Any GTAM'ers own an electric vehicle?

[Lunatic]

Thanks – yes you are indeed in a near ideal situation for helping reduce battery losses despite the conditions. I am very interested to hear your experiences as the winter goes on however, especially during the few extreme cold snaps that we get where you are going to be dealing with not only frigid external temperatures cold soaking the battery, but also high cabin heat demands.

Speaking of cabin heat how did you find the HVAC vent temperatures this morning? I know with the Volt people often complain about the vent temperatures when it comes to heating because the car is programmed to lean heavily towards efficiency vs scalding hot air. It WILL crank out hot air even on electric heat but you really need to jack up the HVAC settings to get it. I’m going to guess that the Bolt is probably a little more generous in this regard given the drastically higher battery reserve available.

So far I've noticed that it doesn't tend push really hot air unless you hit the full defrost button. Strangely it does tend to start pushing hot air when you push the accelerator harder, just like an ICE vehicle. One of the things I have seen other Bolt owners mention is that they tend to pack snow in the wheel wells more than ICE vehicles, perhaps because there is no heat from an engine.

 

[GreyGhost]

One of the things I have seen other Bolt owners mention is that they tend to pack snow in the wheel wells more than ICE vehicles, perhaps because there is no heat from an engine.

That's interesting. I wonder if they also shrunk the gap to help with aero (and therefore range). I couldn't see engine heat affecting the rear wheels much.

How does regenerative braking behave when it's slippery? I know in the past in a Prius, you could pull back on the shifter to get heavy engine braking (and regen), do the Volts/Bolts have something similar? If they have it, does it lower the effect when it's slippery or does it fall back onto conventional brakes and ABS?

If you put your foot in it, the VW was spinning both wheels in 6th last night, I can only imagine how easy it would be for an electric car to break itself loose. Are they letting you completely disable traction control or is is only half disabled? (VW has a button to turn TC off but you cannot affect stability control unless you pull the abs fuse).

 

[Lunatic]

That's interesting. I wonder if they also shrunk the gap to help with aero (and therefore range). I couldn't see engine heat affecting the rear wheels much.

How does regenerative braking behave when it's slippery? I know in the past in a Prius, you could pull back on the shifter to get heavy engine braking (and regen), do the Volts/Bolts have something similar? If they have it, does it lower the effect when it's slippery or does it fall back onto conventional brakes and ABS?

If you put your foot in it, the VW was spinning both wheels in 6th last night, I can only imagine how easy it would be for an electric car to break itself loose. Are they letting you completely disable traction control or is is only half disabled? (VW has a button to turn TC off but you cannot affect stability control unless you pull the abs fuse).

The Bolt has a regen paddle on the left side of the steering wheel to increase it. In L mode (one pedal driving) it has pretty strong braking as it is, but you can add to it. I almost never have to use the regular brakes.

Tons of torque, so it can break loose pretty easily, but the pedal is really easy to modulate. Traction control can be turned off, but I haven't had the car long enough to really mess with it.

 

[PrivatePilot]

You've intrigued me such that I just went out to the car here at work and checked ... the fuel door did not manually open with the car off but the car may need to be on (didn't test that) but indeed it did say the message you refer to (I never noticed it before).

I too experienced the ERDTT today at -10. It can be set to -2 or -3 (can't recall exactly) but I've set it to -10. Once the engine fires up and idles away you can switch the climate to "Fan" only and see your Climate energy use drop to a few % points only (much better than Eco or Comfort).

This may be a difference between our model years then as our 2012 has a fully mechanical release for the fuel door (you push it to get it to click out) and we also don't have the ability to alter the temperature setting for ERDTT, it's preset at around -4C or so IIRC. I am thinking about doing the ERDTT mod (to disable it for short trips in cold weather where a 6KW HVAC draw is irrelevant) but that might be hard now that I waited until after my surgery and I'd be trying to do it with 1 arm. :/

So far I've noticed that it doesn't tend push really hot air unless you hit the full defrost button. Strangely it does tend to start pushing hot air when you push the accelerator harder, just like an ICE vehicle. One of the things I have seen other Bolt owners mention is that they tend to pack snow in the wheel wells more than ICE vehicles, perhaps because there is no heat from an engine.

Interesting.

As for snow in the wheel wells, not sure it's a real concern specific to electric cars alone necessarily. All my vehicles, if driven in the snow long enough, have packed the wheel wells completely full. Here's a pic of our old 300 after driving through a some heavy weather on I81.

 

[Lunatic]

Yeah, until I have the occasion to drive in snow extensively I won't really know. The comments were from people who got Bolts at the beginning of 2017 and they were comparing to their previous cars.

 

[LePhillou]

Kinda unrelated to the volt and bolt and other ev talks...but can people start messaging zero motorcycles to show some interest in getting the grant for EVs applied for ontario?

From what i understand the manufacturer has to apply for it and they havent.

Seeing where they are now in terms of battery life is pretty darn close to a real motorcycle. Seeing that i use my moto as a commuter it would be PERFECT for my everyday commute too.

Anyhow maybe message them on their facebook page or facebook messenger
https://www.facebook.com/zeromotorcycles

don't know where that's gonna land... kinda throwin on the wall and seeing what sticks

 

[Rick CH]

How does regenerative braking behave when it's slippery? I know in the past in a Prius, you could pull back on the shifter to get heavy engine braking (and regen), do the Volts/Bolts have something similar? If they have it, does it lower the effect when it's slippery or does it fall back onto conventional brakes and ABS?

I was curious about the heavy regen (via the pedal in L mode) in slippery conditions, so this morning on one of the quiet side streets on my commute, I tested it out on a slippery and ice stretch of the road. Lifting my foot off the pedal for quick regen braking very easily broke the tires loose, like hitting the brakes hard. ABS kicked in and slowed the car, but it seemed like it was less effective during an event of just regen braking. That could just be perception and the path where I was slowing being icier. Like using regular friction brakes in slippery conditions, you've got to be smooth and progressive with regen braking.

 

[GreyGhost]

I was curious about the heavy regen (via the pedal in L mode) in slippery conditions, so this morning on one of the quiet side streets on my commute, I tested it out on a slippery and ice stretch of the road. Lifting my foot off the pedal for quick regen braking very easily broke the tires loose, like hitting the brakes hard. ABS kicked in and slowed the car, but it seemed like it was less effective during an event of just regen braking. That could just be perception and the path where I was slowing being icier. Like using regular friction brakes in slippery conditions, you've got to be smooth and progressive with regen braking.

Interesting, thx. I would have hoped that they would have programmed in a change to regen if it was slippery (eg. if ABS fired last time regen was tried, lower regen power this time. In an ideal world, it would ramp up regen over 1 second or so and automatically adjust the rate to keep from slipping). ABS firing when lifting your foot off the accelerator will catch many people off guard (in a ICE automobile, very few would have enough engine braking to break you loose in a straight line).

 

[slowbird]

Its odd seeing how differently the range behaves in the cold.

I am on nights and ran the Precondition twice to heat the interior and defrost the windshield before I left work at 6:20am and it had eaten away about 15kms of range.

Same as LBV I have my ERDTT set to the coldest. I'm debating whether or not to change it back to the normal setting. It kinda sucks having the electrical range get sapped so much...but I also hate seeing all these people with their Remote starts having their car idling for 10-20mins in the parking lot. Having the Volt Silently warming up with the faintest hummmm is quite satisfying.

 

[PrivatePilot]

My wife leaves at 7:20am every day.

I do a precondition at 6:50 for her, which finishes at 7am - 10 minutes max. I then let the car charge from 7:00 to 7:10 (it regains almost it’s full capacity in this time) and then hit precondition again. Since the coolant is and interior are already warm at that point it draws far less amps now and it stays mostly around 100% charge for her when she’s ready to roll.

I found out the hard way that you had to make sure that the “wait to charge until cheap rate periods” setting had to be changed from 7am to 8am in the mornings (despite the fact off peak actually ends st 7am) as otherwise the car would not go back to charging again after the first precondition as the computer otherwise considered it a mid/high peak rate period.

 

[Lunatic]

The regen on the Bolt kicks in hard if you just take your foot off the pedal, but it's really easy and controllable to modulate so unless you're really ham-fisted or inattentive I find it's very smooth.

 

[LBV]

I am on nights and ran the Precondition twice to heat the interior and defrost the windshield before I left work at 6:20am and it had eaten away about 15kms of range.

No way you can get a level 2 charger? I've got mine in the garage connected to a proper extension cord fed through the garage wall where the central vacuum pipe goes, across the unfinished basement ceiling and then finally to my dryer plug. You won't lose range on L2 from the pre-condition.

 

[PrivatePilot]

You won't lose range on L2 from the pre-condition.

Under moderately cold conditions, yes you will. The grid heater can draw up to ~6kw but the L2 can only supply around 3KW, so the rest is drawn from the battery.

Do a precondition tomorrow (with your HVAC set to comfort and 23 degrees or so) when temps are around zero (to avoid ERDTT) and then look at your battery percentage 10 minutes later on the secure.myvolt.com website, or OnStar - even with the car plugged in you’ll see a drop down to the 90-93% range based on my experiences. It takes about 10 minutes on L2 to recover back to 100%.

 

[LBV]

^ I'll have to check that out next pre-condition. I'll check the range before the remote start and then again right away when it's done.

Either way, it's much better than L1.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Either way, it's much better than L1.

I agree, on L1 you're running a ~4.5KW deficit potential if the heating elements run at their full 6KW for the entire preheat, and L1 will struggle to catch up afterwards as well.

As for checking on the guess-o-meter, it may not show the loss as effectively as the percentage-based display that is shown via OnStar does. Unfortunately the car doesn't display the battery percentage anywhere in the car, but it may (not sure, never checked) show it as consumption on the center stack energy display if the car doesn't reach a 100% SOC again before departure.

One of GM's biggest oversights with the Volt was only using a 3KW vs a 6KW charger. Again, I'm sure it was designed around battery longevity (they got that right, no question), but a 6KW charger would have at least alleviated these sorts of range loss issues during precondition, and yes, if the battery was able to charge at 6KW it would reduce full charge time to only 1.75-2 hours or so.

 

[LBV]

So I lost 2 km of range from the L2 pre-heat of 10 mins. It's been plugged in since last night and went from 59 before the remote start down to 57 immediately after.

 

[slowbird]

No way you can get a level 2 charger?

At home I park in a garage so I almost never precondition.

When I mentioned preconditioning at 6am it was at work and they don't even let me plug into an outlet, let alone provide a lvl2.

 

[LBV]

So I switched over to my winter wheel/tire setup and I had a look at the brake pads and they're like new I swear. It could be close to 8 years or more before I need new ones I reckon.

 

[GreyGhost]

So I switched over to my winter wheel/tire setup and I had a look at the brake pads and they're like new I swear. It could be close to 8 years or more before I need new ones I reckon.

My Toyota mechanic friend says that he has never seen worn out pads on a prius. Lots of rotors rot out and need to be replaced though because they rarely get heat in them to dry them out. Not sure if the Volt has addressed this in software (eg drag brakes while engine braking a few times a week to dry things out).

On a slightly unrelated note, I had forgotten about the ELR (cadillac Volt) until I ran across something on it this morning. Pretty cool looking car but they are ~40K used so the Volt is still a much more economical choice. I was hoping the Caddy depreciation would have hit harder (ELR dropped from 80 to 40, Volt dropped from 40 to 20). 80K new? No wonder they sold so few when fundamentally it's a Volt with a body kit.

 

[Lunatic]

I want to like the ELR so much, I've sat in one at a dealer and it looks and feels really nice, but even if I could pick up a used one really cheap I think I'd always hate driving it since it would be slower than my Bolt.