but other than that, they are trying to rip you off for sure

walk away from that place OP
 
how the throttle cable is routed is not defined as requirement for a safety certification. If the safety requirements says "throttle cable must be routed according to manufacturer specifications" (which it does not), then they would have grounds for their denial. Correct throttle operation is all that is required. If it operates correctly, it doesn't matter how the cable is routed, given it does not violate any of the other safety requirements according to

http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/regs/english/elaws_regs_900611_e.htm.

On the flip side, there may be merit to what they are saying. Incorrect throttle cable routing is potentially dangerous, i.e. getting stuck at WOT of the cable moves during operation would be problematic. Throttle operation can be very sensitive to the cable angles and easily become stuck.

with regards to the reflectors:

"two red reflectors facing rearwards placed at the widest part of the vehicle, as far apart as practical, to indicate width. "

Side reflectors are not required for a safety, IIRC. Have a close read through the link though.

They may be correct about the headlamp, but it does sound suspicious given the low km. If you don't like it, go somewhere else.

"(2) A headlamp alignment inspection shall be carried out after front wheel alignment, rear axle tracking, beam switching and functioning of lamps have been inspected and tested"


 
kamper said:
I'm selling my 2011 250R, which I bought new from Snow City. I took it to Two Wheel in Guelph for the safety and they failed me, which surprised me. I wonder if anyone can comment on some of their claims?

  • throttle cable is routed incorrectly
  • missing rear side reflectors
  • headlight aim is too high
Aside from the possibility that I lost the reflectors (although I don't think I did), these all seem strange to me because they should have come properly set up from the factory. Is Two Wheel making stuff up? Did Snow City somehow mess up the bike setup?

  • play in rear linkage
They claim a couple of parts will need to be replaced and it'll cost a few hundred. The bike has only been gently ridden for around 7500 km. Does it seem reasonable that they'd need to be replaced already?

Aside from that, they claim that the steering head is loose and the rear axle is not aligned, which seem to me like plausible wear and tear. I'm assuming that isn't too difficult to fix.

Anyway, I'm trying to decide if I should pay Two Wheel to do the repairs or get a second opinion. Apparently riding the bike far will mean I have to pay to have it resafetied if Two Wheel does the work, and I also want to get this done quickly if possible because the buyer has been waiting a while already. I'm not interested in getting a not-too-thorough safety cert if there is actually anything wrong with the bike, but at the same time, I don't want to get hosed by Two Wheel if they're being overly picky for the sake of drumming up service work.
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That sounds overly picky and for their own benefit (earn some money with some unnecessary repair$$$$$$$ssss) , so I have to shake my head.

Go somewhere else, even if it means to pay again to have it inspected again.

Let me review your situation: It is a brand new bike that you bought from the dealer, and now it has 7500 km (you are the first owner). It is hard to believe that the throttle cable is routed incorrectly, unless you messed with it. If you didn’t, then that’s the way it came from the factory or the way the dealer prep the bike. Even if you did change the position of the cable, and now it is in a different way, as long as the throttle control operates correctly, it is not a problem.

The steering head loose MAY BE marginally out of specification - same with the rear axle alignment. But again, it is hard to believe that in only 7,500 kms it got so out of spec that it requires adjustment. Unless you were doing off roading with the bike.

Regarding the headlight aiming too high, I don’t even believe they actually measure it. Also, many bikes do not have a full range of adjustments. Some bikes do not have an adjustment.

Regarding the reflectors… please!
 
Crappy tire sells stick on red reflectors. I have put these on before to comply with HTA. Takes 5 minutes. Adjusting headlights downwards takes 5 minutes. Throttle cable? Check an online maintenance manual for your bike, I'm not sure under what circumstances the previous owner would have for routing it differently. Take it back with corrected items if you want but they do sound a little picky.

Alternatively, correct everything and sell your bike without the safety for one price, with the safety for another.
 
Some of these items seem a bit picky.
Rear axle out of alignment isn’t dangerous unless it’s grossly out (which you would probably notice). It will wear and tear but I wouldn’t classify it as a safety hazard. Plus most of the work listed can be done in under 30 minutes, and by anyone who has a decent tool set.

Get a manual, it shows cable routing. Check it, and see if they are BSing you.
 
Canadian tire has little to gain in a safety by scamming you. A bike shop will do any work so they have a lot to gain if they find "problems". That's why I go to CT for bikes.

Just saying.
 
I'm a mechanical engineer and I know about vehicles, and generally cannot be BS'ed. I would call them out, with a copy of the legislation printed and in hand.

Throttle linkage - Demonstrate that it operates correctly and then have the mechanic in question point to the item of legislation in question that requires it to be routed a certain way. (As someone already pointed out, there is no such requirement, as long as it functions correctly.)

Missing rear side reflectors - Well, if they are missing, they're missing. But again, have the mechanic point to the item in the legislation that requires them to be present.

Headlight aim - It is possible that this might be the case. But it is a matter of turning ONE screw in order to adjust it. Have the bike set up in their test fixture and demonstrate that the aim is incorrect ... and then adjust it right then and there. If they do not have a setup for checking headlight height by the numbers ... make a mental note of that.

Play in rear linkage - Ask for them to demonstrate it.

Steering head bearings - Same thing. Adjusting this, if necessary, is very simple although some bodywork/gas tank may need to come off in order to change it.

Rear axle not aligned - Get them to show you. Keep in mind that the markings on the swingarm are not guaranteed to be accurate. If they are complaining about axle alignment then it should be checked in a test fixture or by using the "string method" or something equivalent - not by the markings on the swingarm.

If they are reluctant to demonstrate these items then I'd state to them that I would be calling the Ministry. If that does not coax them to re-evaluate, then LEAVE, and call the Ministry, and do what the Ministry wants you to do (they may want you to bring the bike to one of their own inspectors).

In the business that I work in (which involves inspecting robots, not cars/bikes), the situation of writing an inspection report that recommends corrective actions that I would have a business interest in (e.g. performing the actual corrective work itself) is called "conflict of interest", and it is a big, big no-no. It is not completely prohibited, but I would have to declare the conflict as soon as it became apparent, and you can bet your bottom dollar that said declaration and evidence of it being provided to the customer is kept on file in the event of any future questions about it.

In my business, questions do come up about interpretation of standards all the time, and I'm happy to address them ... because I don't BS. I call it like I see it. They ought to do the same for you.
 
By the way, a possible outcome of the above discussion is that they want to give you your money back for the safety and tell you to go elsewhere ... if that's what happens, take them up on it.
 
kamper said:
Apparently riding the bike far will mean I have to pay to have it resafetied if Two Wheel does the work
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I recently had a bike safetied at Brampton Powersports which I failed the first time. They let me take the bike home to fix the problem and they told me that I had two weeks to get the bike back to them before I had to pay for another safety inspection.
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