Distances are too large, speed will be too slow, cost will be far too high. Now, if carbon tax Carney adds $500 to every plane ticket to save the world, the train looks better. Still close to $1000 a seat though.
Who's gonna tell him?
- Thread starter timtune
- Start date
Don’t be surprised if SNC Lavelin is awarded the contract.
IF...and that's a huge IF they build it...
The following (IMO) should be built:
Quebec City -> Montreal -> Toronto -> London -> Windsor
Depending on how that goes and how the ridership is maintained...
Add:
Ottawa -> Peterborough to the line
Then add:
Sudbury -> Barrie -> King -> Toronto
The system can be built up over time...but keep it growing and don't let it get out of control.
Focus on the main route first, then add to it as time / budget / ridership allows.
Agree 100%. This is where I’d support a government to “invest” in infrastructure. It can be on the premise of eco friendly, moving citizens to and from major cities. Start Toronto/Montreal and expand to rest of country. Electromagnetic high speed train running from Vancouver to Halifax. If the costing could make sense to build, maintain and run it.
sburns
Well-known member
You don't have to look that far, the crosstown in Toronto is exactly like that, and still not running..
Oh and very important…ensure there are as max of ‘buy Canadian’ clauses as possible.
Projects like these are undertaken during hard times in the economy…keeps people, businesses, and the economy as a whole chugging along.
Projects like these are undertaken during hard times in the economy…keeps people, businesses, and the economy as a whole chugging along.
sburns
Well-known member
Hey VIA is still around, anyone here use it? Would it being high speed make any difference?
For a trip from Toronto to Ottawa this Saturday, return Sunday is $310!
4 hours almost the same as the car
When I'm in Europe, Spain, Barcelona to Madrid is about $100 euros ($148 CAD) with return.
It's a tourist fare, but I can't imagine a regular fare is close to $300.
and this is the highspeed train, so the trip is 2 hours.
bring whatever luggage you need.
I don't want to think what highspeed ticket would cost here.
For a trip from Toronto to Ottawa this Saturday, return Sunday is $310!
4 hours almost the same as the car
When I'm in Europe, Spain, Barcelona to Madrid is about $100 euros ($148 CAD) with return.
It's a tourist fare, but I can't imagine a regular fare is close to $300.
and this is the highspeed train, so the trip is 2 hours.
bring whatever luggage you need.
I don't want to think what highspeed ticket would cost here.
Mad Mike
Well-known member
$4B? Read the press release again, that's just the contract to come up with a design and development plan.
I figure this is a grand payout to friends of the regime... the kind of firms that will be will be gracious with advisory roles and directorships worthy of an ex PM. Every company that has part of the $4B design/build contract is based in Quebec or France, none in Ontario.
Who do you suppose those French train companies are going to be spec into the 'build and provision' part of the contract?
Shaman
Well-known member
OK wow... I just did a bit of a dive into this high speed rail:
$4B estimated cost to JUST plan and "develop," then the actual construction can be started - 5 years from now (probably more) and with a total estimated cost of $80B.
Now, ask yourself why I originally posted on this thinking that was the construction cost of the rail, and the planning had been done (hell, I use interactive topographical maps for wireless distribution complete with accurate geological surface data and treeline, why can't they?) but this isn't even that - the Liberals promised this a decade ago and none of the planning has been done!
Holy hell. You know that's at least a $100B project. I can't see it surviving an election change, but that's the thing - this is an $85B bribe.
$4B estimated cost to JUST plan and "develop," then the actual construction can be started - 5 years from now (probably more) and with a total estimated cost of $80B.
Now, ask yourself why I originally posted on this thinking that was the construction cost of the rail, and the planning had been done (hell, I use interactive topographical maps for wireless distribution complete with accurate geological surface data and treeline, why can't they?) but this isn't even that - the Liberals promised this a decade ago and none of the planning has been done!
Holy hell. You know that's at least a $100B project. I can't see it surviving an election change, but that's the thing - this is an $85B bribe.
I’m a just leave this tidbit here…ECLRT was originally approved for about 12B….i think it’s at 13B…
This high speed rail will be 100B as a minimum….
This high speed rail will be 100B as a minimum….
It was publicized at 4.6B, was awarded at 9B and was at 12.8 in 2022. That was literally years ago and we are still many months from the first passenger. The budget in 2018 including 30 years of maintenance was <12B. The cynic in me says West LRT was fired up to bury some expenses and ineptitudes from east. A true cost will likely never be known.
Dirty Frank
Well-known member
One more kick at the graft cat is what it is.
He has the potential to net more dirty money off of this move alone then most if not all the the members that will read this will earn in our entire lives.
A hell of a gig if you can get it.
If only we could try him for treason and have a public hanging. That may help tone down some of the graft in the future.
Maybe the guys selling the pipeline should’ve given a bigger envelope?
Then we’d be building pipelines and not rail that’ll never get finished and be barely utilized.
Forget Cali. There's a subway line in Toronto doing the same thing.
10 billion? They've "budgeted" 3.9 Billion for planning alone. Then they want 5 YEARS of consultation before anything could happen.
It's completely unfeasible, and a downright stupid idea, which isn't really surprising coming from the Peter Pan of Canadian politics. Idiot.
As for the costs, more likely in the 100's of billions, once you account for expropriation of properties, construction of the right-of-way, necessary bridges and impenetrable fencing along the entire length of the line, then the cost of electrification.....I'm not gonna bother going on.
The only option would be to re-build the CPR line that goes through Havelock, double track it and make it a freight line, then buy the CP lakeshore line and use it.
Still a 100 billion dollar +++++++ boondoggle in the making. Imagine the graft and slush that would have to be siphoned off to liberal-friendly (to be fair also PC-friendly) engineering firms, native bands and the useless bureaucracies that would be created and staffed, much like Metrolinx. Nobody seemed to realize the GO Transit was short for Government of Ontario Transit, so they now have 2 oversight bureaucracies. Lunacy.
They're "planning" to use the old CPR right-of-way that goes through Prescott, Havelock, etc. and through Agincourt to Union.
Back in the 90's governments allowed and pretty much encouraged the railways to abandon thousands of miles track as unprofitable or redundant. Very short sighted.
We don't necessarily need high-speed trains, as there is no possible way we can build it for anywhere below astronomical and unfeasible.
In the US, Amtrak gets a government mandated priority over freight trains. VIA gets no such treatment.
For high speed rail, every crossing must be grade separated. There are many locations along lakeshore where I'm not sure that's even possible. Given the speed of the train it's not feasible for the tracks to change elevation significantly which means rhe roads need to go over or under.
Last edited:
