Rules for "Fallen Riders/In Memory of" forum

[Priller]

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I never understood why this was not done at the track or in racing series. So much can be learned but it seems it is a taboo thing to discuss.

Because so often one person's black and white is another person's grey, or one person's black is another person's white.Or to put it another way, what may seem cut and dried to you is contentious to someone else. These things often devolve into blame assignment, finger pointing, or litigating an incident after the fact. Better to not open the door at all, especially in what is often an otherwise harmonious paddock.

 

[Relax]

I get that.. but now you're basically back to hypotheticals.
I remember when we used to be able to do that.. the discussions went in ways that led to banning it.
I'm pretty sure.. if we try it again.. the same thing will happen.

If we are going to try it again.. maybe create a running thread in trash talk (similar to law enforcement).. at least that way no one will be accidentally run into a discussion they don't want to see.. I think being in TT will also hide it from google searches?

OK, if the bottom line is that people can't control themselves and act respectfully, then there's no way forward regardless of how reasonable the ask is. And that's a shame regardless of the topic.

 

[Evoex]

OK, if the bottom line is that people can't control themselves and act respectfully, then there's no way forward regardless of how reasonable the ask is. And that's a shame regardless of the topic.

It will almost always spin off into personal attacks/insults and the difference here is; anyone can act like a moron behind a screen, very little to any repercussions. Most people wouldn't dare to say a shred of the insults to another persons face. If we were to bring this situation to our local watering hole via say iPad and discuss over a few beers, i suspect we would probably have an enjoyable conversation with civil discourse.

 

[raginduck]

I saw Lightcycle's first crash. I remember thinking afterwards.. 'he's probably give up riding'.
I was very wrong!!!!

 

[Lightcycle]

I saw Lightcycle's first crash. I remember thinking afterwards.. 'he's probably give up riding'.
I was very wrong!!!!

Little did you know that would be the first of many, many.... many, many crashes.

 

[Mad Mike]

I think case study is much more valuable than hypotheticals. Maybe the rule could be changed to "no thoughtless and mean-spirited conversation - stick to the facts."

Here's an example. Last week I almost got wiped out by left turner at a light. If worse came to worse, I would hope that someone could learn a valuable lesson from my misfortune and that it would count for something.

Referring to the diagram below, I was southbound like the white car, beisde and behind the truck. The yellow car turned left as we approached the intersection with the light still green. The truck slammed on his brakes, and only then did I see the car appear in front of me as I hit my brakes. Luckily, of all the stupid things the car did, at least it kept accelerating instead of slowing down or stopping like a deer caught in our headlights when it realized I was also there beside the truck.

View attachment 69749

Even though I had the right of way, as a defensive rider I consider that I made the mistake of approaching an intersection in the "shadow" of another vehicle blocking my view of the oncoming left turn lane. I also didn't bother to look far enough ahead prior to approaching the intersection. My only excuse was that I was on way my home late at night after a long day of riding and I was tired. But that's just another mistake.

You wouldn't organize a case study at their funeral.

No need to do it in the forum that offers condolences to families, and our final waves goodbye to a fallen rider.

 

[Relax]

You wouldn't organize a case study at their funeral.

No need to do it in the forum that offers condolences to families, and our final waves goodbye to a fallen rider.

I think you're beating a dead horse. We've moved on from changing the rules in that forum. The question is whether we can discuss the same topic in the General (or other) forum.

 

[Mad Mike]

OK, if the bottom line is that people can't control themselves and act respectfully, then there's no way forward regardless of how reasonable the ask is. And that's a shame regardless of the topic.

I don't think that's the point. Healthy discord is good -- it's both entertaining and stimulates engagement.

Thing is, Fallen Riders it's not the right place. If you see an interesting case that warrants commentary or debate, put it in the general discussion with a link to the news. Fire the first volley and people will be happy to join in.

I see absolutely zero benefit in tying that discussion to the name and face of a fallen rider.

 

[Wingboy]

I think you're beating a dead horse. We've moved on from changing the rules in that forum. The question is whether we can discuss the same topic in the General (or other) forum.

It would be fine in tt providing there are no names. Any fallen rider topic posted in general will be dealt with.

 

[Relax]

Thing is, Fallen Riders it's not the right place. If you see an interesting case that warrants commentary or debate, put it in the general discussion with a link to the news. Fire the first volley and people will be happy to join in.

That is what I was originally asking. It just seemed redundant to be posting the same news articles in 2 forums, so I wanted to make sure we can coment if posted in General. As of now, @Wingboy is saying it would be kosher in Trash Talk as long as no names are mentioned, which the articles never do.

I see absolutely zero benefit in tying that discussion to the name and face of a fallen rider.

Neither do I and I have no desire to identify these riders. The police leave their names anonymous for a reason.

 

[Wingboy]

I really liked the lightcycle's idea of posting a hypothetical. Even better if it's in tt. Of course only for site supporters.

 

[nobbie48]

In thinking about three or four crashes I've seen I understand what happened. If I had come along a minute after the crash I would have a problem understanding how the vehicles got in that position and who did what.

Speculation leads to more speculation. The only comments that would, to a degree, satisfy me would be the final police report.

I could elaborate on the crashes I witnessed but don't want to type that much, only to be hypothesized by the peanut gallery.

 

[GreyGhost]

In thinking about three or four crashes I've seen I understand what happened. If I had come along a minute after the crash I would have a problem understanding how the vehicles got in that position and who did what.

Speculation leads to more speculation. The only comments that would, to a degree, satisfy me would be the final police report.

I could elaborate on the crashes I witnessed but don't want to type that much, only to be hypothesized by the peanut gallery.

While many people get very angry about crash analysis via pictures, for some crashes, there is only one possible option as to what happened. We obey the laws of physics in this country and conservation of momentum let's us gain a lot of information from final resting positions. Actual speeds are hard to determine but it's east to tell if someone ran a stop sign for instance.

 

[nobbie48]

While many people get very angry about crash analysis via pictures, for some crashes, there is only one possible option as to what happened. We obey the laws of physics in this country and conservation of momentum let's us gain a lot of information from final resting positions. Actual speeds are hard to determine but it's east to tell if someone ran a stop sign for instance.

Without witnesses, who ran the red?

Explain how a westbound car travelling in the curb lane of a six lane roadway side swiped an eastbound car travelling in the eastbound curb lane. OK It was Steeles and Goreway.

Brampton, all the explanation needed.

Skid marks and destinations add to the knowledge. If you live in Bolton and work in TO you would probably be southbound in the morning etc.

The sad bottom line is insurance pays for the property damage and the offender gets a $600 fine for killing someone. It's hardly worth the bother. (Cynical font)

 

[GreyGhost]

Without witnesses, who ran the red?

Explain how a westbound car travelling in the curb lane of a six lane roadway side swiped an eastbound car travelling in the eastbound curb lane. OK It was Steeles and Goreway.

Brampton, all the explanation needed.

Skid marks and destinations add to the knowledge. If you live in Bolton and work in TO you would probably be southbound in the morning etc.

The sad bottom line is insurance pays for the property damage and the offender gets a $600 fine for killing someone. It's hardly worth the bother. (Cynical font)

From the pictures, it wasn't hard to figure out what happened in a recent crash in Barrie where a truck ended up in a garage. While you could tell the direction of travel and a guess at speed from the pics, you had no idea who ran the red and there was no way to know without further information. It turns out it was the truck. Driver got a careless charge but that's it. I was surprised at only one charge. Was it a cop or associate driving the truck? At least two charges seem justified as a minimum.

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