So.....recession time!? | Page 4 | GTAMotorcycle.com

So.....recession time!?

My wife and kids have Hungarian citizenship I have looked into moving over there but there is a reason so many move here.
We have our Polish passports, I guess now they're EU, and have talked about it. I've been away for 30 years. I would be lost.

However, I have a huge support network that would help out however possible. Everyone in the family has a business, and each one feeds off the other basically. From hotels, to laundromats, B&Bs, renovations, and even high technology businesses. Each one works together to get cracking, and uses that as a base to branch out.

Aunt had a bakery, helped a cousin start his printing packaged goods business. She bought a hotel, he did the IT and other tech work. Another cousin started a laundromat, does her 2 hotels, and then others said 'if he's good enough for them, he can do ours'. Now he's got more work than he can handle. Also has a B&B. And the story goes on and on.

However, the EU money was flowing freely. Until it stopped recently. Poland stated they're not going to the EUR currency. Probably some other things, but that was a show stopper. Money dried up. The smart ones are tightening up and getting ready for the **** times. The dumb ones...well there's another AMG in the driveway.
 
Three papers today printed articles on raising interest rates to keep soaring inflation in check.
I don’t see a recession, but money as been almost free for too long .
I’m only a financial genius here , but when three Canadian papers print similar articles , well if there is smoke , there could be a fire


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It's a tough call. My brother will be a perpetual renter. They had a second kid during Covid. If kids are important to you, you can only delay so long before the choice is made for you. My brother may have a chance to buy when my parents die (depending on how long they spend in LTC) but he is already setting himself up for a fail there too. He wants to buy land he can hunt on which will leave him with no money to buy/build a place to live. He seems determined to take the hard road.
IMO a bush lot in the middle of moose pasture isn't a winner. A bit in taxes, lost income from cash in a safe investment > than a slab of venison.
 
IMO a bush lot in the middle of moose pasture isn't a winner. A bit in taxes, lost income from cash in a safe investment > than a slab of venison.
Especially when faced with ever increasing rent. Expenses keep increasing, bush parcel ROI is pretty crap (won't go down much but also won't climb as fast as securities or residential real estate nor be able to kick out income).
 
Especially when faced with ever increasing rent. Expenses keep increasing, bush parcel ROI is pretty crap (won't go down much but also won't climb as fast as securities or residential real estate nor be able to kick out income).
A bush lot can generate a few bucks from time to time but if you aren't there the locals can cherry pick the good stuff.
 
This is a pretty uniquely Canadian problem. So much of our GDP is based on non-productive assets (real estate) that we cannot afford to stop the train. The government will fight tooth and nail to keep people in their homes because if that house of cards collapses we are in for a really rough time.

The US has a highly diversified economy that will keep chugging along if there is a real estate correction. 2008 was a pretty bad case of that but they rode it out in the end.



There's the:
  • Renovators/investors/flippers who have fat HELOCs to throw around
  • Immigrants that pool their money to buy a house designed for 4/5 people which will have 10 - 15 people living in it
  • Foreign investors, sorry "international students"
  • Middle/upper class millennials whose parents are giving them $200k for a down payment
The problem is that everyone at every step of the way benefits from this scheme except for young Canadians whose parents aren't giving them $200k to get started. That includes
  • The government (GDP/economy growth)
  • Mortgage brokers/lenders/banks (why yes sure I'll approve you for a mortgage based on no legit financials and suitcase full of cash)
  • Existing home owners (I didn't save for retirement so I need my ****** bungalow from 1970 to increase 30% a year so I can have money when I'm 80)
  • Real estate agents

Young Canadians get the shaft because we are importing 500k people a year who will accept lower living standards. The rich get richer and the poorer get poorer, a story as old as time.
What's new here? 30 years ago when the GenX crowd was entering the housing market the same gov't, mortgage crowd, existing homeowners, and real estate pigs were at the trough. Same goes for those middle/upper class millennials - 30 years ago their parents, GenXers, got in easy if their Boomer parents fronted down payments. Somewhat correct about immigrants from cultures where multi-generational families share the same home -- but that really a density issue and that's been around for a while too. In the old days a new family put their 5-7 people in a 1br or basement apartment -- now it's just family instead of strangers living in the basement. Not much new here.

You are correct there are foreign investors in much larger numbers, that's not a Canadian phenomenon, urban real estate in every cosmopolitan city has moved very close to cash and gold on the liquidity scale -- that's not likely to change quickly, I think that is a meaningful change.

To me, the above has some impact on housing prices, but not as much as gov't policy. Here's what I see gov't doing wrong:

1) Immigration. We need immigrants to fuel growth, that's not a question -- just look at the number of unfilled jobs in our labour market. What we do need is better policy and entry criteria. On the policy side, there should be target zones - not the voluntary types they have now. We don't need 95/100 new immigrants piling into the greater Van and TO areas.

2) Too much centralization in the GTA and Vancouver. The feds do little to encourage economic development across the great expanse of Canada. There is no more room or housing for people in Toronto or Vancouver yet the plan is to dump 400,000 people a year into those markets.

3) Restrictive and onerous regulation. Getting building permits to build a factory or a house took a few days 30 years ago. In the GTA there are up to 4 layers of government and countless intergovernmental departments that slow applications and approvals, it can take months to get a building permit for a bathroom, and years for a warehouse. This adds enormous cost and delays the market's ability to react to changing needs. As a result, we have a serious supply issue.

4) Gov't money cannons. As the feds continue to shoot printed money out of firehoses, the price of things will go up. That's exactly what's happening now -- more money available means more people can and will bid. This particularly benefits the wealthy as their assets inflate offsetting the higher cost of goods -- but it kills the less well off as they have fewer assets to inflate, all they see is cost of goods going up.

1,2,3 & 4 are IMHO the problems that need fixing.
 
1) Immigration. We need immigrants to fuel growth, that's not a question -- What we do need is better policy and entry criteria. On the policy side, there should be target zones - not the voluntary types they have now. We don't need 95/100 new immigrants piling into the greater Van and TO areas.
Theres so much wrong in this post I dont know where to begin, so lets start here:

1)"just look at the number of unfilled jobs in our labour market." I dont know which planet you've been living on, but by all accounts, the labor shortage is a myth. Its been perpetuated for decades by businesses for self serving interests.

If by labor you mean mcjobs? Maybe. People who dont want to work low paying jobs while risking contracting covid, or people who think cerb is good money(lol)

Of course you'll likely (and predictably) point out the outliers(your limited experience in timmins, where they cant find roofers or framers or plumbers bla bla bla) but the edge case exception to the rule, doesnt invalidate the rule.

Anyone with a real career, that pays anything other than min wage, its a rat race, indicative of anything but a labor shortage. (multiple interviews(ranging from 3 to 10), ghosting by HR departments and recruiters, etc etc etc)
Maybe HR departments are just useless


2) "What we do need is better policy and entry criteria. On the policy side, there should be target zones - not the voluntary types they have now." aka force people to live where they dont want to, lmao, wont even touch this can-o-worms
 
2) "What we do need is better policy and entry criteria. On the policy side, there should be target zones - not the voluntary types they have now." aka force people to live where they dont want to, lmao, wont even touch this can-o-worms
No need to force anyone, just nudge them along. Here's a plot of land, house, etc with minimal property tax, or whatever else.

It's tough though...lot of open space in Canada for a reason. Nothing there, no one wants to live there. Chicken and the egg type of thing.
 
Need to feed the beat bud. If the country isn't raising it's population on its own, you need fresh bodies to replace those that are dying off and stopping payments into the pool.

Whether we like it or not, I'm an immigrant, immigration is a necessity here in Canada.
An intelligent immigration policy is an elephant in the room. Trump recognized it and in his own destructive way used it to minimize the United part of the country's name. His brutal tactics were inhumane and further divided the country.

I have a front and back door to my house and both have locks. No one comes in unless I want them in. Certain family members are always welcome for as long as they want.

Some are welcome to visit but give me an idea of how long you intend to stay and of your needs so I can be aware and say NO if your intentions are contrary to my existence.

Some people are welcome because I need their skills. If your skills are needed on a perpetual basis we will have to come to a mutual agreement for your housing and support. I may have to build or renovate to suit the situation. A neighbourhood may choose to cooperate in the housing but also benefit from your skills.

I am a socialist at heart but not totally stupid at math. What do we do with the unskilled immigrants? The starving in refugee camps?

A friend or relative that is down on their luck may need a while to get their head straight. OK, take a few days or weeks to come up with a game plan and stick to it. If you want to play computer games all day in my basement I'll drive you to a Motel 6 and give you $100 cash to sign in for the night, seeya.

What is a reasonable absorption rate for new people in Canada? 400,000 imports and about the same Canadian born. Yeah, the problem will take care of itself.

Wage stagnation. When artificial measures are put into place the system morphs to fit the artificial measures.

People of modest means couldn't afford maids or vacation junkets if the people that did the real work got decent wages. The people providing the vacations make the money. By making things artificially cheap the table gets tilted.

Unfortunately the systems are crooked like the Leaning Tower of Pisa. They made corrections to the leaning as it was being built making it impossible to completely fix. If it was straightened it would probably fall over. We may come to that.
 
No need to force anyone, just nudge them along. Here's a plot of land, house, etc with minimal property tax, or whatever else.

It's tough though...lot of open space in Canada for a reason. Nothing there, no one wants to live there. Chicken and the egg type of thing.
You could populate places outside of london, peterborough or kingston. No need to send them to Moose Factory.
 
No need to force anyone, just nudge them along. Here's a plot of land, house, etc with minimal property tax, or whatever else.

It's tough though...lot of open space in Canada for a reason. Nothing there, no one wants to live there. Chicken and the egg type of thing.
exactly

People know where the bread is buttered.
Theres a reason why half my highschool left for the west during the oil boom.
 
Theres so much wrong in this post I dont know where to begin, so lets start here:

1)"just look at the number of unfilled jobs in our labour market." I dont know which planet you've been living on, but by all accounts, the labor shortage is a myth. Its been perpetuated for decades by businesses for self serving interests.
On planet Newmarket you can't get unskilled factory labor with a full benefits+pension+50% premium over min wage.

CNC machine operators (load a machine, push a button) with 6mos experience are costing $40/hr. Operators with programming or tool setup skills can earn $10 more.
Of course you'll likely (and predictably) point out the outliers(your limited experience in timmins, where they cant find roofers or framers or plumbers bla bla bla) but the edge case exception to the rule, doesnt invalidate the rule.
Fortunately, there are a lot of Mennonites in the areas surrounding Timmins -- if you need a reference, Orvie and Eli can demolish, and re-build a 2 garage in 3 days, for $4000 in labor.
Anyone with a real career, that pays anything other than min wage, its a rat race, indicative of anything but a labor shortage. (multiple interviews(ranging from 3 to 10), ghosting by HR departments and recruiters, etc etc etc)
Maybe HR departments are just useless
PM if you need an interview coach -- I used to train them for a big bank. The interviewer will make the call on a good fit the moment the interview ends, even when more candidates are outside. Ghosting is a signal too.
2) "What we do need is better policy and entry criteria. On the policy side, there should be target zones - not the voluntary types they have now." aka force people to live where they dont want to, lmao, wont even touch this can-o-worms
Canada has a long history of recruiting immigrants to where the country's needs happen to be. Take a minute to look at the current

Rural and Northern Immigration Pilot

 
PM if you need an interview coach -- I used to train them for a big bank. The interviewer will make the call on a good fit the moment the interview ends, even when more candidates are outside. Ghosting is a signal too.
Not for me, but this is the general hiring process these days, and ghosting doesnt necessarily mean they dont call back, but they call back 3 weeks later instead of the 2 days the HR lady said (usually by then you've accepted another offer)

On planet Newmarket you can't get unskilled factory labor with a full benefits+pension+50% premium over min wage.

CNC machine operators (load a machine, push a button) with 6mos experience are costing $40/hr. Operators with programming or tool setup skills can earn $10 more.
Got any specific companies? I know MANY guys in brampton that dont know about this, but would legit love it

Canada has a long history of recruiting immigrants to where the country's needs happen to be. Take a minute to look at the current

Rural and Northern Immigration Pilot


Interesting, I wonder how many of the 400k+ come through this program?(Id be willing to bet few)
 
On planet Newmarket you can't get unskilled factory labor with a full benefits+pension+50% premium over min wage.

CNC machine operators (load a machine, push a button) with 6mos experience are costing $40/hr. Operators with programming or tool setup skills can earn $10 more.
#1 Unskilled @ $15.00 X 1.5 = $22.50 X 40 hours = $900 a week - taxes say $700 take home. The standard many sexist years ago was a man's first weeks wage should cover the accommodation. That math doesn't work anymore. Now it's 2+ weeks wages. The solution: Mr. Unskilled either works overtime or takes courses to increase his income.

#2 Is the $40 / hr the cost to the company or the wage to the employee? If it's the wage to the employee $40 X 40 hrs = $1600 - tax = $1200? Still not the rent. If a person was eyeing a house and could live for nothing in mom's basement they could save ~$62,000 a year. The house they want went up double that.

I'm not suggesting that the minimum wage should go to $50 / hour but our lifestyles are getting to a form of target fixation. People are so fixated on a dream that they ignore reality and fail to adjust. How do make people think outside the box?

Real estate and anything associated with it is screwing Canada. Yeah, great if you own but long term we're all renting from God. When he evicts you and you get dumped into a six foot lot six feet under does it matter whether there was ever a deed in your name. Sometimes I think drug pushers have more ethics than RE agents.
 
We are doing the opposite. We re-elected sockboy (again) after he literally acted like a kid in a candy store with the funding shotgun and shut down any attempt to be held accountable. He has been open on his plan. We endorsed it. We are getting what the majority wants (and the majority is dumb).
The alternatives didn't really put up much in terms of a 'better' option.

But you are correct...we got what WE, as a collective, voted in. Shame on us.
 

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