Here's one reason why people hate motorcyclists

In rome they do this all day every day. No one gets ****** off, no road rage...it's accepted by cagers. It was actually great to watch. Traffic moved well with no issues
It's different when it's an accepted part of travel and being used by people to get somewhere efficiently. This particular group of morons is riding both well outside of social norms for Ontario and well outside the law. Autobahn also works well in Germany but try to pin the needle here and there are pitchforks and court dates. Same issue.
 
In rome they do this all day every day. No one gets ****** off, no road rage...it's accepted by cagers. It was actually great to watch. Traffic moved well with no issues
In Rome they filter. Just like most of the rest of world. But this isn't filtering, it's using your force of numbers to take over an oncoming lane, not dissimilar to the huge rides of cruisers taking over passing lanes on the highway and not letting anyone else through. While I think filtering should 100% be legal here, this is a whole different thing.

Also, road rage in Rome is just as bad. I've seen multiple shouting matches and one fist fight there in our many trips to the city, all related to driving and parking. Some of that is the Roman temperament (shouting matches are pretty common in general), some of it is the ancient city layout, some of it is everyone bending the rules to suit as needed. Traffic is also chaos, and rarely moves well in the centro storico.

All that said, I'd ride or drive there all day every day over here. At least they have an excuse with narrow streets and roads built for walking and horse and buggy. Here, it's just pure volume and a**holery. And the traffic is somehow far worse here.
 
You could always say "in x country they do this so it's fine"

There's always something seen as stupid by some and genius by others in some other part of the world
 
You could always say "in x country they do this so it's fine"

There's always something seen as stupid by some and genius by others in some other part of the world
Filtering in a swarm of small bikes and tuktuks is a much different experience than weaving through bro-dozers, people on their handheld devices, drivers protected by cocoon of airbags, etc.
 
In rome they do this all day every day. No one gets ****** off, no road rage...it's accepted by cagers. It was actually great to watch. Traffic moved well with no issues
They drive with no plates on the wrong side of the road in Rome? Not that I've seen.
 
Filtering in a swarm of small bikes and tuktuks is a much different experience than weaving through bro-dozers, people on their handheld devices, drivers protected by cocoon of airbags, etc.
Yup, that dotted line calls my name every commute, but the 2-3 minutes i'd save isn't worth it.
 
Filtering in a swarm of small bikes and tuktuks is a much different experience than weaving through bro-dozers, people on their handheld devices, drivers protected by cocoon of airbags, etc.
The only meaningful difference is the expectations of the four-wheeled drivers, I think. There's no good reason we can't filter here. The primary reasons we don't are a) we've never done it so people wouldn't be used to it and it might therefore be dangerous, and b) non-bikes hate it, along the lines of, "If I can't do it, you shouldn't be allowed to do it, even if it makes zero difference to my time in traffic..."

For 'a', I'll take filtering over being exposed to being rear-ended 10 times out of 10, thanks. At least I'm in some form of control when filtering. For 'b', well, that's a problem amplified in the US and Canada and I think only addressable if you did a bit of PR explaining how allowing filtering would actually improve traffic, as it both clears the roads and encourages more people onto two wheels, which take up way less space and can navigate city travel much better. There are a few US states that have recently allowed some form of filtering or lane splitting. I think folks are fed up enough with Toronto traffic that they might even be willing to put aside their deep sense of entitlement to allow it to happen. Sadly, we have zero meaningful public advocacy in this country as motorcyclists, so I'm not holding my breath...
 
The only meaningful difference is the expectations of the four-wheeled drivers, I think. There's no good reason we can't filter here. The primary reasons we don't are a) we've never done it so people wouldn't be used to it and it might therefore be dangerous, and b) non-bikes hate it, along the lines of, "If I can't do it, you shouldn't be allowed to do it, even if it makes zero difference to my time in traffic..."

For 'a', I'll take filtering over being exposed to being rear-ended 10 times out of 10, thanks. At least I'm in some form of control when filtering. For 'b', well, that's a problem amplified in the US and Canada and I think only addressable if you did a bit of PR explaining how allowing filtering would actually improve traffic, as it both clears the roads and encourages more people onto two wheels, which take up way less space and can navigate city travel much better. There are a few US states that have recently allowed some form of filtering or lane splitting. I think folks are fed up enough with Toronto traffic that they might even be willing to put aside their deep sense of entitlement to allow it to happen. Sadly, we have zero meaningful public advocacy in this country as motorcyclists, so I'm not holding my breath...
My problem with it is that most people on motorcycles today aren't very quick on the takeoff.
That would mean that everyone stuck behind them has to wait even longer than usual.

The rear end excuse, doesn't really fly as most rear ends happen when you're at the front of the line, and the person behind expects that you've already moved without them having to look. A friend has been hit twice this way, waiting to make a right on a red, in Toronto. The other aspect, is that motorcycles are multiple times more likely to run into another vehicle than vice versa. Letting poorly coordinated bikers try and thread the needle, would result in many collisions, and unnecessary stoppage of traffic. Look at how often it happens with bicycles and they are traveling much slower than other traffic. If you're "all in" for taking up less space, then the bus is for you.

Don't the States that allow it have a "you break it, you buy it" policy regarding splitting/filtering? i.e. You're always at fault?
 
My problem with it is that most people on motorcycles today aren't very quick on the takeoff.
That would mean that everyone stuck behind them has to wait even longer than usual.

The rear end excuse, doesn't really fly as most rear ends happen when you're at the front of the line, and the person behind expects that you've already moved without them having to look. A friend has been hit twice this way, waiting to make a right on a red, in Toronto. The other aspect, is that motorcycles are multiple times more likely to run into another vehicle than vice versa. Letting poorly coordinated bikers try and thread the needle, would result in many collisions, and unnecessary stoppage of traffic. Look at how often it happens with bicycles and they are traveling much slower than other traffic. If you're "all in" for taking up less space, then the bus is for you.

Don't the States that allow it have a "you break it, you buy it" policy regarding splitting/filtering? i.e. You're always at fault?
Almost nothing you say here lines up with my own experience. Pretty much every motorcycle or scooter I see takes off from lights far faster than almost every car, especially as the odds of being distracted by a phone are a lot lower. On top of that, if you're filtering as they do in most of the world, you won't actually be directly in front of a car when the light turns green because you'll still be on the dashed line at the light. It's only after taking off (much faster than the cars) that you settle into a lane.

As for being rear-ended, the risk I'm thinking of mostly comes from distracted drivers that 'look through' a motorcycle, not registering the bike and only seeing the car ahead. Data shows this does happen, as the human brain is wired to recognize shapes we're already looking for and can be blind to things we're not (recall that viral video of people playing basketball with the guy in the gorilla suit that walks through and usually gets missed). By taking yourself out of the path of cars, you eliminate that risk.

On bikes being ridden by poorly coordinated riders riding into cars, I can't speak to that. I've never seen it personally, but I guess it exists? I haven't seen it happen with bicycles, either. I have seen bicycles get hit by cars, but that's usually a SMIDSY scenario as described above. I guess the risk is higher with big bikes like baggers that have less room to spare, but I would think they would be more selective about filtering.

Ultimately, pretty much the whole world except parts of the US and Canada allow it with lots of benefits and very few drawbacks. Interestingly, Western Australia began allowing it in 2021, and their two-year review showed mo meaningful change in crash statistics, either protecting riders from being rear-ended or from new side-swipes. Granted, Western Aus is a pretty small sample size (mostly Perth, I'd imagine), but I suspect we'd see similar results here:

https://www.wa.gov.au/system/files/2024-01/motorcycle-lane-filtering-report-summary.pdf

If the worst case is nothing changes except motorcycles and scooters get where they're going quicker, then really the only reason not to allow it is reason 'b' in my post above. But reason 'b' is pretty powerful, especially in me-first Canada, so I suspect not much will change to allow it.
 
I don't get it... unless you're commuting, which these guys clearly are not, what is the attraction to riding in a city

These aren't riders, they're 250km a year no plate riding dirty go fast in a straight line but can't make it around a corner at more than 50 and then duckwalk through the Tim Hortons parking lot wannabees.
 
It's different when it's an accepted part of travel and being used by people to get somewhere efficiently. This particular group of morons is riding both well outside of social norms for Ontario and well outside the law. Autobahn also works well in Germany but try to pin the needle here and there are pitchforks and court dates. Same issue.
I agree..but I just wanted to point out how it's done in other places in the world
 
I’m trying to figure out what those stacks are in the shot?
That is the beautiful skyline of Hamilton, specifically Dofasco (Arcelor-Mittal now, really), taken from Eastport. It's a view I know well, I see it minimum three times a week.

Hopefully that edgelord is carrying on to Niagara...
 
Back
Top Bottom