We don't know about registered gun owners who sell their guns and pretend it was stolen, and the crimes that result from it.
All guns start off legally owned. So sensible restrictions on legal owners, and penalties like Brian suggests, will inevitably restrict illegal ones.
Besides, since you can surely find many cases in the US where someone shot the wrong person thinking they were trying to kill them, unlike Canada, and since there have certainly been several home invasions in the US that ended badly for the victims (including homes with guns), just like Canada, doesn't that indicate there's no upside to having less strict gun regulations? The other argument, to have guns to defend from a tyrannical government, is also retarded.
The real explanation is an underlying psychology behind some people's unjustified support for guns which has more to do with their unrealistic sense of their own unlimited potential. They figure they can be relied upon to handle and safeguard guns responsibly, and use them against others only when there is no other option. Their purity and goodness, along with a gun, is all that's needed to triumph over darkness and evil. And while this description may very well be TRUE for a large number of people, it isn't true for many more, and it doesn't change the demonstrable fact that allowing more guns in society makes us all less secure overall.
The smallest personal sacrifice of registering long guns for example, enables significant benefits to society. Such a rule is exactly why we call ourselves one nation; to benefit everybody by enforcing standards that we all share anyways. There's no reason for anyone to have a moral objection to gun registries, but people make that claim, hiding behind paranoid arguments of government oppression and tyranny, or about their need to arm themselves against hypothetical intruders who want to kill them.
If someone wants to kill you and they expect that you're armed, they just won't give you a chance to shoot! This isn't brain surgery. All we'd accomplish by having more guns is cause the violence of criminal acts to escalate proportionally. Again, look to the south.
It's a shame that this thread, which is about the murder of two innocent kids and assault on many others and has shed absolutely no new light on the subject of guns, has turned into another dumb pro/anti gun argument. The thread is full of lies and distortions that I've ignored until now because honestly, nothing more needed to be said after the second post.
RIP Reese and Julianna.
A much more thought out comment than in the other thread.
-"Besides, since you can surely find many cases in the US where someone shot the wrong person thinking they were trying to kill them, unlike Canada, and since there have certainly been several home invasions in the US that ended badly for the victims (including homes with guns), just like Canada, doesn't that indicate there's no upside to having less strict gun regulations?"
You can surely find many cases, where someone shot the right person who was trying to kill them, unlike Canada who doesn't get the opportunity, and since you can find countless examples of home invasions that ended in a blessing for the potential victims who were able to protect their family (YouTube it / all caught on tape), unlike Canada, I would say there's strong reason to suggest moving towards the opposite end of the spectrum; exiting the ban zone in Canada but with competent management and education.
-"The other argument, to have guns to defend from a tyrannical government, is also retarded."
In all the world, have you never heard of the suspension of civil rights which have resulted in mass rapes and murder? Even today there are countless situations where abuse of power at various degrees have been observed.
The main difference between you and I is that you are content with the illusion of freedom and I am not. You "feel free" because of generational conditioning and because there are worse forms of management out there in other nations. You don't know any better. What many dont realize is that the jails are filled with not only criminals, but many free men. A truly free individual will inevitably have friction with the law. Why would I take a protection deal from a force who looks at me like a number, restricts my freedoms and options because of what some other guy did (individuality not recognized), and imprison me for stretching my arms beyond their approved boundaries?
When you dont have the self respect to defend yourself or your family, you approach the table not as an equal, but as a lesser. You are granted freedoms on the basis of your productivity and it is given to you by the "mercy" of those with power. Wolves respect wolves, not sheep.
This is a matter of instinct, education of warfare, awareness and sight, more than it is about retardation.
-"The real explanation is an underlying psychology behind some people's unjustified support for guns which has more to do with their unrealistic sense of their own unlimited potential. They figure they can be relied upon to handle and safeguard guns responsibly, and use them against others only when there is no other option. Their purity and goodness, along with a gun, is all that's needed to triumph over darkness and evil. And while this description may very well be TRUE for a large number of people, it isn't true for many more, and it doesn't change the demonstrable fact that allowing more guns in society makes us all less secure overall."
The lack of security comes from being unaccustomed to open expressions of protection. Still, your level of security and feelings should not obstruct your critical thinking or faculties. No need to make complex what is simple. However since you dug into the layers, might as well dive deep.
The desire to protect oneself is a reactionary and instinctive sense, induced by external forces. Whether that trigger is by your oppressor, or by rogues. Some do not wish to be caught in the crossfire and die a victim so they rather opt for the opportunity to defend themselves. One of the most concerning problems here is that you see yourself as a number. At the end of the year, obtain a record of all the victims of violent crimes in Canada. Tell them (if alive) that they are crazy for wanting to protect themselves now. Also tell the victim, including his/her friends and family that have learned a lesson from them that we are safe, and that the numbers in the report for crime statistics are still looking good.
I think it's fascinating that institutionalized people have successfully mirrored, echoed and regurgitated the views of their superiors.
They have done an outstanding job making what is natural appear unnatural, and what is unnatural appear natural. All spoken of in The Art of War by Sun Tzu. It is truly sad that they have succeeded in removing that key survival component and inclination from their lessers.
-"The smallest personal sacrifice of registering long guns for example, enables significant benefits to society. Such a rule is exactly why we call ourselves one nation; to benefit everybody by enforcing standards that we all share anyways. There's no reason for anyone to have a moral objection to gun registries, but people make that claim, hiding behind paranoid arguments of government oppression and tyranny, or about their need to arm themselves against hypothetical intruders who want to kill them".
Hiding behind arguments of government oppression and tyranny, hypothetical intruders who want to kill us?
Oppression is a matter perception or interpretation, and tyranny is a matter of sight looking steps ahead by observing steps already gone by. There are several cases and reasons when the government can suspend your civil rights (martial law), and when that occurs, there is a window of opportunity where potential injustices to the people are at an all time high (as seen in the past around the world).
It seems that any form of existent reality outside of your own circle of experience does not carry any weight. How convenient. Awareness is key here. There are countless cases of breaking and entering around Canada, robbery, and assault that does not make it onto the news. But It appears that as long as no gun shots went off, all is well and we have a much better society. Canadians are truly desensitized when it comes to victims. It's normal. God forgive the homeowner that blows the intruders head off and it makes it on the news. I have actually heard some Canadians say that one should not use lethal force when an intruder breaks in.
-"If someone wants to kill you and they expect that you're armed, they just won't give you a chance to shoot! This isn't brain surgery. All we'd accomplish by having more guns is cause the violence of criminal acts to escalate proportionally. Again, look to the south".
Although yes, the hit can still be executed, If someone wants to kill you, they will think twice because it will no longer be wolf vs sheep, but wolf vs wolf. In our society there is no form of deterrence from the victim that may help. Authorities cannot be everywhere at once, so it's no different than picking off sheep when the farmer isnt looking.
Also, yes on paper, it will appear that more gun crime will increase, but so will the instances where law abiding citizens were able to protect themselves and their families.
-"It's a shame that this thread, which is about the murder of two innocent kids and assault on many others and has shed absolutely no new light on the subject of guns, has turned into another dumb pro/anti gun argument. The thread is full of lies and distortions that I've ignored until now because honestly, nothing more needed to be said after the second post".
We have a people problem, not a gun problem. The only reason why guns are the focal point is because political correctness does not grant you permission to discuss people. In the natural world (the real world), it's naive to reject equal force of protection. The pillars and foundation you stand on that gives you your illusion of freedom is fueled by the power of guns. It is a respected force that grants independance and respect at all levels ranging from a larger scale (military) to a lower scale (civilian). Still, the actual root and focal point should be on people, but I doubt the average joe would like to discuss that.
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