Bikes in the HOV lanes | Page 4 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Bikes in the HOV lanes

Forum Sponsor
It really is a retarded situation regarding the HOV lanes in this City.

So for my little trek from the Downtown core every afternoon i can save some time and jump off the DVP and use the HOV lanes on Don Mills all the way up to York Mills and not have to deal with the stop and go traffic. Get back on the DVP/404 but i can't legally use the HOV's lanes up to hwy 407.
I think i would be happier if 2 wheels weren't allowed to use any HOV lanes period, rather than this cluster **** we have right now.
It's so stupid it's laughable, almost as funny as the lack of policing on Don Mills to single occupant drivers using the HOV lanes, i mean why bother complying when no-one is enforcing it.
 
Englishj said:
It really is a retarded situation regarding the HOV lanes in this City.

So for my little trek from the Downtown core every afternoon i can save some time and jump off the DVP and use the HOV lanes on Don Mills all the way up to York Mills and not have to deal with the stop and go traffic. Get back on the DVP/404 but i can't legally use the HOV's lanes up to hwy 407.
I think i would be happier if 2 wheels weren't allowed to use any HOV lanes period, rather than this cluster **** we have right now.
It's so stupid it's laughable, almost as funny as the lack of policing on Don Mills to single occupant drivers using the HOV lanes, i mean why bother complying when no-one is enforcing it.
Click to expand...

That's an easy fix. Don't use the HOV lanes then. I'd rather be able to use them in the city, if they are available.
 
I'm still waiting for someone to give one good reason as to why a motorcycle with only one rider should be allowed in the HOV lane....
 
caboose483 said:
I'm still waiting for someone to give one good reason as to why a motorcycle with only one rider should be allowed in the HOV lane....
Click to expand...

I can think of a few, but in the end it comes down to the purpose of the HOV lanes.

If the purpose is to encourage a reduction in traffic (like carpooling) then bikes should be allowed on HOV lanes as they take up less space.

If the purpose is to acheive lower overall fuel consumption, bikes accomplish that too with only one rider.

If the purpose is to reduce CO2 emissions, same deal.

The only way it doesn't make sense is if the HOV lanes are intended to have the effect of reducing noxious emissions. In that case bikes shouldn't be allowed.
 
fastar1 said:
The only way it doesn't make sense is if the HOV lanes are intended to have the effect of reducing noxious emissions. In that case bikes shouldn't be allowed.
Click to expand...

That can be fixed if you watch what you eat.

The only reason would be to encourage more people to ride rather than drive. Whether that is a good idea is up for debate.
 
Baggsy said:
That can be fixed if you watch what you eat.

The only reason would be to encourage more people to ride rather than drive. Whether that is a good idea is up for debate.
Click to expand...

That's not exactly true. Two people on two motorcycles take up roughly as much road space as two people in a car. They also use up roughly as much gas (depending on where exactly the L/person-km threshold is set). So there's no need for traffic engineers to encourage one form of vehicle over another, they just have to figure out what their goal is with HOV lanes and let people use the vehicle option of their choice.
 
fastar1 said:
I can think of a few, but in the end it comes down to the purpose of the HOV lanes.

If the purpose is to encourage a reduction in traffic (like carpooling) then bikes should be allowed on HOV lanes as they take up less space.
Click to expand...

Not really. A motorcycle occupies incrementally less space than a compact car. Add up the length of the vehicle plus the gap behind the vehicle ahead. The difference is negligible. Compare that to removing one or more vehicles completely from the road and you should realize that this argument has no merit.

fastar1 said:
If the purpose is to acheive lower overall fuel consumption, bikes accomplish that too with only one rider.
Click to expand...

Lower than what? Most compact 4-cylinder cars get better gas mileage than sport bikes or big bore cruisers. My buddy's Civic gets better gas mileage than his 675 Daytona. Again, compare it to removing one or more vehicles completely.

If you introduce a 2nd bike you're not even close. Even the most fuel efficient bikes would add up to 10L/100km or perhaps more. My 4400lb Edge gets around 9L/100km on the highway. This point is moot.

fastar1 said:
If the purpose is to reduce CO2 emissions, same deal.

The only way it doesn't make sense is if the HOV lanes are intended to have the effect of reducing noxious emissions. In that case bikes shouldn't be allowed.
Click to expand...

Agreed.
 
Last edited:
fastar1 said:
That's not exactly true. Two people on two motorcycles take up roughly as much road space as two people in a car. They also use up roughly as much gas (depending on where exactly the L/person-km threshold is set). So there's no need for traffic engineers to encourage one form of vehicle over another, they just have to figure out what their goal is with HOV lanes and let people use the vehicle option of their choice.
Click to expand...

Not everyone that commutes Downtown is riding a litre bike. In the past i would buy that "roughly the same gas argument" but steadily each year the numbers of 125's and 250's bikes travelling downtown have increased.
 
Englishj said:
Not everyone that commutes Downtown is riding a litre bike. In the past i would buy that "roughly the same gas argument" but steadily each year the numbers of 125's and 250's bikes travelling downtown have increased.
Click to expand...

Steadily each year people are trading in their commuter vehicles for something smaller and more fuel efficient. Look at the popularity of the Yaris, Fiesta, Mazda 2, Accent, etc.

Even the 125s and 250s are in the 5L/100km range. Two of those makes 10L/100km. 99% of 4-cylinder cars on the road get better fuel mileage than that.
 
caboose483 said:
Steadily each year people are trading in their commuter vehicles for something smaller and more fuel efficient. Look at the popularity of the Yaris, Fiesta, Mazda 2, Accent, etc.

Even the 125s and 250s are in the 5L/100km range. Two of those makes 10L/100km. 99% of 4-cylinder cars on the road get better fuel mileage than that.
Click to expand...

I might be wrong but i'm sure a 125cc is getting better gas mileage than that. Every second vehicle on the road right now is one of those new Ford F150's. Doesn't matter how many of those little egg cars are being produced, more people still feel the need to drive a construction size vehicle down to their offices every day.
 
Last edited:
caboose483 said:
Not really.
Click to expand...

Lower than what?
Click to expand...
That's my point, it depends on the threshold they have set (and for what criteria).

Let's say the criteria is a reduction in fuel consumption, then what's the threshold? As an example let's say the threshold is 5L/100 highway km per person. In that case most single-rider bikes would fit under the threshold while most vehicles would need two occupants to fit below the threshold. The same rationale can be applied to road space, how many square meters of road per person is the threshold? Depending on that value single rider bikes could fit the standard and therefore should be allowed on the HOV lanes.

To me it's just a matter of defining a standard rather than arbitrarily designating which vehicles can and can't use the HOV lanes. If they do that and bikes end up with the short end of the stick then fine, so be it.
 
Last edited:
Englishj said:
I might be wrong but i'm sure a 125cc is getting better gas mileage than that. Every second vehicle on the road right now is one of those new Ford F150's. Doesn't matter how many of those little egg cars are being produced, more people still feel the need to drive a construction size vehicle down to their offices every day.
Click to expand...

My BW50 scooter gets about 3L/100km. 125s and 250s will be a bit higher, likely closer to 5L/100km but maybe a tad less. I just checked the parking lot here at work, i can see 25 cars and only 3 of them are V8 powered trucks. The rest are 4 or 6 cylinder vehicles all of which likely get 10L/100km or better. I would disagree that half the vehicles on the road are new 1/2 ton pickups.

fastar1 said:
That's my point, it depends on the threshold they have set (and for what criteria).

Let's say the criteria is a reduction in fuel consumption, then what's the threshold? As an example let's say the threshold is 5L/100 highway km per person. In that case most single-rider bikes would fit under the threshold while most vehicles would need two occupants to fit below the threshold. The same rationale can be applied to road space, how many square meters of road per person is the threshold? Depending on that value single rider bikes could fit the standard and therefore should be allowed on the HOV lanes.

To me it's just a matter of defining a standard rather than arbitrarily designating which vehicles can and can't use the HOV lanes. If they do that and bikes end up with the short end of the stick then fine, so be it.
Click to expand...

I highly doubt that MOST bikes can get 5L/100km or better. No sport bike or big bore cruiser can. If you're going to set a more realistic goal of 7L/100km then just about any new 4-cylinder compact or sub-compact can do that as well.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/MotorcycleFuelEconomyGuide/index.htm

10 second google search. Who's in charge of deciding which bikes can and can't go in the HOV lanes? Ridiculously impractical. You either let all bikes in and then let all compacts and subcompacts in (which is a huge percentage of road users and totally defeats the purpose of having an HOV lane to decrease the amount of vehicles on the road) or neither.
 
caboose483 said:
My BW50 scooter gets about 3L/100km. 125s and 250s will be a bit higher, likely closer to 5L/100km but maybe a tad less. I just checked the parking lot here at work, i can see 25 cars and only 3 of them are V8 powered trucks. The rest are 4 or 6 cylinder vehicles all of which likely get 10L/100km or better. I would disagree that half the vehicles on the road are new 1/2 ton pickups.
Click to expand...

I just took a look at the parking lot at work and all the cars are Acura's wtf.....oh i just remembered i work at a dealership haha.

DVP this morning at 6.00am very few egg cars, quite a few trucks(pick-up's and delivery style) mixture of high end vehicles which are not being purchased for their fuel economy. Take a look at the link i provided, 84,262 light trucks sold last month compared to 75,680 cars.
 
Englishj said:
I just took a look at the parking lot at work and all the cars are Acura's wtf.....oh i just remembered i work at a dealership haha.

DVP this morning at 6.00am very few egg cars, quite a few trucks(pick-up's and delivery style) mixture of high end vehicles which are not being purchased for their fuel economy. Take a look at the link i provided, 84,262 light trucks sold last month compared to 75,680 cars.
Click to expand...

Your link doesn't break down rural versus urban demographics. It also doesn't break down commercial versus personal vehicles.. but yes the numbers don't lie. Now I'm curious about and would like to know what the breakdown actually is on the highway during rush hour.

The newest crop of 1/2 ton pickups are a lot better on fuel than they used to be. A new F150 with two people in it might actually use less fuel per person than the average motorcycle on the highway. Even a lot of newer SUVs put up fuel consumption numbers of 10L/100km or better.

As far as im concerned the main reason for HOV lanes is to reduce congestion on the roads. Fuel consumption and pollution concerns are secondary. That being said, allowing motorcycles into the HOV lanes would do next to nothing to reduce congestion as it does not actually remove any vehicles from the road.
Forum Sponsor
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom