H-D has a new boss | Page 2 | GTAMotorcycle.com

H-D has a new boss

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It’s an interesting choice. Puma is a marketing company, not a category innovator. He should do well with HD.

They need someone to keep the marketing machine going and he will probably do it. The HD crowd have been drinking the Koolaid for years, give them a T-shirt buying experience that makes them feel like a badass and they will pay $50 for that shirt.

it’s not about bikes anymore, it’s about white collar dudes feeling like a badass on the weekends.
 
Perhaps, they should just focus making bikes for people who like them. And quit trying to pander to people who will never walk into a dealership regardless of what is on offer? I mean they've built a bike now to answer every excuse, yet people STILL regurgitate those same excuses. Price? Ok, the street 750 is cheaper than a shadow. The street 500 is cheaper than a rebel 500. I've seen "tech" in this thread. Do any of your bikes have prox keys or touch screen displays? Anybody rockin a full electric bike? Harley has an ADV on deck, any of you going to even hit up a test ride event to try it out? Highly doubtful. Sport bike on deck too iirc, I don't think any GTAM'ers will be visiting the sales floor for that either. Reliability? It's always funny to hear guys that like Ducatis talking about HD reliability. They're wasting alot of R&D money adding things that their buyers don't want or need. And it pushes their pricing out of actual potential buyers' range.

The point is, They're trying to get you, and they never will. And at the same time distancing themselves from people they already had in the bag.

Now if they built a simple, no frills, just what you need to go down the road kind of bike, with the 114 and their classic styling, it will sell to anyone without an irrational hatred for the brand. And then have the big cadillac bike for the guys that can afford it. I'd like to see a dumbed down version of the big comfort bike too.
 
JTR said:
Perhaps, they should just focus making bikes for people who like them. And quit trying to pander to people who will never walk into a dealership regardless of what is on offer? I mean they've built a bike now to answer every excuse, yet people STILL regurgitate those same excuses. Price? Ok, the street 750 is cheaper than a shadow. The street 500 is cheaper than a rebel 500. I've seen "tech" in this thread. Do any of your bikes have prox keys or touch screen displays? Anybody rockin a full electric bike? Harley has an ADV on deck, any of you going to even hit up a test ride event to try it out? Highly doubtful. Sport bike on deck too iirc, I don't think any GTAM'ers will be visiting the sales floor for that either. Reliability? It's always funny to hear guys that like Ducatis talking about HD reliability. They're wasting alot of R&D money adding things that their buyers don't want or need. And it pushes their pricing out of actual potential buyers' range.

The point is, They're trying to get you, and they never will. And at the same time distancing themselves from people they already had in the bag.

Now if they built a simple, no frills, just what you need to go down the road kind of bike, with the 114 and their classic styling, it will sell to anyone without an irrational hatred for the brand. And then have the big cadillac bike for the guys that can afford it. I'd like to see a dumbed down version of the big comfort bike too.
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With talk like that, they should have hired you.
 
bigpoppa said:
Its interesting that some companies can do both, have a cool historical brand and also create excellent motorcycles with wide ranging appeal (ducati, triumph) while others cannot(HD)
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All the answers are there for HD R&D, it’s called Indian, not my style of bike but if I wanted an excuse not to groom, a fat belly and a bad wardrobe then I would go for an Indian. For now my Ducati will suit me fine.
 
What harley really needs to do is make bikes like this again ?
A lot of guys(myself included) would sell kidneys for those

https://imgur.com/s7Bm5wm
 
JTR said:
Perhaps, they should just focus making bikes for people who like them. And quit trying to pander to people who will never walk into a dealership regardless of what is on offer?
Click to expand...

The problem is...that Boomer demographic is aging out of the motorcycle market and the Gen X age group that are aging into it are shopping a lot more frugally as the name cachet of a brand name doesn't mean as much to many of them anymore as it has in past generations.

Harley will still hold some cachet, but it won't be to the extent they've enjoyed in the last 20-30 years as the boomers drop out of riding. They will have to compete more on price to get GenX, but when a metric full dresser can be had for $20K and the cheapest full dresser alternative in the HD lineup is $12,000 more, that's going to become a harder and harder sell.
 
bigpoppa said:
What harley really needs to do is make bikes like this again ?
A lot of guys(myself included) would sell kidneys for those

https://imgur.com/s7Bm5wm
Click to expand...

So here's the new sport bike that will hit the streets next year. It seems to have everything. The so-called Harley Davidson Streetfighter. But like all Harleys, it's going to be expensive. Very expensive. If history means anything, 99% of sport bike guys (who are mostly under 30 and short on cash) will opt for cheap, then make excuses about it. This bike could be the best performer on the market and it will still fail because HD cannot produce bikes at a low price.

www.cycleworld.com

Harley-Davidson Announces New V-Twin Sportbike

Would you buy a Harley-Davidson sportbike? A 975cc V-twin streetfighter with an upright riding position and rearset footpegs is planned for 2020.
www.cycleworld.com www.cycleworld.com
 
Roadghost said:
So here's the new sport bike that will hit the streets next year. It seems to have everything. The so-called Harley Davidson Streetfighter. But like all Harleys, it's going to be expensive. Very expensive. If history means anything, 99% of sport bike guys (who are mostly under 30 and short on cash) will opt for cheap, then make excuses about it. This bike could be the best performer on the market and it will still fail because HD cannot produce bikes at a low price.

www.cycleworld.com

Harley-Davidson Announces New V-Twin Sportbike

Would you buy a Harley-Davidson sportbike? A 975cc V-twin streetfighter with an upright riding position and rearset footpegs is planned for 2020.
www.cycleworld.com www.cycleworld.com
Click to expand...
They’re already behind on that, with the Ducati streetfighter V4 out, why would anyone want this?
 
You can sell on price, or sell on performance(or both)

I've never wanted to buy something just on the name
 
JTR - you are correct - I did not know this existed and it is cost effective. $6999 2019 Street 500 Motorcycle Specs & Pricing | Harley-Davidson Canada
Harley-Davidson's Street 500 in Electric Blue


and a very good review from Australia by a non-Harley rider

Aside from a smallish tank which I think is par for the cruiser world it stacks up against the CB500 series ( actually the Hondas are a bit more ).
But no, you would not catch me in a Harley dealership as it would never occur to me they had a decent bike at $7k.

Screen Shot 2020-05-09 at May, 9 2020 11.06.54 AM.jpgI might ride that and under $10k for a 750 - 500 lb. The headache in my view is not the hardware but the association with loud pipes and 1%er look and behavior. ( real or imagined ).

So "not a real Harley" from the Harley lovers and "are you a wannabe " from the metric crowd.

As to the aging ridership ....many like me are downsizing to lighter bikes - perhaps this accounts for the number of big Harley's for sale along the roadside.

If the series above prove reliable ...there might be a space. The best thing Harley could do is offer extremely competitive finance and take trades of metrics. Would I ride that 750 for $99 a month. Mebbe.

Thanks for the nudge.
 
bigpoppa said:
You can sell on price, or sell on performance(or both)

I've never wanted to buy something just on the name
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Actually name is the biggest reason anyone buys anything Harley or Apple it is the prospect of belonging to the group that sells these products and Harley is losing that by not having a clear why statement anymore.

Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
 
PrivatePilot said:
The problem is...that Boomer demographic is aging out of the motorcycle market and the Gen X age group that are aging into it are shopping a lot more frugally as the name cachet of a brand name doesn't mean as much to many of them anymore as it has in past generations.

Harley will still hold some cachet, but it won't be to the extent they've enjoyed in the last 20-30 years as the boomers drop out of riding. They will have to compete more on price to get GenX, but when a metric full dresser can be had for $20K and the cheapest full dresser alternative in the HD lineup is $12,000 more, that's going to become a harder and harder sell.
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Which one will hold it's looks and value longer though? For some reason, as metric dressers age, they look hideous. It's for that reason that their values tank and a shrewd buyer could easily bring home a fully decked goldwing for a grand. I bet it would run like a champ too, and still be a comfortable ride. But it would be ugly as sin and sound like a sewing machine. The same era Ultra is going to sound good, have all the right curves, and value at 5-10X more.

Harley makes bikes that compete pricewise with metrics. Obviously, the myth of "build it cheaper and people will buy it" has been debunked.
 
Roadghost said:
So here's the new sport bike that will hit the streets next year. It seems to have everything. The so-called Harley Davidson Streetfighter. But like all Harleys, it's going to be expensive. Very expensive. If history means anything, 99% of sport bike guys (who are mostly under 30 and short on cash) will opt for cheap, then make excuses about it. This bike could be the best performer on the market and it will still fail because HD cannot produce bikes at a low price.

www.cycleworld.com

Harley-Davidson Announces New V-Twin Sportbike

Would you buy a Harley-Davidson sportbike? A 975cc V-twin streetfighter with an upright riding position and rearset footpegs is planned for 2020.
www.cycleworld.com www.cycleworld.com
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I'm getting at when I said HD needs to go back to their "roots".

HD's success as a brand is contributed in part by them being perceived as non-conformist. When they start catering to the latest mainstream whims with bikes like this Streetfighter and the Electric series, they've really lost the plot.

Broadly speaking, toy vehicles are an extension/presentation of one's personality. You pull up to a bike meet and see every Joe Schmo is on a Harley Davidson branded bike, you sort of ask yourself: where's the appeal of paying extra for something so pedestrian?

Harley, please... go back to being the rebel/1%er brand we all know and love. Leave the performance stats and efficient engineering to the Germans.

Count me in the camp that thinks they should focus on selling fewer bikes at higher prices to maintain exclusivity.

bigpoppa said:
You can sell on price, or sell on performance(or both)

I've never wanted to buy something just on the name
Click to expand...

You're part of a small fraction of buyers.

People buy based on perceived value. Brand value is what allows the likes of Apple to dominate the top end of the market with sub-standard products when compared to their peers.
 
Sales are down for Harley....just like they are for the motorcycle industry as a whole. I don't really understand the comparison to Triumph, Ducati and Indian like those brands are doing better? Harley sells 4 times the bikes Triumph or Ducati does. Indian won't publish sales figures, they hide it in with all Polaris vehicles, if Indian was outselling Harley you would see those numbers everywhere.
 
PrivatePilot said:
The problem is...that Boomer demographic is aging out of the motorcycle market and the Gen X age group that are aging into it are shopping a lot more frugally as the name cachet of a brand name doesn't mean as much to many of them anymore as it has in past generations.

Harley will still hold some cachet, but it won't be to the extent they've enjoyed in the last 20-30 years as the boomers drop out of riding. They will have to compete more on price to get GenX, but when a metric full dresser can be had for $20K and the cheapest full dresser alternative in the HD lineup is $12,000 more, that's going to become a harder and harder sell.
Click to expand...

That's great and it's good to have options, but what Metric bagger has ever outsold any of the Harley line? You can also get an Electra Glide Standard for $25,000 and throw a beer box on for $1000. Yes it's more expensive but half of your example.
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