More automatic transmissions

Forum Sponsor
Having actually been riding an automatic for 100,000+ km I have a bit to contribute.
I got into to it to deal with the carpal tunnel in my left hand which made clutching very painful/tiring.... first a Honda 550 Silverwing and then two Burgman 650s. Hand got fixed but I still appreciated the ability to concentrate on the riding in the twists as opposed to shifting.
I also really liked double hand brakes over foot and hand combo. There is very little feel to the rear brake riding with boots especially compared to the feel you get with both hands braking.
Looking forward to an electric down the road IF I can afford it.
I think only Suzuki, BMW and Aprilla got the automatic working well with the eCVT. Like riding a turbine with always present power.
After a couple tries on the Honda DCT did not like the way it tended to be erratic in downshifting....sometimes aggressive, other times wait and wait. That might have improved over time.
The Honda Silverwing maxi-scoot was not DCT.
I would have liked the chance to ride the big Aprilla scootAutomatic Transmission ...

Aprilia's New Mana 850 Comes With A Seven-Speed Automatic Transmission

NEW YORK, NY Destined to change the riding habits of motorcyclists all over the world, Aprilia’s new NA 850 Mana is a versatile bike incorporating the technology of tomorrow into […]
www.roadracingworld.com www.roadracingworld.com
Serious power, bigger wheels and a more sophisticated eCVT.

Marc makes me jealous riding his big Zero from Berlin to New Zealand. It's a gorgeous machine and his enjoyment of it is always there.
But $42k Australian...:eek: ouch.
The almost silent running, superb power and belt drive all appealing. 300 km range also good especially for where he is riding.
 
guzzirider said:
It called mid life crisis
I knew I was having mine after owning motorcycles and sports cars when at a car show I walked past the raffle tickets for the Vet & Jag E-Type and bought tickets on a draw for a 32 ft motor home.
Click to expand...

In that case, I've been having a mid-life crisis since I was seventeen.

You've left out boats and large american gas-guzzlers. Nothing like an Oldsmobile LSS to cruise through the neighbourhood and blow the doors off of the wankers. Throw in the two Grand Nationals and one T-Type I purchased new in '87, or the Gamma 500, RZ 500, numerous RZ350s, an NSR400r and we have a crises going back more than forty years!

'Course, I knew all of this before I posted. Hence the link to the Jerry Lee Lewis tune.
 
gpfan said:
In that case, I've been having a mid-life crisis since I was seventeen.

You've left out boats and large american gas-guzzlers. Nothing like an Oldsmobile LSS to cruise through the neighbourhood and blow the doors off of the wankers. Throw in the two Grand Nationals and one T-Type I purchased new in '87, or the Gamma 500, RZ 500, numerous RZ350s, an NSR400r and we have a crises going back more than forty years!

'Course, I knew all of this before I posted. Hence the link to the Jerry Lee Lewis tune.
Click to expand...
I preferred the 67 Chrysler NewYorker with the 440.
The Chrysler Imperial was my dream car!
My Volvo P1800 ES was not exactly slow even with only 2.4 litre engine.
I traded in my Moto Guzzi 850T5 on a Laverda RGS1000 after getting blown away by a chevy.
I thought that was fast until after finally catching up to a car doing 200kph outside of Revelstoke BC
He downshifted and left me in the dust shortly after I read Porche 911.
I now think I am older and wiser and tomorrow I am going to look at a Suzuki TU250!
 
All this complaining, but can anyone articulate what exactly would be missing? And by the way, it's not an "Automatic transmission", it's an electronically controlled clutch with either manual or automatic shifting - your choice. We had this argument before about car transmissions, where people wanted to be able to shift and skip a gear, but you can't do that on a sequential transmission anyways. All you owners of newer bikes that include bi-directional quick-shifter - do you disable it so you can manually rev-match your downshifts or use the clutch or back-off the throttle on upshifts?

Personally, if I ever decided to buy a new bike, this would allow me to also use it comfortably for commuting in downtown stop-and-go traffic where you can barely ever fully release the clutch lever unless you shift into neutral on a traditional manual.
 
All these features you listed makes the motorcycle more expensive!
Why should I have to pay extra for something I dont need or want?
 
As a person who has never experienced anything more modern on a bike than abs or cruise control, and as someone who loves the manual aspects of riding, I think these tech developments are amazing new choices to bikes.

Many generations have likely felt that they lived in great age of motorcycles while sentimentalists opposed to change yelled at blue skies and lamented what’s coming. This is no different and will continue for decades to come.

Which makes me wonder what bikes will be like in 40 years.
 
shanekingsley said:
As a person who has never experienced anything more modern on a bike than abs or cruise control, and as someone who loves the manual aspects of riding, I think these tech developments are amazing new choices to bikes.

Many generations have likely felt that they lived in great age of motorcycles while sentimentalists opposed to change yelled at blue skies and lamented what’s coming. This is no different and will continue for decades to come.

Which makes me wonder what bikes will be like in 40 years.
Click to expand...
If we look at as realists, in 40 years there will not be bikes as we know it. That level of automotive freedom will be gone.
 
And by the way, it's not an "Automatic transmission", it's an electronically controlled clutch with either manual or automatic shifting - your choice
Click to expand...
That's only the DCT automatics. eCVTs do not have any sort of a "clutch".
40 years out is hardly worth speculating about.
The transition to EV motorcycles will be/is interesting now and is well behind cars.
 
gpfan said:
And as a fat, grey, arthritic 60 year old, what could be better than tooling about in a wee red convertible two-seat Japanese machine?

Click to expand...
Walking. Won’t catch this near 60, arthritic fat guy in a Miata… ever. I don’t mind a vintage Datsun or Brit 2 seater, but a Miata is a hard no for me.

A better look would be a red convertible Camaro.
shanekingsley said:
As a person who has never experienced anything more modern on a bike than abs or cruise control, and as someone who loves the manual aspects of riding, I think these tech developments are amazing new choices to bikes.

Many generations have likely felt that they lived in great age of motorcycles while sentimentalists opposed to change yelled at blue skies and lamented what’s coming. This is no different and will continue for decades to come.

Which makes me wonder what bikes will be like in 40 years.
Click to expand...
innovation doesn’t bother me.

If you want to enjoy the rough and tumble of bikes from the past… just but one. A 60 year old Triumph or Honda can be had for less than the price of a new Grom, just buy one.
 
MacDoc said:
That's only the DCT automatics. eCVTs do not have any sort of a "clutch".
40 years out is hardly worth speculating about.
The transition to EV motorcycles will be/is interesting now and is well behind cars.
Click to expand...

A CVT is technically superior to a multi-gear transmission - it has unlimited gear ratios. The problem with automotive CVT's is that they're programmed for fuel economy, not performance. I can't imagine they'd do the same on a performance bike.
 
The Burgman 650 has a Power button that shifts the range of the gears and allows higher rpms.....quite fun...likw having the choice of front sprockets at the touch of a button. Improved the engine braking as well.
The Aprilla refined the eCVT to handle more power.

BMW did not need the Power button to be quick. I discussed the C650 with the lead rider riding a 1300 BMW which the 650 had no issue keeping up with up to 100 kph. They designed a sweet spot for riding. The downside of the C650 was ergonomics that only fit a narrow range of riders. It sort of fit me and it was fun riding around the Mosport course ( I was the only rider that was familiar with an automatic :D ) BMW chose 15" wheels ...smart move....the Burgman ate tires.
The Burgman allowed a larger range of riders - sacrificing wheel size ( 13" and 14" ) for storage space which was excellent. The C60 had the same trade off- limited storage for larger wheels and limited ergos.

The Aprilla of course looked and had the ergos of a standard full sized motorcycle ....sacrificing storage.
Top speed on the bikes is certainly limited by the CVTs vs standard transmissions tho the Aprilla with 118 mph top speed overcame that limitation on the Burgman.
The 109 mph top speed on the BMW was certainly adequate
There were only a few times when I would have liked a bit more top end on the Burgman Exec.

Honda's DCT basically is an internal shifter that handles the clutch and RPM matching. Smart approach allowing more models to offer automatic within existing Honda models but I never thought it compared to the Suzuki Burgman 650 in smooth predictable performance.

An automatic is sooooo much better in traffic.
 
Relax said:
Bikes get more expensive every year, sometimes even when nothing is changed. If they're going to raise prices, may as well throw in some new features.
Click to expand...
It think technical advancements in MC's and cars is both inevitable and good. "Better" should always be the goal, moderated by cost.

In my mind, "Better" means increased fuel economy or battery range, improved reliability resulting in reduced maintenance and ideally simplified maintenance.

Personally, I have reached a stage where both my MC and my truck have enough tech and am satisfied, and while all the variations of traction control, rider aids, safety aids, etc. on new bikes are features to some, they add no extra value for me and I'm not really willing to pay for them.

However, if Honda sees fit to bring the NT1100 to Canada then I'd be happy to get over myself. Might even consider a DCT version.
 
xrljoel said:
However, if Honda sees fit to bring the NT1100 to Canada then I'd be happy to get over myself. Might even consider a DCT version.
Click to expand...
same
 
Relax said:
I can't imagine they'd do the same on a performance bike.
Click to expand...
There was a guy in Quebec that built a GP bike with a Rotax snowmobile motor, with a CVT.
Then there was a guy that built a sidecar rig with a Yamaha 1000cc with a CVT.
Both bikes SMOKED the field and were banned post haste. The side car would come out of the hairpin at Shannonville and light up the rear wheel all the way down the front stretch... it was fun to watch.

Every CVT I have ever seen with any real power behind it ate itself. Nissan CVT's have a bad habit of sawing the case in half when the chain goes.
 
Mad Mike said:
If you want to enjoy the rough and tumble of bikes from the past… just but one. A 60 year old Triumph or Honda can be had for less than the price of a new Grom, just buy one.
Click to expand...
This is something I could never wrap my noggin around....
If you think you want to be seen as a "rough and tumble" rider of a "vintage" bike, RIDE A VINTAGE BIKE.
Bike technology marches on... what is the point of a brand new 60 year old design? I don't get it.
I've heard that old bikes are hard to maintain and you can't get parts... NOPE. It is easier to get parts for a '60s or '70s Brit bike than a NEW Enfield... and with the number of dealerships left, we might be able to say the same thing for the BIG manufacturers.
To ME, when I see someone on a "nostalgia" bike (An Enfield, W800 and the like) what I see is someone that WANTS to seen as the "rough and tumble" type that rides a vintage, but isn't willing to put in the effort... which is my lexicon would be a poser. (and ... sorry... the VAST majority of super sport riders fall into the same category, for the same reasons)

Miata's don't fall into that category. A Miati is a modern interpretation of the MGB, and it is actually better.
The Norton 961 is a modern interpretation of a Commando... but isn't that much better and fails in the "interpretation" as there is way too much "modern" to it. They didn't try to recreate the Commando, they built a modern bike and CALLED it a Commando... same as the BSA 650.
The "ride" of my '89 Honda RC31 more resembles the "ride" of a Triumph Bonneville, than a 2018 Triumph.
To all you young folks that are afraid of a "vintage", anything past 1970 can be a reliable daily rider. We had it figured out by then... we had flush toilets and running water inside the house by then.
 
bitzz said:
This is something I could never wrap my noggin around....
If you think you want to be seen as a "rough and tumble" rider of a "vintage" bike, RIDE A VINTAGE BIKE.
Bike technology marches on... what is the point of a brand new 60 year old design? I don't get it.
I've heard that old bikes are hard to maintain and you can't get parts... NOPE. It is easier to get parts for a '60s or '70s Brit bike than a NEW Enfield... and with the number of dealerships left, we might be able to say the same thing for the BIG manufacturers.
To ME, when I see someone on a "nostalgia" bike (An Enfield, W800 and the like) what I see is someone that WANTS to seen as the "rough and tumble" type that rides a vintage, but isn't willing to put in the effort... which is my lexicon would be a poser. (and ... sorry... the VAST majority of super sport riders fall into the same category, for the same reasons)

Miata's don't fall into that category. A Miati is a modern interpretation of the MGB, and it is actually better.
The Norton 961 is a modern interpretation of a Commando... but isn't that much better and fails in the "interpretation" as there is way too much "modern" to it. They didn't try to recreate the Commando, they built a modern bike and CALLED it a Commando... same as the BSA 650.
The "ride" of my '89 Honda RC31 more resembles the "ride" of a Triumph Bonneville, than a 2018 Triumph.
To all you young folks that are afraid of a "vintage", anything past 1970 can be a reliable daily rider. We had it figured out by then... we had flush toilets and running water inside the house by then.
Click to expand...
On Miata’s - great design and build quality , but so are my wife’s Sam Edelman pumps. You won’t see me in either. (I believe the AlphaSpyder was the design inspiration, MG the market position).

I have some odd old bikes, nothing valuable or collectable, just interesting to me. I don’t vintage race, I like my oldies for what they are. Easy to maintain, cheap parts that are easy to find, and unless your on a track, handling on the street poses little risk. Special skills- using a choke, keeping cables adjusted, using a kickstart (sometimes a decomp), and for older Brit bikes shifting with your right foot and riding in the dark without lights.
Forum Sponsor
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom