Extortion by shop? Breach of privacy by cop? | GTAMotorcycle.com

Extortion by shop? Breach of privacy by cop?

FitzR6

FitzR6

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So here is the story...

1) My friend went to a shop to check out a bike in the west end of Toronto.
2)They gave him the keys and told him to take it for a spin, no plates, no insurance.
3) He started the bike and started to pull out. As he got onto the street the throttle got stuck open on him and he lost control.
4) He fell off and because he was wearing no gear, he got some pretty bad rash as well as the fairings on the bike being damaged.

...now here is the interesting part...

6) The guys at the shop admit the throttle was giving problems but that the bike was actually a customer's bike
7) They tell my friend he owes $4000 for the damages and try to hold him there until he gives them money
8) My friend gets scared and runs away

...the story gets better...

9) The guys at the shop calls their friend who is a cop at 23 division and give him my buddie's name and phone number, to which, the cops provided the guys at the shop with my friends address and full name
10) Cop calls my friend and leave VM stating he is investigating a hit and run (no my friend did not hit anyone or anything).
11) The guys are calling my friend telling him they will be at his house by tonight if he doesn't agree to pay up and read out his full name and address

...So there are a number of issues here:

A) Is my friend responsible for the damage to the bike?
B) Can he go after the guys at the shop since he is hurt ?
C) What can my friend do about the police officer giving out his personal information?
 
Oh boy, what a mess.

A vehicle operator is responsible within reason to ensure that the vehicle that they are operating on the road at any given time, is safe to operate and legal and insured. There is something called "due diligence" here. When you are driving a vehicle that belongs to someone else, you can only ascertain the validity of license and insurance etc up to a point ... but the lack of a license plate completely fails any hope of due diligence in that regard, and if he knew it wasn't insured (or at least, didn't check for the existence of a valid insurance slip) then he didn't do that due diligence, either. Oops.

But on the other hand, if the vehicle had a defect that the shop knew about but didn't disclose, that's an issue. They also shouldn't knowingly have let the vehicle out on the road without license and insurance. Proper dealers have dealer plates and insurance for whatever vehicle has the dealer plate on it at any given time. Why wasn't the dealer plate on the vehicle? But STILL, it's the vehicle operator's responsibility to make sure the vehicle has a plate on it.

Why the heck was the dealer letting a third party test-ride a customer's bike? If I were that customer, I'd be properly ticked off.

There is plenty of blame to go around here. I don't think it's reasonable for your friend to get out of this completely scot-free (he IS the one who crashed the bike ... and he should never have gone out on the road without a proper plate, if only a dealer plate, on the bike.) Nor is it reasonable for the shop get out completely scot-free, because they should never have let a customer's bike out on the road to be ridden by a third party with no plate or insurance and with a known mechanical defect ...

It may take lawyers to make it happen but I'd try to negotiate splitting the cost with the shop for the repairs to the customer's bike.

I absolutely would not talk to the police. Talk to the shop first and attempt to negotiate a settlement - which must include an agreement to dropall charges. If that doesn't work, talk to a lawyer and let the lawyer do the talking with all parties concerned. It will cost something, and the total cost of lawyer plus half the repair cost to the bike could very well end up being more than just taking the lumps and paying the repair bill ...

Take home lesson; if you are going to take a vehicle for a test drive, make sure it has a license plate on it, even if it's a dealer plate, and make sure it is insured, and check basic functionality (brakes etc) before going out on the road ... as a vehicle operator, it IS your responsibility ...
 
In regards to question C, you can:

With the officers name handy, call the division, request to speak to the Staff Sargeant and speak to him about the officer giving out the address to members of the public.
 
I think real lawyers not internet cowboys will be needed to sort this out.

I do have a question. By checking a bike out does that mean the shop had the bike for sale? Maybe a consignment deal? If so, it makes it a test drive. To me, no legal background, it would appear that the dealer then becomes responsible to make sure the vehicle is in good working order with plates and insurance. With no damage waiver I would hope that the dealer in question is completely responsible. But like I said your friend will need a real lawyer to sort this out one way or the other.

I think the least expensive thing to do would be what Brian said. Try and come up with a settlement with the shop. Even if you use a lawyer and have to pay no damages the lawyer fees could equal or be greater then the damage amount you negotiate.

FitzR6 said:
So here is the story...

1) My friend went to a shop to check out a bike in the west end of Toronto.
2)They gave him the keys and told him to take it for a spin, no plates, no insurance.
3) He started the bike and started to pull out. As he got onto the street the throttle got stuck open on him and he lost control.
4) He fell off and because he was wearing no gear, he got some pretty bad rash as well as the fairings on the bike being damaged.

...now here is the interesting part...

6) The guys at the shop admit the throttle was giving problems but that the bike was actually a customer's bike
7) They tell my friend he owes $4000 for the damages and try to hold him there until he gives them money
8) My friend gets scared and runs away

...the story gets better...

9) The guys at the shop calls their friend who is a cop at 23 division and give him my buddie's name and phone number, to which, the cops provided the guys at the shop with my friends address and full name
10) Cop calls my friend and leave VM stating he is investigating a hit and run (no my friend did not hit anyone or anything).
11) The guys are calling my friend telling him they will be at his house by tonight if he doesn't agree to pay up and read out his full name and address

...So there are a number of issues here:

A) Is my friend responsible for the damage to the bike?
B) Can he go after the guys at the shop since he is hurt ?
C) What can my friend do about the police officer giving out his personal information?
Click to expand...
 
Your friend knew that it was unplated and, presumably, that it was uninsured, so he failed in due diligence. The interesting part is that the shop gave him the keys to an unlicensed and uninsured bike, that they didn't own. That means that THEY are on the hook to the owner, for any damages, but could recoup from your friend. Now the extra special bonus round. The owner of the bike could potentially be held responsible for the injuries of your friend, having to recoup the costs from the shop.

I recommend that you also ask this question in the insurance forum, for that reason. Tort law gives me hives.

ddusseld has it right: lawyer up.
 
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FitzR6 said:
So here is the story...

1) My friend went to a shop to check out a bike in the west end of Toronto.
2)They gave him the keys and told him to take it for a spin, no plates, no insurance.
3) He started the bike and started to pull out. As he got onto the street the throttle got stuck open on him and he lost control.
4) He fell off and because he was wearing no gear, he got some pretty bad rash as well as the fairings on the bike being damaged.

...now here is the interesting part...

6) The guys at the shop admit the throttle was giving problems but that the bike was actually a customer's bike
7) They tell my friend he owes $4000 for the damages and try to hold him there until he gives them money
8) My friend gets scared and runs away

...the story gets better...

9) The guys at the shop calls their friend who is a cop at 23 division and give him my buddie's name and phone number, to which, the cops provided the guys at the shop with my friends address and full name
10) Cop calls my friend and leave VM stating he is investigating a hit and run (no my friend did not hit anyone or anything).
11) The guys are calling my friend telling him they will be at his house by tonight if he doesn't agree to pay up and read out his full name and address

...So there are a number of issues here:

A) Is my friend responsible for the damage to the bike?
B) Can he go after the guys at the shop since he is hurt ?
C) What can my friend do about the police officer giving out his personal information?
Click to expand...

The most interesting parts!

Recouping the costs to fix the bike is a small claims matter... The bolded parts may be criminal acts.
 
You have already put too much information on a public forum. Stop talking about the on the internet.

(Tell your friend to) Seek out a lawyer, go from there.
 
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First things first. This is not legal advice. I am not your lawyer. Do not PM me about this.

The first thing is personal safety. The phone calls can be constituted as a threat. I would involve cops on that.
Secondly, forget about the cop giving away your information for now. One, the damage is done, you can't undo it, secondly, thats probabaly a complaint which isn't really relevant to the larger picture and kinda something you can do anytime, not a priority. ( I am however, surprised that you know that the cop is a friend and he gave the info so on so forth)

You haven't been charged with anything so don't act like you did. (I don't see anything that is a potential criminal charge really)

So that leaves the 2 civil disputes
1 for damages to the bike
2 for personal injury

with respect to the damage to the bike, you don't need a lawyer yet. why? because you don't need to claim against them for anything. You can either settle it with them (something i probably would be too ****** off to do), or just wait for them to file a claim against you. At that point its a small claims matter and you don't need a lawyer for that. 4000 is also a very very small amount and pretty much not worth lawyering up for.

Personal injury is something you may want to get a lawyer for (I will not be recommending one). But please keep in mind that litigation is very expensive and may or may not be worth it due to the extent of your injuries. If its not a big deal, you can consider leaving it alone, if you do pursue it, expect to spend a decent amount of time, and they will likely counterclaim the bike.

I sort of see this as everyone walking away and eating it.
 
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As a Rider / Driver of a motor vehicle in Ontario, you are suppose to have a valid driver's license (including CLASS), permit (Temp or Plate) and Insurance for the vehicle. This applies to all the dealers as well. Most of the licensed dealerships wont left you test ride the bikes because it;s too much liability on their part and their insurance will sky rocket if they find out that dealerships are allowing riders to test ride their bikes.
I would suggest that your friend should speak to a lawyer or at-least a paralegal, and get proper advise. As far as speaking to police goes, it;s up to you if you wish do so.
 
The shop getting your phone number is a questionable action by the police but depending on your name and if it's a land line getting someone's address isn't all that hard using reverse look up.

Lots of issues here.

Fail to report accident

Driving without plate

Driving without insurance

Negligence by shop in not fixing cable

Details of sales contract with bike owner

The way I see it the shop should theoretically be held responsible for all damages if the damages can be tied to the sticking cable. BUT the rider should have refused to ride a bike without a plate. Need judges and lawyers on this one.
 
This is like a can of worms with 10 different kinds in it....wow.
I think the guy should stay home armed with a ceremonial dagger and watch his property.
 
ddusseld said:
I do have a question. By checking a bike out does that mean the shop had the bike for sale? Maybe a consignment deal? If so, it makes it a test drive. To me, no legal background, it would appear that the dealer then becomes responsible to make sure the vehicle is in good working order with plates and insurance. With no damage waiver I would hope that the dealer in question is completely responsible. But like I said your friend will need a real lawyer to sort this out one way or the other.
Click to expand...

@ddusseld The shop have a number of bikes for sale. This one caught my boy's eye and the guys at the shop told him he could take it for a spin.


For those who say this is a public forum and I should not speak about it on here etc. The only criminal issue for my friend could be fail to report accident, but what if the accident did not meet criteria to be reported? This is left in question.


@sonnythebull The shop specializes in Ducati's, and is located in the west end of Toronto. I won't say anymore regarding the name of the shop for liability reasons.


CruisnGrrl said:
didn't your friend have to provide his licence in order to do a test ride? his full name and address would be on it.
I have never gone on any test rides/drives with out having to provide my licence.
Click to expand...

@CruisnGrrl No, they did not take my friend's license ... @OperGambit This is why we suspect the cop is buddies with the shop guys because how else would they get his home address and full name?


I told my friend he should get a lawyer because he is hurt pretty bad and has not been to work since. He is young and was excited to just ride the bike, not thinking about a helmet or gloves etc. and paid the price. The shop was more concerned about cost of the repairs when they should of been worried about being sued by my friend (what if he hit his head and died?).
 
FitzR6 said:
He is young and was excited to just ride the bike, not thinking about a helmet or gloves etc. and paid the price. The shop was more concerned about cost of the repairs when they should of been worried about being sued by my friend (what if he hit his head and died?).
Click to expand...

No offence but if he was riding an unisured, unplated motorcycle with no gear , let alone a helmet while never riding a bike before. If he hit his head and died I would place majority of the blame on himself for his own stupidity
 
jeffjones said:
No offence but if he was riding an unisured, unplated motorcycle with no gear , let alone a helmet while never riding a bike before. If he hit his head and died I would place majority of the blame on himself for his own stupidity
Click to expand...

I have to agree. Did he even know how to ride a motorcycle? Sticky throttle? Why not just clutch in?
 
So much fail but if he ignores the shop they stand no chance of getting anything out of him. They should be worried this could seriously mess with thier business insurance if he sues. I know most shops walk away from bikes that get damaged on test rides and just sell them cheap. The shop should have never let him test ride and he should have not gone on that test ride.
 
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