No they cant they will low side if they do. What they do is called push steering.
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Difficulty Making Turns on Bigger Bike
- Thread starter OmegaBravo7
- Start date
No they cant they will low side if they do. What they do is called push steering.
No they won't and every bike uses push steering.
Maybe i use the term incorrectly. I mean if you lean our body out side of the turn to counterweight the bike for it to lean further.
On a light bike , i actually do the leg out even if its sport bike. I guess im used to it. It feels much faster when you switch direction.
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Roomie
Banned
I think you high side instead....personal experience lol
With regards to body position...
When you reach a certain speed (over 40? I don't know the exact number), steering the bike no longer works due to centrifugal forces and Newton's third law: for every action there is a reaction. The reason why we lean off bikes for high speed cornering on asphalt is because it reduces the amount of lean angle required by playing with the center of gravity.
For u-turns and other slow speed maneuvers, you may not have enough speed to generate centrifugal force (this is why you have to turn your handlebars instead of counter steering). The fastest way to u-turn on any bike is mimic the crossed up style dirt riders do (lean the bike over, your body is straight or slightly on the outside of the turn) and stick a leg out!
With all that said...I've seen a rider last year at Racer5's trackday use a supermoto and ride crossed up. He was in the red group and his rear kept screeching. The DDT/RDT however does not have cornering speeds as fast as the big track...I don't think that style would work in that context due to requiring more lean angle but I was still really surprised how fast he was despite kicking the back out constantly.
Leaning out of the turn feels like a faster transition because it is. That's exactly why super moto riders do it. It's not because they will low side of they do it differently. Super motos tend to ride tight, technical tracks at lower speeds (I hear of sumo races on go kart tracks, for example). They also have super sticky tires (several models are sold in super sport compound and separately sold in sumo compound). The combination of the lower speeds and super grippy tires allow you to corner like this and it helps you make those tight, technical turns quickly.
However, this is incorrect body position for high speeds because more lean angle means less tire and less grip. Supersport racing has people hanging off the bike, into the turn, to intentionally reduce lean angle required to turn at a given speed. It shifts the center of gravity and lets you stay upright. If you cornered with sumo style on a supersport at the same speeds you'd quickly hit hard parts of the bike on the ground, or run out of tire, and crash because to make the turn at those speeds, while leaning out of the turn would require the bike to be practically horizontal. As it is some supersport racers are limited in speed because they're already dragging their knees, elbows, and even head, trying to get that center of gravity out as far as possible while at the same time leaning the bike as far as possible. Neither one can go any further.
You can corner either way on both and be fine at most normal road speeds. Some people that brag they have no "chicken strips" don't have any because they don't lean into their turns (or lean out of them) which means more lean is required of the bike and no chicken strips.
This is also why I've seen recommendations to lean off the bike very far in slippery conditions. It keeps the bike upright and on the center of the tire, which has the best contact area and traction.
Maybe someone that knows better than I do can correct any mistakes I've made but I know a sumo will not low side if you lean off the bike like on an SS. It makes no sense at all that they would since they have the same, if not stickier, tires, contacting the road in the same manner.
OmegaBravo7
Well-known member
I should update...
Things I'm doing differently with success:
-I'm looking ahead where I want to be, not where I think I may fall (DuH! Incredible difference)
-I lean the bike a bit (push steering) while keeping myself more upright without leaning with the bike
-My foot is barely on the rear brake, but touching nonetheless
-My speed is not AS slow as before, it requires a bit more momentum and feathering the clutch if needed
-If I'm making a u-turn to the left, I will go out to the right a bit, and come back to do the U-turn (imagine an upside down horseshoe) and complete it. Perhaps I'm doing this wrong, but with practice and enough time on this bigger bike I'll probably do a tighter U-turn. For now, this will suffice.
Still no luck with 90 degree turn though. Can big bikes even make sharp 90 degree turns? Not so sure anymore. I'd do the 90 on my ninja 250, but still no luck on this beast. I notice every time I attempt, it becomes more of a 115-125 degree
Things I'm doing differently with success:
-I'm looking ahead where I want to be, not where I think I may fall (DuH! Incredible difference)
-I lean the bike a bit (push steering) while keeping myself more upright without leaning with the bike
-My foot is barely on the rear brake, but touching nonetheless
-My speed is not AS slow as before, it requires a bit more momentum and feathering the clutch if needed
-If I'm making a u-turn to the left, I will go out to the right a bit, and come back to do the U-turn (imagine an upside down horseshoe) and complete it. Perhaps I'm doing this wrong, but with practice and enough time on this bigger bike I'll probably do a tighter U-turn. For now, this will suffice.
Still no luck with 90 degree turn though. Can big bikes even make sharp 90 degree turns? Not so sure anymore. I'd do the 90 on my ninja 250, but still no luck on this beast. I notice every time I attempt, it becomes more of a 115-125 degree
Yes i rode bikes overseas and its all about tight maneuver. Its now a habbit that is hard to correct. Im signing up for track school this season to correct this.
One thing i might add, with supermoto you will have ground clearance issue if you knee down hence the leg out. However this is only for tight corners and not high speed.
You're doing great so far with the push steering and up right position. Im sure you feel light on your wrist when your hands dont support your weight.
You will get 90 turn with more practice. Becareful with the horseshoe u turn, the driver in the back might attempt to pass you on your left.
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