‘Check engine’ light on? Expect to fail new Drive Clean test

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AGAVE's mostly correct. The only issue I have with his post is that diesels have got a lot cleaner over the last couple of decades, so they can pass some pretty stringent Euro emission standards. IIRC, there are some out there that'll pass California standards or they will be coming out and you know how things are in California.. You get carbon-taxed if you pass gas and light it on fire.
 
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FiReSTaRT said:
AGAVE's mostly correct. The only issue I have with his post is that diesels have got a lot cleaner over the last couple of decades, so they can pass some pretty stringent Euro emission standards. IIRC, there are some out there that'll pass California standards or they will be coming out and you know how things are in California.. You get carbon-taxed if you pass gas and light it on fire.
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Although diesels have gotten a lot cleaner, some of it is a game. They figured out how to make the particles smaller so now they aren't visible. The particles get deeper in your lungs and are bad for you, but you can hold a white shirt in front of the exhaust and it looks clean.
It will be interesting to see how many VW's can pass this stupid test as most seem to like their check engine light on. Mines been on and off (mostly on) for various reasons for the past 200,000 km. The only time there is smoke is on cold start and this has nothing to do with any of the codes.
 
^^ In Europe, everyone runs a Diesel car, Their population by latest number is 791 million people in size of Ontario. Its funny how even the latest clean diesels are banned in North America simply because their testing requirements are different. If you believe for one second that this is for your health benefit, give your head a shake. Its nothing more than American protectionism and politics. They ban small diesel engines and yet their monstrous SUVs come with 7.3L, 6.0L, V8s diesels and thats perfectly okay? Their entire transportation network is comprised of individual trucks carrying loads across the entire nation, and they are ALL diesels....24/7/365 there are millions of transport semi's criss-crossing the continent because US decided to kill its rail road industry. Just ask yourself what kind of emmissions requirements THOSE trucks have....oh yea, NONE!

Nooooo, a 2L diesel engine that burns 5L/100km is bad for you mmmkay, what? that 7L V8 gasoline? burns 25L/100km? Suuuure thats perfectly healthy for the econ......i mean, you, YOU! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Penny wise, pound foolish.
 
Red_Liner740 said:
^^ In Europe, everyone runs a Diesel car, Their population by latest number is 791 million people in size of Ontario. Its funny how even the latest clean diesels are banned in North America simply because their testing requirements are different. If you believe for one second that this is for your health benefit, give your head a shake. Its nothing more than American protectionism and politics. They ban small diesel engines and yet their monstrous SUVs come with 7.3L, 6.0L, V8s diesels and thats perfectly okay? Their entire transportation network is comprised of individual trucks carrying loads across the entire nation, and they are ALL diesels....24/7/365 there are millions of transport semi's criss-crossing the continent because US decided to kill its rail road industry. Just ask yourself what kind of emmissions requirements THOSE trucks have....oh yea, NONE!

Nooooo, a 2L diesel engine that burns 5L/100km is bad for you mmmkay, what? that 7L V8 gasoline? burns 25L/100km? Suuuure thats perfectly healthy for the econ......i mean, you, YOU! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Penny wise, pound foolish.
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lol... good post,
 
Red_Liner740 said:
^^ In Europe, everyone runs a Diesel car, Their population by latest number is 791 million people in size of Ontario. Its funny how even the latest clean diesels are banned in North America simply because their testing requirements are different. If you believe for one second that this is for your health benefit, give your head a shake. Its nothing more than American protectionism and politics. They ban small diesel engines and yet their monstrous SUVs come with 7.3L, 6.0L, V8s diesels and thats perfectly okay? Their entire transportation network is comprised of individual trucks carrying loads across the entire nation, and they are ALL diesels....24/7/365 there are millions of transport semi's criss-crossing the continent because US decided to kill its rail road industry. Just ask yourself what kind of emmissions requirements THOSE trucks have....oh yea, NONE!

Nooooo, a 2L diesel engine that burns 5L/100km is bad for you mmmkay, what? that 7L V8 gasoline? burns 25L/100km? Suuuure thats perfectly healthy for the econ......i mean, you, YOU! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Penny wise, pound foolish.
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There is simply not enough diesel for everyone in North America. In Europe, they are much smarter and transport all large equipment/cargo using railways (electrical engines mostly). Since diesel is just another by-product from oil, there is a lot of diesel left for passenger cars.
In North America, all this diesel goes to 18-wheelers, and there is not much left to regular cars. US/Canadian government made a huge mistake when they switched from railway cargo transporting to trucks, and they're still paying for that mistake big time.
 
ViperZ said:
There is simply not enough diesel for everyone in North America. In Europe, they are much smarter and transport all large equipment/cargo using railways (electrical engines mostly). Since diesel is just another by-product from oil, there is a lot of diesel left for passenger cars.
In North America, all this diesel goes to 18-wheelers, and there is not much left to regular cars. US/Canadian government made a huge mistake when they switched from railway cargo transporting to trucks, and they're still paying for that mistake big time.
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Its simple....every time government gets involved they **** it up. Supply and demand. Dont force me to drive gasoline vehicles, let me have a choice. If there is a huge influx of diesel cars creating a higher demand for diesel, the price will go up while price of gasoline goes down. This will deter some from diesel until a balance has been achieved. Markets tend to regulate themselves pretty good without government intervention.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBnlXGvA1Wk

Red_Liner740 said:
^^ In Europe, everyone runs a Diesel car, Their population by latest number is 791 million people in size of Ontario. Its funny how even the latest clean diesels are banned in North America simply because their testing requirements are different. If you believe for one second that this is for your health benefit, give your head a shake. Its nothing more than American protectionism and politics. They ban small diesel engines and yet their monstrous SUVs come with 7.3L, 6.0L, V8s diesels and thats perfectly okay? Their entire transportation network is comprised of individual trucks carrying loads across the entire nation, and they are ALL diesels....24/7/365 there are millions of transport semi's criss-crossing the continent because US decided to kill its rail road industry. Just ask yourself what kind of emmissions requirements THOSE trucks have....oh yea, NONE!

Nooooo, a 2L diesel engine that burns 5L/100km is bad for you mmmkay, what? that 7L V8 gasoline? burns 25L/100km? Suuuure thats perfectly healthy for the econ......i mean, you, YOU! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Penny wise, pound foolish.
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malim said:
For $20, everyone should invest into OBDII bluetooth reader.
Resetting the code by disconnecting the battery is not a good idea, since you will automatically fail because the drive cycle tests will display incomplete even though you won't have the Check Engine Light ON.

Brian P, you are incorrect on the codes being stored in memory. The codes themselves are not stored, when you reset they are clear from the memory and no OBD reader will be able to pull the codes that have been reset. Over a certain distance, the sensor will trigger the code again. However you are correct on the readiness test which will be "INCOMPLETE" that results in automatic failure on the emission test.

So let's say you have an EVAP leak which is one of the most common trouble codes, so as soon as you reset the ECU using the OBD reader or disconnecting the battery, the code cannot be retrieved that same moment. Code will come back in a bit of driving. If you believe otherwise, I would be very interested to see this.
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Wow I thought those wireless readers were a gimmick, but I just got a wifi one and it does everything expensive ones do. It shows codes and sensor ready state. With the right app you also get really nice fuel monitoring.

If you have an iPhone get the WIFI one. BT won't work unless its jailbroken and you can install roqybt.

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GreyGhost said:
Although diesels have gotten a lot cleaner, some of it is a game. They figured out how to make the particles smaller so now they aren't visible. The particles get deeper in your lungs and are bad for you, but you can hold a white shirt in front of the exhaust and it looks clean.
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Diesel particulate filters burn off the particulates - they don't just make them smaller.

Gasoline engines emit greater numbers of sub-micron-sized particles than DPF-equipped diesel engines (by orders of magnitude). The new high-efficiency direct-injection gasoline engines are even worse. There is some discussion of regulating particle numbers rather than particle mass - but the proposed regulatory thresholds are an order of magnitude below what current spark-ignition GDI engines emit and are below the average particulate emissions from port-injected gasoline engines. Diesels with DPF are well within what's proposed. Gasoline engines would probably require particulate filters in order to pass the proposed regulations.

GDI engines today emit particulates that are above the upcoming Euro 6 limits, but have been granted a temporary waiver in Europe because a gasoline-engine particulate filter has not been developed. It has also been recognized that the very light engine loads that are typical of the "official test procedure" are quite another matter from how vehicles are actually driven. Gasoline engines can emit greater particulate numbers than even NON-DPF-equipped diesel engines under some conditions.

Wipe your finger inside the tailpipe of practically any gasoline-engine vehicle that is not brand new. It's black. That's particulate matter ...
 
I really want a diesel SUV. This is bull. Friend of mine with diesel 4runner gets under <10l/100km. He bitches when he gets close to 10l with his big tires.

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GreyGhost said:
Although diesels have gotten a lot cleaner, some of it is a game. They figured out how to make the particles smaller so now they aren't visible. The particles get deeper in your lungs and are bad for you, but you can hold a white shirt in front of the exhaust and it looks clean.
It will be interesting to see how many VW's can pass this stupid test as most seem to like their check engine light on. Mines been on and off (mostly on) for various reasons for the past 200,000 km. The only time there is smoke is on cold start and this has nothing to do with any of the codes.
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Sorry, but this post is hilarious .... I am off to the basement to get my oxygen mask, because I need to drive my TDI tomorrow morning and I sure want to be around for few decades and not choking off on my expensive diesel producing particulates.

Seriously, somebody should publish a book full of posts from this site ....
 
mxs said:
Sorry, but this post is hilarious .... I am off to the basement to get my oxygen mask, because I need to drive my TDI tomorrow morning and I sure want to be around for few decades and not choking off on my expensive diesel producing particulates.

Seriously, somebody should publish a book full of posts from this site ....
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I can't find the article I read before on the particle size reduction in TDI's. As brian is normally right, I am guessing the author of the article was wrong.

Here is some research with heavy truck engines from the early 90's that shows particle sizes dropping by a factor of 10. It obviously isn't what I read before, but it shows that pushing particle sizes around is possible. If government standards required monitoring of certain size particles, it might be possible to get around them.

http://courses.washington.edu/cive494/DieselParticleSize.pdf
 
Early 1990s pre-dated modern diesel particulate filters. Any research based on pre-2007 model year diesel vehicles is obsolete. Diesel with DPF is a WHOLE different ball game. In an urban environment, it's possible for the exhaust from a DPF-equipped diesel engine to contain less total PM than the ambient air (i.e. the running diesel-with-DPF engine is REMOVING net PM from the ambient air) ...
 
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