Noob Riding errors..plz help

[Xuryfluous]

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There is a question that I must ask though...

apply more pressure to lean the bike further...

Once initial counter steering input is done and the bike starts to lean, if the turn tightens up...what does "apply more pressure on the handle bar mean"...

If there's any one who's good at physics here ( vector diagrams..)

what is the direction of this "pressure" that i should apply to lean it harder?

downwards pressure on the left handlebar ( if I'm going left) or

"leftwards pressure " on the left handle bar ( again if going left)?

if you're entering a left hand curve, you'll push the left bar, if the turn tightens up you'll push the left bar more. Just remember to keep smooth on the throttle, if you chop it closed you're gonna unload your suspension and the bike will become unstable. That's where looking through the turn comes in, before you even entered the turn you should have been able to see that the turn tightens up before exit, so you should know that you're not gonna want to be opening up the throttle too much until you exit the last part of the turn

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[Tango5]

I don't know guys, some of you are being a little hard on the OP, his biggest sin is he is being pretty honest about his experience. Didn't all of you have a moment like this when you started riding? Whether you went down or not, I know I did.

My opinion is this, sid_, give yourself time to get proficient. Yeah you know the theory, but what you discovered is that it takes time to instinctively apply the correct input while riding, especially under stress (like when going wide in a turn). Eventually the correct bike input will be automatic, an extension of your thinking, just like when walking or running. This takes time, for everyone. It's not that you weren't taught the skills on your course, perhaps it's that you haven't internalized them, and made them automatic? On your course you learned to operate a motorcycle, now you need to learn to ride. Ever take music lessons? Did you go home and play some difficult piece proficiently right after your first week of lessons?

Motorcycling is one of those activities that is easy to learn, and difficult to master. IMO It’s probably what gets so many into trouble; the skills required to get into trouble are easy to acquire, whereas the skills to stay out of trouble, not as easy. So don’t beat yourself up, but do learn everything about riding, and be sure to practice. No one has mentioned it, and maybe it’s considered passé these days, but I received a copy of “Proficient Motorcycling” by David L. Hough years ago (from my wife) and thought it really made me think about real world riding and the skill set and physics of riding a motorcycle. Perhaps you’ll find it a useful resource among the others that have been mentioned. Good luck.

 

[ZX600]

I wish my dad was alive so after reading this thread i would thank him for getting me on a bike at 11. I never asked anyone for "vectors" and diagrams, I got on the damn thing and rode it, slowly at first, then a little faster, then I got confident and then scared again and slow the **** down again, then slowly gained the skills to take one step further and so on.

You are over thinking it, the more you ride the more experience you get the better rider you become. I offer to help you and didn't get a response so I guess you are more interested on turning vectors than real life help.

No offense but I can predict that you are really good at school but suck at most practical things in life.

Be safe, that is all I have to say.

 

[sid_for_speed]

Slow the **** down, if you are running wide means that you are aggravating your bad technique with going faster than what you can and listen to what Bryan said

If you wanna come up to Brooklin on Sunday I can take you out riding for a bit and we can work on it.

Thankyou for your invite...however I'm still at the stage of just going round my block and am Just starting to go on roads I travel a lot...I will definitely take your offer once I master traveling a little faster and further

Watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=EFm3honeTQo#t=161s

This video helped thanks!

I wish my dad was alive so after reading this thread i would thank him for getting me on a bike at 11. I never asked anyone for "vectors" and diagrams, I got on the damn thing and rode it, slowly at first, then a little faster, then I got confident and then scared again and slow the **** down again, then slowly gained the skills to take one step further and so on.

You are over thinking it, the more you ride the more experience you get the better rider you become. I offer to help you and didn't get a response so I guess you are more interested on turning vectors than real life help.

No offense but I can predict that you are really good at school but suck at most practical things in life.

Be safe, that is all I have to say.

Like you said it...practice makes perfect...

 

[Low rider]

Why OH why do people actually think that the instructors decide to pass or fail students.
If the rider can ride the course set out, without exceeding 11 demerits, they must be given a pass.
It is, and should never be, up to the instructor or the examiner to decide who does and does not pass.
I have seen countless students pass where we know full well, they will get hurt out in the real world.
All we can do is have a talk with the student and give them fair warning. It is up the the student to decide what to do with that information.

After that, it is out of our hands.

I did the course just to get my M2 faster... The majority of the class should not have passed. It was a disgrace, and I don't know how these instructors can say they are safe for the road.

 

[Ricky6R]

Twist 2 pdf read the book and watch it on youtube for the visuals.

http://files.meetup.com/1510087/A%20Twist%20of%20the%20Wrist%20II.pdf

 

[Mongrel]

+1 agree the OP was probably not looking far enough ahead.

OP, another thing you'll notice if you keep looking properly ahead is that things slow down. The fact that 50kms seems waaaay faster than 30kms to you really does seem to say you were looking down too much. If you're not looking far enough ahead, everything looks like it's going super fast, but once you figure out how to better look ahead, things will open up and you'll have much more time to react.

And forget the vectors and diagrams and all that. It's good to to know theory, but you're trying to train the muscles in your body to know what things feel like properly. If you're thinking too much and trying to over-analyze everything, that will also make everything feel way faster and more complicated than it really is. For example, when you walk, you don't actually think "Lift foot off ground, angle leg forward, lift further, straighten leg while moving foot forward, plant heel, complete step" for every single step. You don't even think that once in a while. Too much talk about precise technique and angles and the rest will cloud your mind. Try to clear your mind instead and concentrate on feeling the ride without forming too many specific thoughts.

Like there's an hour and a half's worth of information in that movie alone, never mind all other stuff you've had and read. ANYBODY trying to think of hours and hours of reference material in the space of one regular road turn is going to have little to no thinking space left to feel the turn itself.

 

[Just Phil]

There's an old saying, "First you get good, THEN you get fast"

Slow down. Keep your eyes up! Practice, practice, practice.

Oh, yeah, enjoy it - there's already too many boring things in life...

 

[Matthew.Tremayne]

You go where your eyes take you. PM me, I can help you.

 

[ike]

Hi Sid!

Great thread you started! You have been given some great advice, and I am sure that you (and a lot of other new riders) will benefit from it. I'd like to add a couple of things that I have learned during my 37 years of street riding. I have never been on the track, but have spent lots of time on twisties and hairpin turns in the mountains.

When it comes to turning in general - 99.9 percent of the time in normal street riding, there is no need to ever shift your position on the seat. I have seen a number of people who shift their butt and hang it off the seat on every sweeper and corner (I guess in an attempt to emulate the knee-down behaviour they see in videos.) It is totally unnecessary and will tire you out in no time. So, use countersteering to tip your bike into the corner and keep your eyes up and looking to where you want to end up.

A note on countersteering... When I started using this technique, it seemed really counter-intuitive, so I practiced it a lot - first for collision and obstacle avoidance - and now I use it continuously. I really started paying attention to how my body naturally positioned itself on the bike when in a corner (mostly, I did this so I could instruct passengers how to lean their bodies when going through a corner - there is nothing worse than a passenger fighting to keep the bike upright while you are trying to lean it into a corner.) What I noticed is that when the bike starts to lean over, it seems that your body is more than willing to follow the lean as long as your head stays vertical (and as long as your fear doesnt make you tense up and make you want to straighten up.) So, my advice would be this... find a less travelled road out in the country with some gentle sweeping corners and practice looking up and far down the road and also practice the countersteering technique to tip your bike into the corners. Try to not let fear rule... take the tension out of your body and take note of what your relaxed body naturally does as the bike starts to tip over into a turn. Keep your butt planted on the seat - in normal street riding, there is no need to hang off the bike and get a knee out while turning - that is a skill that you will learn if you get to the track and start pushing your bike to its limits.

I'm out in Oshawa...if you want, I'd be happy to go for a ride with ya (I'm a noobie-friendly rider.) There are some great roads around here that will allow you to practice. Send me a PM if you're interested.

 

[sid_for_speed]

There's an old saying, "First you get good, THEN you get fast"

Slow down. Keep your eyes up! Practice, practice, practice.

Oh, yeah, enjoy it - there's already too many boring things in life...

Thanks for the tip, Since I've posted this thread, I've clocked in roughly 800 kms. Every single one of them was a learning experience. Mind you, I've had great assistance from extremely talented riders who don't mind riding with newbies...

"Looking ahead" ,I think, is the most important tip I've received from all you guys and it is a very
good one at that. I've chopped the throttle, run wide , panic braked in turns,fishtailed the rear all due to looking at "6 feet" ahead of the bike. This I try and improve on every time I ride and I know I will get better at it as the kms fly by...

Twist 2 pdf read the book and watch it on youtube for the visuals.

http://files.meetup.com/1510087/A%20Twist%20of%20the%20Wrist%20II.pdf

Thank you for this!!! Time for some "book learnin' "

 

[Mongrel]

This is going to sound like the stupidest thing ever, but every time I catch myself looking too far down, I remember back when I was a kid, when the Friendly Giant would come on and I would hear "Look up. Waaayyyy up."

 

[chistet]

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[Just Phil]

I was talking to a couple of riding buddies about this yesterday evening. It was funny that we all said the same thing- in slow city traffic, we all spent valuable time staring at the back window in front of us trying to figure out what the stupid stick figure family was doing!!

Practice. There will come a day when all of the "mechanics & physics" that your sweating about right now, won't be something you consciencely think about. You just do it.

Eyes up. Eyes open.

cheers
Phil

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