Who owns a SuperSport and goes speed limit

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nm1 said:
Does anyone with a motor-vehicle drive the "speed limit" in Ontario? When limits are set low to accommodate the police and insurance lobby (the people who gain the most from the artificially low speed limits) everyone is a criminal.
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The one chink in the armor of that theory is that since the tougher speeding laws, the number of deaths in street racing has dropped significantly, as have over all road deaths.

However, you have a good point: while younger drivers have more infractions that older drivers, older drivers have more crashes, but pay far less insurance. The system neither encourages safer driving nor rewards it. Speeding bad..weaving across three lanes in a pickup up the 400 while following 3 feet way and sipping a piping hot double-double-ok!

I get it, when I started riding, I wanted a cool racy bike and raced around like a total c*nt, somehow survived, but at some point it clicks that the place to really get excited is on a track. But then you have a problem, you have peers beside you, and this intimidates some 20 somethings when they realize slingshot and wheelie and generally acting like a total c*nt is not actually a skill.

This is why most older riders have no f8cks given on riding slower bikes on roads, and why others only do track days on powerful bikes. The GTA is overcrowded, and it's only going to get worse.
 
CafeRay said:
The one chink in the armor of that theory is that since the tougher speeding laws, the number of deaths in street racing has dropped significantly, as have over all road deaths.
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When the nazis came to power in Germany the crime rate probably went down...was it worth it?

Ridiculous comparison right? Kind of - but it's the same debate.

The HTA 172 comes down to security vs freedom - and we've given up too much and gained too little in my personal opinion...yours may vary.

I actually have no issue with towing and even crushing vehicles that were ACTUALLY RACING...but only after a trial...no roadside impound.
 
TSquared said:
Just wondering how many of you own a 600cc+ bike and only goes speed limit all the time. My friend has a Ninja 300 and complains it too slow, he does 180km/hr + consistently on the highway, while my other friend on his Yamaha R1 I haven't seen ever go past 120km/hr.
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Don't know about you, but the first thing I'd do is to stay away from riding with this friend. He just brings too much heat to the group. You don't want to be "on the system"
 
EC2010 said:
Don't know about you, but the first thing I'd do is to stay away from riding with this friend. He just brings too much heat to the group. You don't want to be "on the system"
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Bingo.
Was out riding early last year with 2 buddies out by Paris. We got pulled over on the 401 in Kitchener, even though we were doing the speed limit by a big Tahoe SUV. Why? Simply 'cause some other group of riders in the same area were being @sshats on the 24, wheelies, stunting etc. Actually had 3 other cruisers stop to assist as backup 'cause of the 911 calls that were made by motorists due to the stunters.
 
nm1 said:
When the nazis came to power in Germany the crime rate probably went down...was it worth it?

Ridiculous comparison right? Kind of - but it's the same debate.

The HTA 172 comes down to security vs freedom - and we've given up too much and gained too little in my personal opinion...yours may vary.
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There's freedom, and what the US refers to as freedumb. We already hit Godwin's law, but there are people in authority that sincerely do care about safety and see these reductions in deaths and injuries as an accomplishment. Dead or crippled is not free. No one is stopping anyone from going as fast as they want on a closed course (but there are a-holes who show up to track days and don't even want to follow some basic rules).

Actions have consequences beyond the rider. I've seen a bike cut a car in half in a high speed T-bone. People talk about deaths as statistics, but a life in a wheelchair costs society millions. This isn't a country where we just throw out people like trash after accidents.

So when people talk about freedom, they really mean do what they want and not take responsibility afterwards. People ranted about helmet laws, ranted about seatbelts, airbags, the next law is likely ABS on bikes and stock pipes, which many will rant about.

Those laws you hate may have saved your life or quality of life. People seem to forget when brat tuner trash was racing around North Toronto mowing down pedestrians and anyone else.
It's one thing to have a performance car designed to stop under control at high speed, another to see an F150 doing 180 in right lanes and an idiot in an out of control car wipes out everyone around them.

I do not agree that speed is the problem. We have an awful driver training and culture in North America, just one day in Europe and you understand this. OPP/Police does little to enforce dangerous driving, but when salaries are pushing $100K, they have to generate their own income and radar guns are a fast cash generator.
 
CafeRay said:
The one chink in the armor of that theory is that since the tougher speeding laws, the number of deaths in street racing has dropped significantly, as have over all road deaths.
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It's been a while since I dug up the government stats, but that number was less than 12 in the decade leading up to 172 (actual racing, not just some goof in traffic). Tougher speeding laws were easy points to score for AG Bryant, a man who clearly coveted the premier's office. You can thank the salt/potholes/leasing for high vehicle turnover and auto engineers for superior tires/braking/suspension/unibodies/airbags for the reduction in accidents and deaths. I would also suspect the "multitasking" that smartphone users engage in lowers the overall speed averages. The GTA's laughable urban planning and chronic traffic management also helps. Less speed, less accidents, less deaths.

I haven't spoken with a single person (outside of this board) that knew what 172 was, even as it was being rolled out, much less the actual consequences. Other than the generalized knowledge that driving like an idiot might get you into trouble, the law probably doesn't have much deterrence. Why do you think "ignorance of the law is no defence" is one of the basic elements of legal proceedings? Yep, because most people are ignorant of it.
 
TO Bandit said:
It was a joke. A variation of the 10 second Civic joke. Sorry if I offended anyone.
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They are trolling you, your joke was funny and anyone offended needs to take the stick out of their a holes
 
CafeRay said:
So when people talk about freedom, they really mean do what they want and not take responsibility afterwards.
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When I talk about freedom - I mean the freedom to have a trial before being punished for my alleged actions...not freedom to escape responsibilities.

Those laws you hate may have saved your life or quality of life. People seem to forget when brat tuner trash was racing around North Toronto mowing down pedestrians and anyone else.
It's one thing to have a performance car designed to stop under control at high speed, another to see an F150 doing 180 in right lanes and an idiot in an out of control car wipes out everyone around them.
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I could draft a law that would save the same amount of lives but not give away freedom...there might be people who care about safety in power right now, but they don't care about establishing good limits to authority in balance with that safety objective.

You're saying "for me, I don't care - things are safer now" - but your apathy could lead to problems when/if a corrupt LEO decides they want the kickback from towing your vehicle.

I think eliminating street racing is a goal we should strive for...but giving the power to seize vehicles and punish people without trial isn't the way to do it.
 
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TO Bandit said:
It was a joke. A variation of the 10 second Civic joke. Sorry if I offended anyone.
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It's okay. You only offended the homosexuals, they're really sensitive in springtime.
 
Flywheel said:
It's been a while since I dug up the government stats, but that number was less than 12 in the decade leading up to 172 (actual racing, not just some goof in traffic). Tougher speeding laws were easy points to score for AG Bryant, a man who clearly coveted the premier's office. You can thank the salt/potholes/leasing for high vehicle turnover and auto engineers for superior tires/braking/suspension/unibodies/airbags for the reduction in accidents and deaths. I would also suspect the "multitasking" that smartphone users engage in lowers the overall speed averages. The GTA's laughable urban planning and chronic traffic management also helps. Less speed, less accidents, less deaths.

I haven't spoken with a single person (outside of this board) that knew what 172 was, even as it was being rolled out, much less the actual consequences. Other than the generalized knowledge that driving like an idiot might get you into trouble, the law probably doesn't have much deterrence. Why do you think "ignorance of the law is no defence" is one of the basic elements of legal proceedings? Yep, because most people are ignorant of it.
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+1.
 
nm1 said:
When I talk about freedom - I mean the freedom to have a trial before being punished for my alleged actions...not freedom to escape responsibilities.



I could draft a law that would save the same amount of lives but not give away freedom...there might be people who care about safety in power right now, but they don't care about establishing good limits to authority in balance with that safety objective.

You're saying "for me, I don't care - things are safer now" - but your apathy could lead to problems when/if a corrupt LEO decides they want the kickback from towing your vehicle.

I think eliminating street racing is a goal we should strive for...but giving the power to seize vehicles and punish people without trial isn't the way to do it.
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+1.
 
CafeRay said:
I do not agree that speed is the problem. We have an awful driver training and culture in North America, just one day in Europe and you understand this.
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Speed amplifies the harmful effects and risks posed of every other kind of driving mistake. If you can't eliminate those driving mistakes, keeping speeds in reasonable territory at least helps to mitigate the worst effect outcomes when things go south.
 
That's what i've been saying.

HTA 172 should be updated. anyone caught speeding should be executed roadside, no trial, no rights at officer's discretion.
just shoot them. make the streets safe. also HWY speeds should be dropped to 80kmh and all non-highway roads should be capped at 50kmh.

this will saves lives people. forget about upgrading the licensing system or encouraging police to do something other than traffic enforcement to pull over the 1 out of ALL speeding cars. also the undercover police cruisers are essential for traffic enforcement,
as simply having a visible police cruiser parked at the side of the road doesn't deter speeding as all drivers can see it and are reminded to slow down, it works in other countries, but here we need hidden cruisers to sneak up and punish single out the one driver.

... retarded. DAMN PRG!
 
LOL ... Amazing thread, would definitely read again and again and again.
 
nm1 said:
Does anyone with a motor-vehicle drive the "speed limit" in Ontario? When limits are set low to accommodate the police and insurance lobby (the people who gain the most from the artificially low speed limits) everyone is a criminal.

A better question would be "if you own a supersport bike - what strategies have you developed to keep the speeds reasonable while you're on public roads?".

My strategy: buy bikes that sound good at slow speeds, v-twins, V4, some triples...a four-banger is just going to make you want to hoon.

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Your buddy with the 300 is going to get in trouble...even if he doesn't crash or get hurt...his bike will certainly go fast enough to get a 172/tow, but it isn't fast enough to get away from the cops, so...I hope he wises up.
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VTwins definitely sound nice, have one right now.

The friend with the 300 is a new rider. He wanted a 600 but couldnt afford insurance. And yeah he needs to get into some trouble agreed! but it won't stop a squid.
 
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