Amazon ceasing operations in Quebec

jc100 said:
That’s not my experience. My union has made working conditions better. Without it it would probably be a mess. Absolutely no one is in this union to get rich, mostly as all the positions are voluntary. The “pay” is a slightly reduced workload for some as union duties are counted towards that. I didn’t even get that though. I felt like paying a bit back.

They lobby for what’s included in your medical plans etc so we get a say in that. They make sure that bargaining is fair, I haven’t seen any outrageous demands from the union side, just pushback on things that would add extra unpaid work etc.

No one calls me comrade, no one wears a Che Guevara beret handing out hammer and sickle branded mugs, no one makes you say “person-hole cover” and I don’t own any rainbow coloured things. The reality is quite boring compared to what may be portrayed by companies that are anti-union. Until bargaining time we just get a monthly news-letter reminding us to use the grants or the free tuition for family members or whatever else the union lobbied for and gained that makes the workplace much better for all.
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It may not be every union but at a previous job, there was a union office nearby. Think Painters Local #234, not an employer. The boss had a Turbo S and RS4 and worked one day a week. Very few unions are truly contained within an employer. Most push money up to a bunch of useless greedy bastards.
 
PrivatePilot said:
Some of you have never worked a zero skill / low skill manual labour job, and it shows.

Some of you haven’t had to search for a job in while either. Especially in zero/low skill jobs.

It’s easy to get a skewed view on the realities of others when you have never been in their shoes, or don’t have friends wearing those shoes. When you sit down over dinner with a friend in those shoes and hear how hard they’re struggling and what’s happening to them despite trying their best sometimes and how disheartening that is for them, you may have a change of heart on how you feel about this whole picture.

It’s disheartening to see the attitude of others that nobody should deserve respect or equity and fairness in the workplace. “Just quit and go get another job” shouldn’t be the default answer. Just letting ****** employers continue to be ****** employers is also not the answer.
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I have worked in factories (non-union and union), machine shop (non-union), construction (union shop), and professional offices (non-union). Close friends have worked in union factories. Family members have been at the table during negotiation/arbitration for union contracts. With very few exceptions, the unions were a cancer. The days are long gone where you can count on someone/something else to keep you safe. If you don't like where you are, make changes. I've lived in rooming houses, I've had $20 a week for food and entertainment and at times I've worked 90+ hour weeks for more than a year and lived in five cities to be near employment. I will admit, I had some advantages. Almost every job I got was through an introduction by an acquaintance and English is my native language. Jumping isn't as easy for others but too many people say they can't or rely on others to protect them and ime that doesn't work out for many of them.

Unions are not the only solution to the crap employer situation. Especially now with any person having a voice that can reach everybody and websites like glassdoor that allow you do to that easily and anonymously. There are very few jobs where a good employee has few alternatives. Sure, many will require moving but sometimes that's what has to happen.
 
Unions can mean the difference between potentially not having to uproot a family, move kids out of school, sell a home, pack up all your belongings and run away-and the opposite.


GreyGhost said:
I have worked in factories (non-union and union), machine shop (non-union), construction (union shop), and professional offices (non-union). Close friends have worked in union factories. Family members have been at the table during negotiation/arbitration for union contracts. With very few exceptions, the unions were a cancer. The days are long gone where you can count on someone/something else to keep you safe. If you don't like where you are, make changes. I've lived in rooming houses, I've had $20 a week for food and entertainment and at times I've worked 90+ hour weeks for more than a year and lived in five cities to be near employment. I will admit, I had some advantages. Almost every job I got was through an introduction by an acquaintance and English is my native language. Jumping isn't as easy for others but too many people say they can't or rely on others to protect them and ime that doesn't work out for many of them.

Unions are not the only solution to the crap employer situation. Especially now with any person having a voice that can reach everybody and websites like glassdoor that allow you do to that easily and anonymously. There are very few jobs where a good employee has few alternatives. Sure, many will require moving but sometimes that's what has to happen.
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jc100 said:
Unions can mean the difference between potentially not having to uproot a family, move kids out of school, sell a home, pack up all your belongings and run away-and the opposite.
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They can also mean an entire slug of people become unemployed at the same time when they kill the host. Not only does that mean you need to move or change careers, it also means you are competing against many similarly qualified candidates that got turfed at the same time.

As a fun thought experiment, although your union fees are low, calculate what you have paid over the years. You could have hired your own lawyer that was working for you and had lots left over. When the union pays, they are representing union interests first and you are the pawn.
 
jc100 said:
Unions can mean the difference between potentially not having to uproot a family, move kids out of school, sell a home, pack up all your belongings and run away-and the opposite.
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Unless your employment contract specifically states that the employer has the right to relocate you, they can't just make you get up and relocate to another office.
 
Relax said:
Unless your employment contract specifically states that the employer has the right to relocate you, they can't just make you get up and relocate to another office.
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I think he meant that the union protection allowed him to stay in place. Given his line of work, an alternate employer for the same job would normally require relocation as many locations are an hour between similar employers.
 
sburns said:
But don't they have to store that stuff someplace before it get's delivered?
CP to the rescue! :ROFLMAO:
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They can put warehouses anywhere. Logistics companies are pretty good these days, the only difference wi what used to be same or next day in QC is now the next or the following day.

As for the union stuff, that's a chilling message for unions looking at hijacking a company's workforce.
 
Amazon will be difficult to unionize.. It has contingency plans in place to prevent it.. similar to what you're seeing happen in Quebec.
Amazon has empty warehouses ready to go.. companies that are ready and willing to take over portions of its operations if necessary.. etc.
 
And many companies will be happy to pay out constructive dismissal where the lawyers get in on it . They wanted employee X gone for a reason , it’s usually a long game .
I’m sure unions must do some good , I’ve mostly witnessed the down side . Silly stuff like a union mandated health and safety committee, that deems the keurig coffee machine in the lunch room was not sourced through procurement and posses a health risk , so staff go back to travelling five floors and lining up at Tim’s , which takes longer than the fifteen mins they have . True story , Oakville Hospital paediatric dept. Wife was a manager there . But for the several hundred bucks a yr in dues , she often got calendar or a key fob .


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crankcall said:
And many companies will be happy to pay out constructive dismissal where the lawyers get in on it . They wanted employee X gone for a reason , it’s usually a long game .
I’m sure unions must do some good , I’ve mostly witnessed the down side . Silly stuff like a union mandated health and safety committee, that deems the keurig coffee machine in the lunch room was not sourced through procurement and posses a health risk , so staff go back to travelling five floors and lining up at Tim’s , which takes longer than the fifteen mins they have . True story , Oakville Hospital paediatric dept. Wife was a manager there . But for the several hundred bucks a yr in dues , she often got calendar or a key fob .


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With us the seemingly silly rules like that are part of compliance with insurance rules. Same with compulsory training/courses which are mandated by the organization rather than the union.

Perhaps I just have a good union. I’m perfectly fine admitting that they are not necessarily all like that.

As for paying the fees and that being equivalent to lawyers fees over the years. It’s part of the job, it’s deducted at source. Not one person I know grumbles about that union fee being taken from their pay.
 
Saw a supervisor at CP ask an employee to move a hand cart across the depot, maybe 100ft. I mean, a legit hand cart. It was empty with no moving parts, did not require safety shoes or training to operate. Said employee was busy surfing instagram, looked up at the cart said 'no, not my responsibility' and went back to her phone.

Yeah unions are wonderful.
 
In my line of work, union does a lot of good, but also a lot of nothing.

Have seen useless guys get kicked off the job, only to be back within 24h and giving the middle finger to the foreman because they can.

I've seen union reps ignoring safety violations (think 100ft up without a tie off) because 'F-U it's how we do' type of attitude. Glad I knew the guy's wife and just told him 'how do you think your wife will feel when I tell her you're 100ft up with no tie off and she's 8 months pregnant? Should I call her now or tell her when we see you this weekend?'

And I've seen them bow down to the contractor staff because they know who pays the bills. Site Super says 'this is what I want', and the union will fold to give it to him because they know it's easier than fighting back.

Don't get me started on the young guys with their 'I don't get out of bed for less than 150k/year' attitude...sure bud. Your dad's the union steward so you can think that all you want.

There's pluses and minuses to the union. I've seen both...but a whole lot more of the bad than the good.

Let's not forget that they'll put people in a union, and put them to the front of the line for a job if the supers grease the right palms with a few cash deposits...happens ALL the time.

Have also seen guys bring up safety violations / concerns and the next day the union pulls them from the site for 'troublemaking'...
 
So, who owns the warehouses? It could be a good deal for them to rent them out to the new operators. Rates get re-shuffled.

1700 people get laid off with severances and get hired by the new operators. Back to work but probably less security IE contract work.

Amazon doesn't want to lose the PQ market but don't want union flames to spread either.

Based on a 40 hour week it's $10,000 per employee per year X 1700, that's a lot of millions, every year against a one-time cost.
 
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