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Ethanol free gas

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Is there anywhere left in Ontario with ethanol-free gas now that Costco and Shell have switched to ethanol gas in all grades

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I’m still seeing 91 pumps labeled as being ethanol free at some Canadian Tire gas stations, but I don’t know if that’s accurate or if the workers haven’t bothered to peel the label off.
 
Katatonic said:
I’m still seeing 91 pumps labeled as being ethanol free at some Canadian Tire gas stations, but I don’t know if that’s accurate or if the workers haven’t bothered to peel the label off.
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Asked at one CT gas station if the sticker was the truth, the pump jockey did not know or did not want to tell!
I guess the dispensers are certified for the calibration of volume but not for what is pumped through the nozzles.
 
Katatonic said:
I’m still seeing 91 pumps labeled as being ethanol free at some Canadian Tire gas stations, but I don’t know if that’s accurate or if the workers haven’t bothered to peel the label off.
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Best to check if Canadian Tire's pumps have old stickers. I noticed that all their pumps in Mississauga had them removed late last year.
 
Basically, by 2025, our fossil fuel burning motorcycles will be forced into extinction…most if not all manufacturers say DO NOT exceed 10% ethanol. Ontario will be at 11% in 2025.
 
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AFJ said:
If you MUST have gasoline without ethanol you can buy an alkylate gasoline (95 octane) from Husqvarna who advise it for some of their chain saws or other power equipment. Don't have any idea of the price, but I would think "Not Cheap". In Britain, alkylate petrol sells, I am told, at about 6 UK pounds per litre (about $10.00/litre). Historically, this "alkylate" was iso-octane (2,24 trimethyl pentene) and is 100 octane.

My own experience with gasoline with alcohol in old British motorcycles is that it is not a significant problem and can be actually beneficial to both power and economy by simply re-tuning the carburetor by increasing the main jet size by one or two sizes and putting in a new needle jet and maybe adjusting the needle to a different notch. Gasoline (petrol to the British) with up to 15% ethanol was marketed in Britain as early as the 1930s and was considered to be a "high performance premium fuel" for both cars and motorcycles. Increasing levels of ethanol in internal combustion engines can increase the "fuel charge density" and therefore increase the power output.
AFJ
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There’s a much easier way if you MUST have ethanol free - just make your own.
I’m working on a setup that will make a max of 20 gallons every 24 hours. Total cost for the setup is under $300.
Basically, it’s a holding tank on a stand with a conical bottom and a drain. Mix gas with some water and mix. The water absorbs the ethanol and settles to the bottom of the holding tank. Drain off the water and you’re left with ethanol free gas.
 
@Katatonic hubby just made his own on the weekend...he used an old windshield washer fluid jug (cleaned it out first) and did exactly what you said...put about an inch of water on the bottom and marked its level on the jug...then poured the gas in...then let it sit overnight...remarked the new water line and that's the ethanol that came out of the gasoline...we bought a $12 hand pump at CT and now the ethanol free gas is in one of our jerry cans...I didn't believe it would work when he first told me, but it looks like it did...will have to see how it performs when he uses it...
 
AFJ said:
If you MUST have gasoline without ethanol you can buy an alkylate gasoline (95 octane) from Husqvarna who advise it for some of their chain saws or other power equipment. Don't have any idea of the price, but I would think "Not Cheap". In Britain, alkylate petrol sells, I am told, at about 6 UK pounds per litre (about $10.00/litre). Historically, this "alkylate" was iso-octane (2,24 trimethyl pentene) and is 100 octane.

My own experience with gasoline with alcohol in old British motorcycles is that it is not a significant problem and can be actually beneficial to both power and economy by simply re-tuning the carburetor by increasing the main jet size by one or two sizes and putting in a new needle jet and maybe adjusting the needle to a different notch. Gasoline (petrol to the British) with up to 15% ethanol was marketed in Britain as early as the 1930s and was considered to be a "high performance premium fuel" for both cars and motorcycles. Increasing levels of ethanol in internal combustion engines can increase the "fuel charge density" and therefore increase the power output.
AFJ
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I don't think tuning is the big issue.

Methanol is a solvent, it's hard on some hoses and plastics in the fuel system, it's also hydroscopic which is unfriendly to small carbs, fuel injectors, and steel gas tanks.

I believe premium gasoline 89 octane and higher is not required to be blended on Ontario. Fuel suppliers like the flexibility, particularly in times like now when ethanol costs less than gasoline. Blending when ethanol is cheaper than gas is profitable.
 
I’m pretty disappointed, because I’ve had to deal with ethanol in fiberglass tanks and plastic tanks ,It’s ugly .
But I’m not home brewing my own lol , I burn way to much in the summer to do that .


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Mad Mike said:
I don't think tuning is the big issue.

Methanol is a solvent, it's hard on some hoses and plastics in the fuel system, it's also hydroscopic which is unfriendly to small carbs, fuel injectors, and steel gas tanks.

I believe premium gasoline 89 octane and higher is not required to be blended on Ontario. Fuel suppliers like the flexibility, particularly in times like now when ethanol costs less than gasoline. Blending when ethanol is cheaper than gas is profitable.
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Head to the link earlier in the thread on the Ontario website. Ethanol free gas is gone, regardless of grade.
 
Can we all write our MPPs? Regardless of the arguments for/against ethanol in fuel, the environmental and financial impacts this will have are massive. Does everyone have to replace their vehicle(s) far earlier due to shortening of lifespan?
 
mixedup said:
Can we all write our MPPs? Regardless of the arguments for/against ethanol in fuel, the environmental and financial impacts this will have are massive. Does everyone have to replace their vehicle(s) far earlier due to shortening of lifespan?
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I think you are overreacting.
 
@Wingboy I hope so. Did you read the govt website?

The renewable content requirement increases to:
  • 11% in 2025
  • 13% in 2028
  • 15% in 2030 and onward
Alternatively we can just let it happen….most won’t pay attention because they don’t even read their car owner’s manual (let alone a gas pump).
 
mixedup said:
@Wingboy I hope so. Did you read the govt website?

The renewable content requirement increases to:
  • 11% in 2025
  • 13% in 2028
  • 15% in 2030 and onward
Alternatively we can just let it happen….most won’t pay attention because they don’t even read their car owner’s manual (let alone a gas pump).
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I read it thanks for the link. It does indeed say mid & premium grade gasoline is exempt. No doubt some % of ethanol will be present to get the octane boost it provides, but maybe retailers will stick to just "up to 10%" to provide another justification for the increased cost?
In general I'm not overly concerned. Ethanol keeps valves clean (allegedly), turbos like it (according to the forum "experts").
Worst case scenario I guess with old machines is replace all the rubbery bits and refurbish/refit carbs, etc?

Katatonic said:
There’s a much easier way if you MUST have ethanol free - just make your own.
I’m working on a setup that will make a max of 20 gallons every 24 hours. Total cost for the setup is under $300.
Basically, it’s a holding tank on a stand with a conical bottom and a drain. Mix gas with some water and mix. The water absorbs the ethanol and settles to the bottom of the holding tank. Drain off the water and you’re left with ethanol free gas.
Click to expand...

ifiddles said:
@Katatonic hubby just made his own on the weekend...he used an old windshield washer fluid jug (cleaned it out first) and did exactly what you said...put about an inch of water on the bottom and marked its level on the jug...then poured the gas in...then let it sit overnight...remarked the new water line and that's the ethanol that came out of the gasoline...we bought a $12 hand pump at CT and now the ethanol free gas is in one of our jerry cans...I didn't believe it would work when he first told me, but it looks like it did...will have to see how it performs when he uses it...
Click to expand...
That all sounds very mysterious, back-yard moonshine stuff. I'm no chemist so no idea if that actually is doing what you say, BUT if it is, wouldn't that reduce the overall octane rating of the gas? I'm pretty sure the manufacturers use ethanol, in part at least, to help boost octane rating.
I'd be worried about putting that in anything other than a lawn mower/yard tools?
 
mixedup said:
Basically, by 2025, our fossil fuel burning motorcycles will be forced into extinction…most if not all manufacturers say DO NOT exceed 10% ethanol. Ontario will be at 11% in 2025.
Click to expand...
Extinction?... by 11% ethanol?
Are you serious? Do you actually believe the BS you're posting?

ANY, as in EVERY, vehicle made for the North American market, since the '90s will run on E15 without issue. (It's been a legal requirement since, IIRC, 1996) RTFM.
Any vehicle from before that can be made to run on E15 without issue.

... and ethanol is an oxidizing agent. When you remove the ethanol from modern gas, you're pulling oxygen from the burn... and losing power.
You want ethanol free fuel for your lawn mower/snowblower?: buy premium fuel from ANY gas station. No ethanol in premium. Reduced levels in mid-grade as mid-grade is a mix of premium (0% ethanol) and regular (10% ethanol) ... so mid-grade has 5% ethanol.
 
The problems with Norton tanks pre-dates ethanol fuels. Those tanks were/are a bad idea from the word GO.
That being said: I used to race a Gus Kuhn and we were sponsored by Pro Race Fuels (the world leader in un-leaded race fuels) and we poured all kinds of different fairy piss race fuels into that stock Norton tank and never had a problem with it.
IIRC the melting Ducati tanks was a oxidizer issue... it was a Ducati problem, not a fuel problem.
I can't speak for every modern setup, but they all have knock sensors now, and the Mopar setup cranks the timing till it knocks, then backs off a couple, in their E85 setup.

... don't racers use methanol, NOT ethanol?
 
bitzz said:
Extinction?... by 11% ethanol?
Are you serious? Do you actually believe the BS you're posting?

ANY, as in EVERY, vehicle made for the North American market, since the '90s will run on E15 without issue. (It's been a legal requirement since, IIRC, 1996) RTFM.
Any vehicle from before that can be made to run on E15 without issue.

... and ethanol is an oxidizing agent. When you remove the ethanol from modern gas, you're pulling oxygen from the burn... and losing power.
You want ethanol free fuel for your lawn mower/snowblower?: buy premium fuel from ANY gas station. No ethanol in premium. Reduced levels in mid-grade as mid-grade is a mix of premium (0% ethanol) and regular (10% ethanol) ... so mid-grade has 5% ethanol.
Click to expand...
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