Hydro bill

If you read the fine print, they say it's the cost of delivery to you, ie. Infrastructure, maintenance.
 
If that pisses you off, do you know about the debt retirement charge?
 
Basically OPG gets 30.52 for making the power, Hydro One gets 26.56 for getting it to you and IESO gets 1.79 for deciding how far you have to bend over.
 
RockerGuy said:
If you read the fine print, they say it's the cost of delivery to you, ie. Infrastructure, maintenance.
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Living in a condo, I'm charged the same ~$25 delivery charge for electricity and ~$13 for water. (PowerStream)
Multiply that by the number of units in the building.

They're making big bucks off Condo/apartment owners vs detached/semi-detached owners....

Makes me feel like I need to use more electricity and water to balance out the bill so that ~45% of what I'm paying isn't just for "delivery".
 
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And the sunshine list gets longer and longer and longer.
 
That seems great my delivery charge is down to $80 now used to be in the $250 range. I would love to see some of those low delivery charges.

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LiNK666 said:
I don't get it... my hydro usage cost is $30.52 + delivery charge of $26.56 + $1.79 regulatory charge.

Why is delivery charge so high...?
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Compared to what? $30.52 portion or other hydro companies delivery charges?
 
LiNK666 said:
Debt retirement charge is $0



$30.52. we try to be conservative with our usage. I hate this regulated Monopoly they have
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Used to be more. Did Wynne lower it coming elections?
 
LiNK666 said:
Debt retirement charge is $0



$30.52. we try to be conservative with our usage. I hate this regulated Monopoly they have
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Monopoly of sorts it is, not much you can do about that. the way I look at the delivery charge is a sort of way for them to always make money, regardless how much kWh you use .... the less kWh the more they will hike the delivery charge to keep the hydro companies afloat (they hide the service charge in it, but they can play with it). Similar to everyone using less water nowadays, but somehow they need to keep the pipes free of issues and need admin as well, which the liter rate doesn't cover anymore ....

In another words, we will more-less pay always the same whether we use less or more ....
 
Wingboy said:
And the sunshine list gets longer and longer and longer.
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Haha, no, it shrunk hugely. By privatizing hydro, all of those people dropped off the list (salaries aren't different, they just disappeared from public scrutiny). I am waiting for the government press release where they brag about reducing the list more than any previous government.
 
There's an election coming up.

What's Patrick Brown's plan to fix this mess?

Harris & Eves' half-assed privatization of Ontario Hydro and the resulting stranded debt, the mess of generation and distribution entities all looking for their slice of the pie, combined with decades -- literally generations -- of undercharging consumers for the the true cost of making and distributing electricity have put us where we are. Wynne's just made it that much worse over her reign of error.

Everyone wants reliable electricity at their outlets and don't want to pay for it. How will Brown deliver on that promise?
 
I don't mind paying a true cost, quality consistent service isn't cheap.

I have trouble with HydroOne, advertising at Rogers Centre on big expensive signage. Will they keep me from signing on with a different electric provider??? And sponsoring yacht racing??? The hydro sponsorship of the CanadaCup left even me speechless , and i was in it. The money floating out the windows of Ontario Hydro and now HydroOne is obscene.
 
If you think our electricity is expensive here, be glad you don't live in California or NYC. Both are around 28c/kwh. Even when you roll the separated costs of the actual electricity and delivery fees we pay here, we're still cheap comparatively - there's LOTS of other places in the world that pay many, many times what we pay. Denmark is 41c/kwh, and Australia overtook them at 47c/kwh.

I hate to sound like an apologist, but I think part of the problem here in Ontario isn't that our electricity is expensive, it's that it was too damn cheap for many decades (what consumers were paying wasn't actually even covering the bill), and now the chickens have come home to roost in the form of all the investment needed to actually bring the system up to par again after years of neglect.

Yes, there were stupid bumps along the road in the form of the bungled TOU meter program (decent idea, terrible rollout and implementation that cost way more $$$ than it should have), ridiculous salaries of many in the energy system, and yes, the overruns in the costs of actually building our nuclear stations back in the 80's and such...but all of that is blame spread across many different governments. The issues couldn't be pushed off any longer, so something had to break - to just continue to pretend there wasn't an issue would be just ignoring the elephant in the room.

It's kind of like how Venezuela subsidized the price of gasoline for their citizens for the last 20 years, making it about 1c/L for premium, and nearly free for regular. It's basically broke the government, and now it's 60c/L for premium, and 10c/L for regular. And yeah, things are not going too well for Venezuela right now in general because the waited until things were actually falling apart to come to the realization that this stupidity couldn't last anymore.
 
I would agree that our rate(s) are not bad when compared to other parts of the world, considering our grid is relatively clean ... the issue is the policies and energy strategy in general which the government has put or not put in place in the last 10 or so years.

I would also say that try to make sense out of Venezuela is not really usable by any stretch of one's imagination. It's just an outlier by a mile in any sort of a comparison.
 
Just because it's not as high as other places doesn't mean that we are in a good position. Wasteful spending and stupid policies by the government also the greed of these hydro companies are hurting us.

There was a power generation company that over billed Ontario because it could get away with it along with many others.
https://www.thestar.com/news/queens...lectricity-system-for-millions-fined-10m.html

I think that delivery fee is a crooked. These guys are making a **** ton of money at our expense.
 
PrivatePilot said:
If you think our electricity is expensive here, be glad you don't live in California or NYC. Both are around 28c/kwh. Even when you roll the separated costs of the actual electricity and delivery fees we pay here, we're still cheap comparatively - there's LOTS of other places in the world that pay many, many times what we pay. Denmark is 41c/kwh, and Australia overtook them at 47c/kwh.

I hate to sound like an apologist, but I think part of the problem here in Ontario isn't that our electricity is expensive, it's that it was too damn cheap for many decades (what consumers were paying wasn't actually even covering the bill), and now the chickens have come home to roost in the form of all the investment needed to actually bring the system up to par again after years of neglect.
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According to the CPUC (California Public Utilities Commission), the average rate in California is $0.16/kWh and doesn't hit above $0.20/kWh unless it's an island ie. Hawaii (page 5).

NYC being aroudn the $0.15-$0.18 range.
http://www.cpuc.ca.gov/uploadedFile...veAnalysisofUtilityServicesRatesinCAFinal.pdf

(This was a study from 2015)



Denmark and Australia seem to need truckloads of lube though. It is kind of pointless to compare prices of a resource from the other side of the planet though... It's like comparing the price of water in Canada vs Africa...

http://reason.com/blog/2017/09/18/in-australia-as-renewable-surge-the-pric
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