Any GTAM'ers own an electric vehicle?

[PrivatePilot]

Not true, when they introduce wireless charging for cars, then electric cars will gain traction.

If you Googled things before posting everything in your head you'd have discovered that wireless EV charging has been a thing for 20 years now. It has however always suffered from too many issues to ever gain traction although that might change in the coming years.

That said, it's hardly a make it or break it situation for any EV buyer out there - nobody (well, except you apparently) seems to think that the 3 seconds it takes to plug in a cord once a day is a massive inconvenience.

I also think the automakers supporting the hydrogen movement are on to something.

I won't predict a time line, but when hydrogen does take off

Without the infrastructure Hydrogen is never going "take off". Ever.

Propane vehicles are pretty much a thing of the past now because of lack of infrastructure. It's VERY hard to find propane filling stations equipped to fill vehicles anymore and things like road trips are out of the question unless you have dual fuel capability.

Natural Gas vehicles equally failed to take off because of lack of infrastructure. When was the last time you saw a natural gas filling station for cars? Yeah, never. You can fill up at home but again without dual fuel...range anxiety. I know how big of a deal that is to you, right?

So until somehow magically hydrogen filling infrastructure somehow becomes commonplace so that road trips beyond a few hundred kilometers are possible without needing a tow truck to get home (Gasp, that dreaded range anxiety you get so freaked out about again!), hydrogen cars are never going to take off. Ever.

Electricity however...well, that's available everywhere. There's almost 16,000 public EV charging stations all across the USA. There's a grand total of 34 hydrogen filling stations in the USA, all limited to only California.

Electricity infrastructure is more widespread than any other potential fuel source on the face of the planet, it's dirt cheap compared to gas.

Right now Hydrogen also costs twice as much as gas on a per mile basis, and natural gas is consumed to make it (releasing a crap ton of CO2 in the process) so there's that as well.

Hydrogen is interesting, don't get me wrong, but unless you can convince investors to spend several million dollars on enough filling stations to reach critical mass so that owning one (without that range anxiety thing) is realistic, well...not gonna happen.

 

[mimico_polak]

And to think this was such a great thread until the pissing match started about electric...hybrid...hydrogen...gas....

Everyone drive whatever the hell you want to drive....whatever not even worth it.

@PP I've never seen a propane tank installation that did NOT keep the original gas tank in the vehicle as well. Takes up the trunk, but if you have a RAM 1500 HEMI with a 100L propane tank...you WILL get to Montreal on $20 of gas...my buddy has one and he loves it. Run out of propane? Press switch and presto off you go on regular gas. And it's not difficult to find a propane tank filling station.

The reason it's not more popular is because the price of the conversion / install isn't worth it with our gas prices. Go to Europe and it was all the rage when prices were 3x what we pay. Now they've got beautiful diesel fuel and the mileage is great. I had a diesel BMW 118i when I was there and it was awesome. 200kph on the highway and I barely hit 6L/100km on the consumption. Once I reduced to 120-150kph I was down to 3l/100km.

Frankly I'd prefer more diesel options instead of hybrid/electric vehicles...but we don't have it...so I'll shop the Volt when my car dies.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Prius hybrid starts at $21 thousand brand new.

By the way, still waiting for some links to the $21,000 Prius.

Hint: MSRP starts at $27,000 for a bare bones model. The midrange package starts at $29,800. The "touring" model starts at over $30,000.

Now, comparing apples to apples (I'm still not sure what the heck you were trying to compare earlier, apples to oranges it seemed), the Volt LT comes in at $26,500 ($500 less than the Prius base, but with more features) and the LTZ which is the top model is pretty much on $ par with the Prius touring model.

 

[Brian P]

The cheap price may be the Prius C (a.k.a. Yaris but with the hybrid system and uglier) but I can't be bothered. Too awful.

 

[PrivatePilot]

And to think this was such a great thread until the pissing match started about electric...hybrid...hydrogen...gas....

I agree, but it seems that a certain someone keeps popping into the thread full of false preconceived notions and completely non-factual information.

It's hard to let that crap slide and yes, it does yank the thread off topic.

So, getting back on topic, we filled up the Volt tonight. For those still interested in the real world facts:

Total distance travelled, 1286KM, 33.7L - that comes out to 2.63L/100KM

Compared to the ~12L/100KM the old 300 was burning (which would have been around 156L burned vs 33L), that constitutes a 123L saving. At the current ~$1.20/L for gas we saved just under $150 over this tank of gas....and we are only in our third week of ownership.

The cheap price may be the Prius C (a.k.a. Yaris but with the hybrid system and uglier) but I can't be bothered. Too awful.

Yes, that is indeed comparing apples to oranges then.

 

[SunnY S]

By the way, still waiting for some links to the $21,000 Prius.

.

https://www.toyota.ca/toyota/en/

click on the Hybrid section.


click on "Prius C" hybrid. starts at $21.975 canadian.



You're welcome.

 

[Brian P]

Yeah, thought so. In other news, a Chevy Spark is cheaper and more economical than a Corvette.

 

[mxs]

Waiting for a plug 'n play? Ya I get that. I rather fancy an E Lotus Super Seven. Current offerings smack of throwing in the white towel.

Something like that ... LOL ... if I was driving serious miles per month, I'd be already in one of the offerings, like Volt, just to save on gas. But since I am not, I can keep the play part going a bit longer and hopefully by then, plug 'n play is available.

 

[mxs]

Yeah, thought so. In other news, a Chevy Spark is cheaper and more economical than a Corvette.

That is the problem with these offerings, they are economical, but also extremely bad looking and handling cars with not whole lot of nice interior comfort. Plenty of people will argue they get you from A to B ... but if I want more than just that?? I guess the proof that they are not very attractive, even at those prices, is how many they actually sell.

 

[mxs]

Total distance travelled, 1286KM, 33.7L - that comes out to 2.63L/100KM

Compared to the ~12L/100KM the old 300 was burning (which would have been around 156L burned vs 33L), that constitutes a 123L saving. At the current ~$1.20/L for gas we saved just under $150 over this tank of gas....and we are only in our third week of ownership.

Just a correction ... the savings are per your trip of 1286km ... not per tank, agreed?

But, regardless, it makes perfect sense in your case to be in a such vehicle. Really no-brainer.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Just a correction ... the savings are per your trip of 1286km ... not per tank, agreed?

The car did actually travel 1286 km between visits to the gas station – about 550 km would have been the whole tank (33.79L out of a 35L tank) of gas, with the remainder 700+ kilometres being done on electric.

So, yes, that is "per tank" in the end.

But, regardless, it makes perfect sense in your case to be in a such vehicle. Really no-brainer.

Indeed, it is working out exactly as we anticipated so far. Once my wife gets set up with charging at work I expect that distance to stretch to somewhere north of 2000km between 30L fill ups.

 

[Neil_V]

How does that fit with your ranking of the Volt as number one amongst hybrids as you said earlier?

You mean this?

of the eco options I dislike the volt the least. Seems quality.

Big leap to infer your above statement with what I actually said. What I like or dislike (my personal preference) has no bearing on what would ultimately be more reliable, which was what was being discussed, I thought... Anyway, I'd by a volt if I gave a damn about gas mileage; I'd buy a Camry hybrid if I gave a damn about bulletproof reliability. That doesn't mean the volt is unreliable, nor did I say as much. Context man. Anyway, I give a damn about non of the above, currently average 12L/100km, and love it, so i'll just stay outta this lol

 

[PrivatePilot]

Fair enough.

My Magnum averages about 14L/100K at best in mixed driving. In the winter, closer to 16-18. Best I ever got was 10.5 on an all-highway tank, with a tailwind. Average highway is about 12.

I do like the power and the car in general, but after going nearly 1300KM on 32L of gas in the Volt I must say that seeing my car now only scratch out maybe 450KM on its 60+L tank just takes on a whole new perspective. I actually sat in it at Costco after filling up a few days ago, looked at the "estimated range" display and did a double take when I saw only "455K".

Like I said, inside a few years I see us upgrading my wife to something like a used Bolt (assuming they achieve the same excellent reliability the Volt has enjoyed) and I'll inherit the Volt. It's still perky enough in sport mode to squawk the tires if I'm feeling spirited, but the savings would be huge for me as well.

 

[Snobike Mike]

My Biturbo did 7.7L/100km on a recent long trip and that still included a number of braaaaap's through the gears. While definitely not EV territory, it's pretty good for what's under the hood.

 

[fastar1]

You mean this?



Big leap to infer your above statement with what I actually said. What I like or dislike (my personal preference) has no bearing on what would ultimately be more reliable, which was what was being discussed, I thought... Anyway, I'd by a volt if I gave a damn about gas mileage; I'd buy a Camry hybrid if I gave a damn about bulletproof reliability. That doesn't mean the volt is unreliable, nor did I say as much. Context man. Anyway, I give a damn about non of the above, currently average 12L/100km, and love it, so i'll just stay outta this lol

I didn't infer anything. There was no context as you didn't reply to anyone in particular and previous posts covered a variety of issues, not just reliability. If you meant it in a certain unstated context that's one thing, but blame yourself, don't blame those who read it exactly as you wrote it. Here is what you actually said:

"of the eco options I dislike the volt the least"
And
"a prius or camery hybrid is currently a better choice imho"

Combined, these mean you dislike the better choice more than the worse choice!

So now you're saying the second statement was strictly in the context of reliability. That removes the contradiction, great. But it adds a different problem because now it means that you're recommending the "better choice" based solely on their reliability, as if that was anyone's only criteria for selection.

Since you insist on making every nonsense thing you say someone else's fault, I expect more finger pointing and and deeper hole digging in your reply. You certainly would never admit your that own confusion about the merits of hybrids based on your resentment of GW theory, especially as you pride yourself in being a car buff, pushed you to say nonsense.

P.S. If you want to insult me maybe take it to PM next time so I'm not forced to defend myself publicly and mess up a useful thread.

 

[slowbird]

That is the problem with these offerings, they are economical, but also extremely bad looking and handling cars with not whole lot of nice interior comfort. Plenty of people will argue they get you from A to B ... but if I want more than just that?? I guess the proof that they are not very attractive, even at those prices, is how many they actually sell.

I agree entirely. The Ecobox offerings aren't all that interesting IMO.

Back in '13 I was looking for a new car and wanted something economical but still fun to me. My brother was getting a new Kia Rio (and his wife already had one) and suggested I try one out. So I did...I grabbed a rental. Drove it for a few days. I thought it was a nice car it wasn't for me. Not a lot of torque. Buzzy motor. Vague steering. Didn't make me happy.
I looked into a Chevy Sonic RS with the 1.3L Turbo but it was gutless and overpriced.
I ended up going for a Fiat 500 Abarth. It was fun, had some pull, and had the looks and exhaust tone to match. I was averaging 7L/100kms and the best I ever got was 6L/100kms...and according to the other local Abarth owners I was getting exceptionally good mileage.
Anyways, the Abarth was a maintenance nightmare and suffered from soooooooo many problems it became super unreliable. I had to get rid of it. (not to mention the ride shook you to pieces)

Fast forward to when this thread started and my Insurance renewal skyrocketed. I am looking for a car that will save me money, not be an eye-sore for me to look at, ride well, be nice on the inside, and not be a slouch on the acceleration when needed. I looked into the Volt and it made sense for me. My work commute is easily within the EV range and if I need to go further it has the range extending ICE. On top of that my insurance gives a discount for EV vehicles.

I miss having a roaring big displacement engine a bit but being able to rocket off the light silently with just a faint mechanical hummm is pretty fun too.

...currently average 12L/100km, and love it, so i'll just stay outta this lol

Lucky. I was in the same position as you for the past 3 years with my G37. Enjoy it I really mean it. If my financial situation hadn't changed I would still be like you. Happily thrusting away on a mountain of Horsepower and fuel efficiency be damned! lol

 

[slowbird]

My Biturbo did 7.7L/100km on a recent long trip and that still included a number of braaaaap's through the gears. While definitely not EV territory, it's pretty good for what's under the hood.

That's amazing. I got 7L/100kms once in my G37 and that was a long cruise in the middle of nowhere with the cruise set to 90 and no stops. It was hypermiling at its finest. lol

 

[GreyGhost]

My Biturbo did 7.7L/100km on a recent long trip and that still included a number of braaaaap's through the gears. While definitely not EV territory, it's pretty good for what's under the hood.

Not bad. Even without going down the hybrid route, it is amazing how much power they are squeezing out of cars these days while at the same time providing economical cruise consumption.

The worst fuel mileage I can get with my car is ~11L/100 (1 km trip from cold), best is just about 5L/100 (hwy 7 run to Ottawa), typical tanks are 6L/100. That is much worse than the last TDI (worst tank ever was 6.5L/100, best tank was 4.4L/100 and a typical tank was <5.5L/100) but they upped the hp by 75% in the new car.

My driving pattern has changed recently so a car like the Volt would be a great fit but I try to keep my daily drivers for 10 years (I hate car shopping). Hopefully when I am ready for the next one, there will be a PIEV that I can live with. Keep the fire breathing rides as toy cars where you don't care at all about fuel consumption.

 

[eljay]

I would by a Volt if it was not a Chev... I have plug in at work and solar at home. Just waiting for a non-GM competitor in the price range to come out.

 

[GreyGhost]

I would by a Volt if it was not a Chev... I have plug in at work and solar at home. Just waiting for a non-GM competitor in the price range to come out.

E-golf is in the price range in canada. 200km rated range. No ICE though. I'd probably keep waiting.